Regular tuning changes causing strings to break

Lestratcaster

I've been asked to play an acoustic show for my mate's band, where they're doing an acoustic show with the set made up of stripped back arrangements of the full band songs of a forthcoming EP release.

Thing is I am using open tunings alot which involve retuning the thinnest 3 strings up and down constantly. In fact every single song (5 of them) in the set is in a different tuning.

At a jam the other night my top string snapped when tuning so I'm guessing it won't be long til one of the other break too. 

Have bought a few single strings in case but I'd rather try to avoid rather than cure. I think I need to turn tuning pegs slower, and try to arrange the set where I don't need to tune so many strings at once.

What type of string would be the more harder to break? Coated? Titanium?

Asides from having a separate guitar for each song any alternatives?

ICBM

Speed of tuning makes no difference. The only way to stop it - or at least reduce the risk - is to make sure the strings are wound very neatly onto the posts and the 'take off point' is not on the edge of the string hole.

Lestratcaster

I do 3 winds around and do the wrap lock thing or whatever its called, this "take off point" might be contributing to the breaking though.

m_c

Sounds like the bigger problem will be metal fatigue, and string type won't really make much difference (unless you want to go classical with nylon!). Titanium may help as it is more fatigue resistant, but I'm not sure if it'll make much difference if being continually bent/straightened.

As @ICBM says, ensuring the string is neatly wound with no kinks will help, but ultimately it'll still fatigue and snap.

Lestratcaster

This is how they're wound currently:

ICBM

Lestratcaster said:

I do 3 winds around and do the wrap lock thing or whatever its called, this "take off point" might be contributing to the breaking though.

Three winds should bring the take-off point to below the string hole, but if it's still on the edge you will have to adjust the length of string wrapped on the post slightly, which can be a nuisance to get right...

Are you winding the string round the post *before* putting it through the hole? If so don't do that, it twists the string and makes it more likely to break. Put the string through the hole and lock-wrap it first, *then* wind onto the post.

Lestratcaster

ICBM said:

Lestratcaster said:

I do 3 winds around and do the wrap lock thing or whatever its called, this "take off point" might be contributing to the breaking though.

Three winds should bring the take-off point to below the string hole, but if it's still on the edge you will have to adjust the length of string wrapped on the post slightly, which can be a nuisance to get right...

Are you winding the string round the post *before* putting it through the hole? If so don't do that, it twists the string and makes it more likely to break. Put the string through the hole and lock-wrap it first, *then* wind onto the post.

Yeah I do, to rate a lock but as you say it'll twist the string.

So should I be doing it like this guy at around 3.30?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0xxeRFEP1Y4&ab_channel=Fender

ICBM

Personally, I would not cut the string first. I would lock-wrap the loose end under the main part of the string on the first turn, then wind on about three turns - you'll have to get used to knowing how much slack to leave to achieve that - then wind on with the key.

For my own guitars I lock-wrap it and leave the minimum possible winding on the post, but that might not be the best if you're retuning a lot and you want more windings.

BahHumbug

I found that when I was practicing loads of songs in different modal tunings, that it was inevitable that a string would go, usually the G, and usually when being slackened off.  I’ve always wound the strings neatly round the posts, so I decided it must be fatigue on that portion of string that is being straightened and bent as you change tunings.
That said, a ew set of strings will still put up with this treatment for quite a few tuning changes, so my s9lution has been to put new strings on before a gig, especially if I think the old strings have already gone through lots of tuning changes.

Lestratcaster

I will restring on the day of the show with a brand new set, and it should last me through the set. Its just there's another 2 weeks or so before with practicing, and if we're doing all 5 songs there'll be constant tuning changing.

ArchtopDave

Do it the Jackson Browne way. Saw him do a solo acoustic show, where he had 14 Acoustics on stands behind him on stage.
He explained that this wasn't ostentatious, but simply that they were all tuned differently. I seem to remember he actually played 5 or 6 of them during the gig.

Lestratcaster

ArchtopDave said:

Do it the Jackson Browne way. Saw him do a solo acoustic show, where he had 14 Acoustics on stands behind him on stage.
He explained that this wasn't ostentatious, but simply that they were all tuned differently. I seem to remember he actually played 5 or 6 of them during the gig.

Ha I wish I had even 3 acoustic guitars. I got 2 at the moment and I'm having to lend one of them to the other guitarist!

p90fool

Lestratcaster said:

What type of string would be the more harder to break? Coated? Titanium?

Don't go coated, one of the downsides of Elixirs IME is that they break pretty easily when disturbed such as slackening them to lift a scratchplate.

I wonder if they go through some kind of heat process during manufacture, because although I never break any in normal use the plain strings are definitely more brittle than conventional strings.

Lestratcaster

Well to aid tuning changes during the set one of my guitar students is kindly lending me 2 electro-acoustics to help with the different tunings. Means I will have 3 guitars for 4 different tunings now, as we are scrapping another song so 2 can stay in the same tuning.

Still doesn't solve my issue of rehearsing the songs in one sitting and not breaking any strings!

ToneControl

Where do they snap?
At the Nut? the bridge? If either of those, make sure the edge is not too sharp

Either way, what gauge are you using and what are you tuning to? Maybe a lighter gauge for the top string might reduce breakages?

sticker

May I ask what tunings you are using ?

Lestratcaster

I am using the D'addario Phosphor Bronze 11-52's currently, but for the set I will put a set of Elixir 80/20 Bronze on there, same gauge, or possible 12-53's.

I am using 4 different tunings (low to high)

B F# B E G# C# (1 song)

B F# B E B E (2 songs)

B F# B E B D (1 song)

B F# B D# A# D# (1 song)

If we play a 6th song (as we ain't decided if the arrangement will work yet) it'll be in B F# B E F# B.

Also the guitar flits between drop b variations and standard tuning as I use the acoustic for teaching too.

ICBM

It will be interesting to see how successful the Elixirs are. I'm pretty sure I've had more breakages with them when slackening strings than any other make.

sev112

Wow they are freaky tunings - are you using a baritone or something like that?

Lestratcaster

ToneControl said:

Where do they snap?
At the Nut? the bridge? If either of those, make sure the edge is not too sharp

Either way, what gauge are you using and what are you tuning to? Maybe a lighter gauge for the top string might reduce breakages?

They're breaking at the tuning peg at the post.

Lestratcaster

sev112 said:

Wow they are freaky tunings - are you using a baritone or something like that?

Yeah they utilise the open strings to give a more open ringing sound, with the other guitarists it sounds really good.

And no its just a Takamine electro acoustic.