Brexit to be triggered tomorrow - what if the severance deal is a bad one for the UK?

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RockerRocker Frets: 4942
Will you guys be happy to accept that your Government did it's best in that eventuality (of the deal for the UK being a long way short of what is being hoped for) or would you want to vote on acceptance or rejection of the deal? 
Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results. [Albert Einstein]

Nil Satis Nisi Optimum

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  • octatonicoctatonic Frets: 33725
    Depends...
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  • TTonyTTony Frets: 27343
    So, what's this "Brexit" thing all about?  I think I overheard someone talking about it in the pub the other evening.
    Having trouble posting images here?  This might help.
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  • SporkySporky Frets: 27569
    It's basically the same as the Boaty McBoatface thing, only a bigger boat.
    "[Sporky] brings a certain vibe and dignity to the forum."
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  • VimFuegoVimFuego Frets: 15475
    thing is, whatever happens it isn't the final, never to be changed deal. New trade deals get struck all the time, international trade is a fluid thing, things will evolve, they will change over time. Some things will be better, some things worse, but the world goes on. People will adapt to the new reality as it presents itself.

    I'm not locked in here with you, you are locked in here with me.

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  • valevale Frets: 1052

    The survey found that the proportion of people expecting the economy to fare better over the next ten years as a result of Brexit has fallen to 29% from 39% last July.

    Meanwhile, the proportion who think the UK's economic prospects have got worse has risen from 42% to 53%, resulting in a net balance of -24% — down sharply from the -3.5% last July.

    The data also shows that the country's lowest income group has shifted from being the most optimistic about the economic impact of Brexit to the most pessimistic.

    "Whereas opinions on the long-term impact of Brexit were finely balanced in the immediate aftermath of last June’s vote (albeit leaning towards pessimism), a negative view of the economic consequences has become increasingly apparent and widespread.

    "Pessimism has now spread to all age groups and income brackets. Shortly after the referendum, the older generations and the very poorest families were the exceptions in considering Brexit to be beneficial to the long-term health of the economy. However, even these pockets of the population have now become pessimistic.

    "The most marked turnaround is evident among the poorest paid, who have switched from being the most optimistic to now being the most downbeat."

    (findings are based on a representative cross-section of the British population that participate in the monthly Markit Household Finance Index, which is compiled from data from 1,500 respondents collected by polling firm Ipsos MORI)

    http://uk.businessinsider.com/markit-brexit-british-households-increasingly-pessimstic-2017-3

    hofner hussie & hayman harpie. what she said...
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  • exocetexocet Frets: 1948
    There'll be winners and losers. Hopefully the losers won't be the same people who have been on the receiving end of the downside of globalisation. Time will tell.
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  • SambostarSambostar Frets: 8745
    Watched Question Time the other night, none of them have learnt anything, not least the planted left wing audience or David Thimblearse.
    Backdoor Children Of The Sock
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  • mellowsunmellowsun Frets: 2422
    Past caring tbh, hard Brexit is inevitable 
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  • EvilmagsEvilmags Frets: 5158
    If it keeps some of the more persistent Remoaners off TV for a while it would be a good thing. The amusing thing is some of them even think EU countries treat forigners as well as the UK treats EU citizens. Having lived in France and Spain I can assure you it´s bollocks. 
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  • AliGorieAliGorie Frets: 308
    "

    Brexit to be triggered tomorrow - what if the severance deal is a bad one for the UK?"

    Hmm It’s going to be interesting to say the least - watching the imperial masters trying it on with seasoned EU political class who are in the driving seat on this one - and who put them there ? those who are taking back control - ha.
    I think Ulster / unified Ireland and Scotland will figure in this - I suspect the EU will use them as bargaining chips and may even have a mind to destroy the United bit - who'd have thought - surrounded by enemies - again.


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  • CirrusCirrus Frets: 8481
    Evilmags said:
    If it keeps some of the more persistent Remoaners off TV for a while it would be a good thing. The amusing thing is some of them even think EU countries treat forigners as well as the UK treats EU citizens. Having lived in France and Spain I can assure you it´s bollocks. 
    And yet, my friends who have lived and worked in Germany and Italy have got on just fine.

    Maybe continents are too complicated to be understood by anecdotes. To be fair, the only racism I've ever been on the receiving end of has been doled out by Frenchmen.
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  • BudgieBudgie Frets: 2099
    Past caring too. Some of the people have spoken. 
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  • RichardjRichardj Frets: 1538
    It's always interesting to see that any fallout is the fault of the 'remoaners'. I think we are way past that now and the (by 2%) majority that wanted to leave have to take responsibility for all that now happens. It's in the hands of the politicians that they supported to act their behalf. Let's just hope that they knew what they were starting.
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  • BoromedicBoromedic Frets: 4700
    edited March 2017
    Hard Brexit is inevitable, the remaining EU countries have had stability and no huge wars to deal with as a result of this for 70+ years. They don't want us to leave so they are going to give us a rubbish deal, all those who voted exit and are now moaning about this surely should've realised that was the case?? If the shoe was on the other foot you could be damn sure the UK government would do the same, what did you expect? A handshake and a nice afternoon tea with Angela Merkel?

    They should have used the result (and if anyone comes out with the term "clear mandate" on a result with 1.9% difference then may a plague strike down your house) to go back to the EU and negotiate a better deal then see what people felt. As for suddenly being a worldwide trade demon, what exactly do we trade?? Small volume engineering?? Service and banking?? The UK is about to finally hit the realisation that we're now but a bit part like we were centuries ago, cut adrift from the mainland as the EU tears itself apart. I will watch with baited breath from overseas to see the result on the financial markets tomorrow, 

    My head said brake, but my heart cried never.


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  • ClarkyClarky Frets: 3261
    vale said:
    The data also shows that the country's lowest income group has shifted from being the most optimistic about the economic impact of Brexit to the most pessimistic.
    this is pretty funny actually
    play every note as if it were your first
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  • FretwiredFretwired Frets: 24601
    The nay sayers need to get up to speed.

    The EU’s chief negotiator, Michel Barnier, said an “ambitious free-trade agreement between the UK and EU” was possible if the two sides can first reach agreement on the ‘divorce bill’, EU citizens’ rights and Northern Ireland’s border.

    I think there will be a deal that keeps the UK in the free trade area in return for some cash and adherence to EU laws in certain areas. The fact that David Davis says EU immigration will probably rise post Brexit gives you a hint that there is a deal in the offing. As I have said a zillion times before the UK is a special case and will probably end up with a unique 'membership package' not available to another country. May will say we've left - the EU will say we haven't - the world will keep turning and Brexit will be over.



    Remember, it's easier to criticise than create!
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  • Hard Brexit all the way :) :)
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  • FretwiredFretwired Frets: 24601
    Hard Brexit all the way :) :)
    Won't happen. It's not in anyone's interests. The last thing the EU needs is a rogue state off the coast of France with a competitive currency, low taxes, light regulation and a booming economy.

    Remember, it's easier to criticise than create!
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  • BoromedicBoromedic Frets: 4700
    edited March 2017
    Fretwired said:
    The nay sayers need to get up to speed.

    The EU’s chief negotiator, Michel Barnier, said an “ambitious free-trade agreement between the UK and EU” was possible if the two sides can first reach agreement on the ‘divorce bill’, EU citizens’ rights and Northern Ireland’s border.

    I think there will be a deal that keeps the UK in the free trade area in return for some cash and adherence to EU laws in certain areas. The fact that David Davis says EU immigration will probably rise post Brexit gives you a hint that there is a deal in the offing. As I have said a zillion times before the UK is a special case and will probably end up with a unique 'membership package' not available to another country. May will say we've left - the EU will say we haven't - the world will keep turning and Brexit will be over.


    Look I'm far from an expert in this, however in bold above is the problem, For us to agree the EU is going to want to keep the free passage of people across borders as well as goods, this was a key point of the Leave campaign. The EU isn't going to offer us a unique deal if we don't agree to this, and then all we'll have achieved is to shoot ourselves in both feet instead of one. People voted out on this point, they can of course go back on it, then what benefit have they achieved? I'm all for immigration to be honest, sick of all the scaremongering on that point, the laziest most benefit scrounging folk I've ever come across are all home grown I'm afraid.

    I'll put it bluntly, the EU is no golden god however for most lower paid workers and decent hardworking folk most workers rights we attained and improved over the last 30 years have come from the EU. Maternity pay, paternity pay, half decent sick leave. After we've left all these will be eroded and people will be on zero hour, flexible working contracts lauded as some amazing new system that saves them taxes but removes all workers rights. I just hope the NHS can stay sustained after all this as believe me when I say, the last thing you want is an insurance based system. Anyone who thinks that will be an improvement is quite simply an idiot.

    My head said brake, but my heart cried never.


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  • FretwiredFretwired Frets: 24601
    Boromedic said:

    Look I'm far from an expert in this, however in bold above is the problem, For us to agree the EU is going to want to keep the free passage of people across borders as well as goods, this was a key point of the Leave campaign. The EU isn't going to offer us a unique deal if we don't agree to this, and then all we'll have achieved is to shoot ourselves in both feet instead of one. People voted out on this point, they can of course go back on it, then what benefit have they achieved? I'm all for immigration to be honest, sick of all the scaremongering on that point, the laziest most benefit scrounging folk I've ever come across are all home grown I'm afraid.

    I'll put it bluntly, the EU is no golden god however for most lower paid workers and decent hardworking folk most workers rights we attained and improved over the last 30 years have come from the EU. Maternity pay, paternity pay, half decent sick leave. After we've left all these will be eroded and people will be on zero hour, flexible working contracts lauded as some amazing new system that saves them taxes but removes all workers rights. I just hope the NHS can stay sustained after all this as believe me when I say, the last thing you want is an insurance based system. Anyone who thinks that will be an improvement is quite simply an idiot.
    Sorry mate but that's just bollocks. The UK was way ahead in terms of employment rights for years and the EU played catch up - the EU adopted many UK rules - check the TUC website. Even now we are ahead in certain areas - for example, the 52 weeks of statutory maternity leave in the UK is considerably longer than the 14 weeks guaranteed by EU law.

    As for free movement of people that is easily fixed by changing it to free movement of labour and students and having cap to prevent a surge in economic migrants - France is calling for this as are German trade unions. Slight tweak to the rules.


    Remember, it's easier to criticise than create!
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