Inspiration vs plaigiarism

What's Hot
NelsonPNelsonP Frets: 323
edited January 8 in Making Music
Saw this article, which made me think, how much of a song are you allowed to copy? A single chord, a progression, the melody?
I'd guess that most folks are influenced subconsciously by the music they've heard and learned....

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/entertainment-arts-42602900

0reaction image LOL 0reaction image Wow! 0reaction image Wisdom · Share on Facebook Share on Twitter

Comments

  • NeillNeill Frets: 372
    As Tony Iommi once said, when you come up with your first riff the next thing to do is get a good lawyer.
    0reaction image LOL 0reaction image Wow! 0reaction image Wisdom · Share on Facebook Share on Twitter
  • flying_pieflying_pie Frets: 237
    The composer Stephen Schwartz is on the record saying he intentionally used the first 7 notes of Somewhere Over The Rainbow for the "unlimited" motif in the musical Wicked as a nod to copyright law joking that you get sued if you go any further. I'm not sure that would stand up in court but it's recognised that you can borrow about that amount of a melody and get away with it. I couldn't see that working if you were to alter only every 8th note from an established whole tune.

    Chord progressions tend to be well used throughout time in multiple genres and not really subject to successful plagiarism claims.

    But even then you might not be safe - the Pharrell/Marvin Gaye case ruling was ludicrous. It came down to them allegedly copying "the vibe". Under such circumstances The Ramones could sue almost every pop punk band there has ever been. 
    0reaction image LOL 0reaction image Wow! 0reaction image Wisdom · Share on Facebook Share on Twitter
  • sweepysweepy Frets: 1507
    Just as Steely Dan should sue Pink Floyd, Another Brick in the Wall pt2 Bears an uncanny resemblance to FM even the sax solo is lifted by Gilmour
    0reaction image LOL 0reaction image Wow! 0reaction image Wisdom · Share on Facebook Share on Twitter
  • Moe_ZambeekMoe_Zambeek Frets: 2105
    To be fair it does sound like Lana just recorded an even more miserable than Radiohead version and slapped some new lyrics on, without the redeeming feature of the heavy guitar line. 

    What was she thinking would happen?
    1reaction image LOL 0reaction image Wow! 0reaction image Wisdom · Share on Facebook Share on Twitter
  • spark240spark240 Frets: 822
    Ask Ed Sheeran .....all his songs are essentially other peoples chords with his melody.


    Mac Mini i7, 2.3Ghz.
    Presonus Studio One Pro.
    0reaction image LOL 0reaction image Wow! 0reaction image Wisdom · Share on Facebook Share on Twitter
  • Most of the time I think these things are a bit of a stretch - I don't think Noel Gallagher really ripped off Neil Innes, but I was (hypocritically, I suppose) glad to see Innes get some of the money; I certainly don't think Jimmy Page ripped off Spirit, and the Blurred Lines thing was laughable. But I was astounded by this - the whole verse is a carbon copy of the Radiohead song. 

    Does anyone know where she ripped the chorus off from? I mean, why bother only making up half a song?
    0reaction image LOL 0reaction image Wow! 0reaction image Wisdom · Share on Facebook Share on Twitter
  • AlexCAlexC Frets: 1070
    Re the whole Del Ray / Radiohead case - please listen to this, as it would appear that Those Oxford boys took ‘their song’ from The Hollies in the first place.

    https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=LFa-wW_0kmU
    0reaction image LOL 0reaction image Wow! 0reaction image Wisdom · Share on Facebook Share on Twitter
  • thecolourboxthecolourbox Frets: 2618
    edited January 8
    I'm  pretty sure anything I've ever written would be done for plagiarism, were any of my songs or pieces anywhere near good enough to be noticed. I don't think I've ever written anything where I've not thought a week or so later... Oh yeah that's from x or that bit sounds like y etc

    I want to be forgotten, and I don't want to be reminded

    0reaction image LOL 0reaction image Wow! 0reaction image Wisdom · Share on Facebook Share on Twitter
  • Danny1969Danny1969 Frets: 3429
    Wow LDR has basically just put her own lyrics over the Radiohead verse ! 

    I love the Hollies Air that I breath but I don't think Radiohead's Creep is a rip off ..... they both use the major third and then the 4 modulated to minor but that's an old trick a lot of bands used over the years
    www.2020studios.co.uk 
    0reaction image LOL 0reaction image Wow! 0reaction image Wisdom · Share on Facebook Share on Twitter
  • NelsonPNelsonP Frets: 323
    Hmmm


    0reaction image LOL 0reaction image Wow! 0reaction image Wisdom · Share on Facebook Share on Twitter
  • thecolourboxthecolourbox Frets: 2618
    I prefer Lana Del Ray's version to be honest

    I want to be forgotten, and I don't want to be reminded

    0reaction image LOL 0reaction image Wow! 0reaction image Wisdom · Share on Facebook Share on Twitter
  • FretwiredFretwired Frets: 14253
    sweepy said:
    Just as Steely Dan should sue Pink Floyd, Another Brick in the Wall pt2 Bears an uncanny resemblance to FM even the sax solo is lifted by Gilmour
    No chance. Whilst FM was recorded as part of the Aja sessions it wasn't released until 1978 as part of a film soundtrack and at the time it had a Walter Becker guitar solo as the outro. The sax solo came on a later release. Floyd had recorded a demo of the wall in 1978 before the Dan track was released.
    My pump-action drivel gun is smoking hot today!
    0reaction image LOL 0reaction image Wow! 0reaction image Wisdom · Share on Facebook Share on Twitter
  • SnapSnap Frets: 2163
    Danny1969 said:
    Wow LDR has basically just put her own lyrics over the Radiohead verse ! 

    I love the Hollies Air that I breath but I don't think Radiohead's Creep is a rip off ..... they both use the major third and then the 4 modulated to minor but that's an old trick a lot of bands used over the years
    Oh I dunno Danny, the verse progression and the vocal melody are almost identical. Even the phrasing is similar. Anyway, Radiohead agreed to credit some of the Hollies as co writers.

    I didn't know any of this until I read the article yesterday. All good songs whatever.
    0reaction image LOL 0reaction image Wow! 0reaction image Wisdom · Share on Facebook Share on Twitter
  • Col_DeckerCol_Decker Frets: 2183

    I'm  pretty sure anything I've ever written would be done for plagiarism, were any of my songs or pieces anywhere near good enough to be noticed. I don't think I've ever written anything where I've not thought a week or so later... Oh yeah that's from x or that bit sounds like y etc

    I'm in the process of ripping off the Damien Rice song 'Delicate' for a new tune for band. I didn't intentally nick his rift and melody line but its what came out of my fingers and suits my lyrics. I'm not bothered though, when we get signed I'll just give him credit or maybe leave it off the album altogether.

    Ed Conway & The Unlawful Men - Alt Prog Folk: The FaceBook and The SoundCloud

     'Rope Or A Ladder', 'Don't Sing Love Songs', and 'Poke The Frog'  albums available now - see FaceBook page for details

    0reaction image LOL 0reaction image Wow! 0reaction image Wisdom · Share on Facebook Share on Twitter
  • NelsonPNelsonP Frets: 323
    Pretty sure some of these would have been licensed but others wouldn't have been. So where is the line? 

    Also interestingly radiohead feature twice on this list...


    0reaction image LOL 0reaction image Wow! 0reaction image Wisdom · Share on Facebook Share on Twitter
  • Talent borrow.....genius ?

    Instagram is Rocknrollismyescape -

    FOR SALE - Catalinbread Echorec, Sonic Blue classic player strat and a Digitech bad monkey

     

    0reaction image LOL 0reaction image Wow! 0reaction image Wisdom · Share on Facebook Share on Twitter
  • NelsonPNelsonP Frets: 323
    Talent borrow.....genius ?
    One direction?
    0reaction image LOL 0reaction image Wow! 0reaction image Wisdom · Share on Facebook Share on Twitter
  • NelsonPNelsonP Frets: 323
    The minor drop


    Inspired....



    0reaction image LOL 0reaction image Wow! 0reaction image Wisdom · Share on Facebook Share on Twitter
  • NelsonPNelsonP Frets: 323
    Oh, I just saw that Radiohead aren't suing Lana del Rey now.
    They are just asking to be credited with it and for the royalties to be shared.
    Just like the deal that they have with the Hollies.

    ...in case anyone actually still cares
    0reaction image LOL 0reaction image Wow! 0reaction image Wisdom · Share on Facebook Share on Twitter
  • Jez6345789Jez6345789 Frets: 815
    It dont really matter unless you are making money out of it. 

    I liked the fact that Donald Fagan was a huge Keith Jarret fan and saw Gaucho as his homage to the master only to be sued. 

    As for Lana Del I like her but I think she is running short of tunes as there is another song on here latest album Groupie Love that I keep hearing the Trains from Brazil melody in. 

    It all comes to a limited number of notes and what is popular with the human ear.
    0reaction image LOL 0reaction image Wow! 0reaction image Wisdom · Share on Facebook Share on Twitter
  • sev112sev112 Frets: 288
    I think my next open mic mash up will be all 3 of them together mixed up, I wonder how many will notice 

    0reaction image LOL 0reaction image Wow! 0reaction image Wisdom · Share on Facebook Share on Twitter
  • NelsonPNelsonP Frets: 323
    You could also do a mash up of oasis's morning glory, rem's the one I love and puddle of mudd's never change...
    0reaction image LOL 0reaction image Wow! 0reaction image Wisdom · Share on Facebook Share on Twitter
  • flying_pieflying_pie Frets: 237
    Or you could just do the Axis of Awesome's 4 chord song 
    0reaction image LOL 0reaction image Wow! 0reaction image Wisdom · Share on Facebook Share on Twitter
  • RockerRocker Frets: 2486
    If you take say 50 chords, there are only so many combinations of those chords.  A very significant number of those combinations will be, shall we say, unmusical.  The rest work together to a varying degree, some better than others.  And some exceptionally well: the cliched C, A minor, G, F come to mind.  Not to mention the I, VI & V chords.  So there is no way that anyone can claim that a chord sequence can be copyrighted thus actionable in the case of another using that same chord sequence.  Even if it is more or less exactly the same.

    Can drum beats and patterns be copyrighted?  Or bass runs?  I can't imagine that would be possible.  Like it or not, one band influences others.

    Plagiarism?  No, I only copied it from a book...... 


    Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results. [Albert Einstein]

    0reaction image LOL 0reaction image Wow! 0reaction image Wisdom · Share on Facebook Share on Twitter
  • ricorico Frets: 788
    NelsonP said:
    Oh, I just saw that Radiohead aren't suing Lana del Rey now.
    They are just asking to be credited with it and for the royalties to be shared.
    Just like the deal that they have with the Hollies.

    ...in case anyone actually still cares
    They are both equally dreary and dull so I guess that is fair. 
    0reaction image LOL 0reaction image Wow! 0reaction image Wisdom · Share on Facebook Share on Twitter
  • strat1990strat1990 Frets: 21
    spark240 said:
    Ask Ed Sheeran .....all his songs are essentially other peoples chords with his melody.
    Exactly, I think he's being sued for the 3rd time for plaigarism.


    It's a thin line between the two. Personally I've found trying to write original material is a minefield. A piece I wrote recently sounded great until I listened to "Hold on you" sung by Jeff Bridges. Oh well, 
    "The blues ain't nothin' but a good man feelin' bad, thinkin' 'bout the woman he once was with."
    0reaction image LOL 0reaction image Wow! 0reaction image Wisdom · Share on Facebook Share on Twitter
Sign In or Register to comment.