Line 6 Helix

sgosden

Is there a way to emulate a power amp before a cab?
I was running helix in a 4CM last night, which sounded awesome. I wanted to try and run direct to the PA too, so split the signal at end of path two so one line went 1/4 to fx return, and a second went via cab emulation to XLR. It just didn't sound right, I ended up running 4CM with a parallel path of amp block > cab > XLR. whilst it sounded good after a bit of tweaking, I'd still like to be able to use the pre-amp of my actual head to feed PA.

is there a way to emulate the power amp stage of the amp, without getting into reactive loads > aux input method?

Cabicular

in short no. Your best bet (if you have the DSP) would be to take a fairly clean and neutral sounding amp like the Archetypal Clean and use that.
Otherwise you could stick HK redbox inline and take a DI off that

TimmyO

I don't understand why that isn't possible Cabicular ? 

TimmyO

Teetonetal said:

Parallel.. not dual.. cabs were the way forward for me. I really like helix setup like that. Sounds huge.

Got a patch(es) to share that I can look at some of your cab setups from? 

Cabicular

TimmyO said:

I don't understand why that isn't possible Cabicular ? 

Because The Helix has pre amp models and full amp models
No power amp only (unlike the Amplifire)
So there is no way to insert the pre-amp of your amp into say KT88 modelled poweramp
Having said that. A good clean amp model is functionally close enough and gives you a bit of EQ

Teetonetal

TimmyO said:

Teetonetal said:

Parallel.. not dual.. cabs were the way forward for me. I really like helix setup like that. Sounds huge.

Got a patch(es) to share that I can look at some of your cab setups from? 

Yes. Should be possible. Pm me your email and I can share..

John_A

Cabicular said:

TimmyO said:

I don't understand why that isn't possible Cabicular ? 

Because The Helix has pre amp models and full amp models
No power amp only (unlike the Amplifire)
So there is no way to insert the pre-amp of your amp into say KT88 modelled poweramp
Having said that. A good clean amp model is functionally close enough and gives you a bit of EQ

I put a request up on the ideascale to add a virtual FX loop to the amp models or add power amp only models to get round this, not sure if it's on the to-do-list

TimmyO

John_A said:

Cabicular said:

TimmyO said:

I don't understand why that isn't possible Cabicular ? 

Because The Helix has pre amp models and full amp models
No power amp only (unlike the Amplifire)
So there is no way to insert the pre-amp of your amp into say KT88 modelled poweramp
Having said that. A good clean amp model is functionally close enough and gives you a bit of EQ

I put a request up on the ideascale to add a virtual FX loop to the amp models or add power amp only models to get round this, not sure if it's on the to-do-list

ah yes of course - think I misunderstood the original question. ta. 

John_A

Just like to add that I've since gone FRFR so the integration with a real amp is now not really a concern for me.  It's also a whole lot easier to set up and sounds great

Cabicular

TimmyO said:

John_A said:

Cabicular said:

TimmyO said:

I don't understand why that isn't possible Cabicular ? 

Because The Helix has pre amp models and full amp models
No power amp only (unlike the Amplifire)
So there is no way to insert the pre-amp of your amp into say KT88 modelled poweramp
Having said that. A good clean amp model is functionally close enough and gives you a bit of EQ

I put a request up on the ideascale to add a virtual FX loop to the amp models or add power amp only models to get round this, not sure if it's on the to-do-list

ah yes of course - think I misunderstood the original question. ta. 

I had to read it a couple of times before it sank in TBH.

John_A

Cabicular said:

 

I had to read it a couple of times before it sank in TBH.

It only sunk in with me when I read he replies

TimmyO

From the Line6 Forum:

2.20's feature complete and been in beta for about a week and a half now. 
<snip> 

I may have mentioned it elsewhere, but Ben and Sam are neck-deep on models for 2.30. No clue when it'll drop.

So, more models in 2.30 later too :-) 

sgosden

I hadn't quite understood the 'IR wormhole"... just looked at the ownhammer heavy hitters pack, which has gone some of my favourite cabs in....9186 individual files of cab,speaker,mic blends.

Holy mother of fuck, that's a lot of minute differences on similar sounds!

guitarfishbay

There's an A1 picks folder for people who just want to browse quickly. 

TimmyO

sgosden said:

I hadn't quite understood the 'IR wormhole"... just looked at the ownhammer heavy hitters pack, which has gone some of my favourite cabs in....9186 individual files of cab,speaker,mic blends.

Holy mother of fuck, that's a lot of minute differences on similar sounds!

I purchased a couple of OH cabs (not that pack) to try out and they are well organised, and there are quick-start folders and folders categorised by rough tonality and on the newer packs some folders with particular recording engineers' mic setups.

unless you are an obsessive twiddler those suggested options (some of which are mixes of cabinets/mics that they think work well) are as far as you need to rummage.

Also as well as organising them by bitrate/duration etc they also replicate them in to folders named for the modellers that that format is for, making it easy to only download the formats you need if you want to (you could of course download them all and use the 'best' bitrate ones in your computer for example too, and all files are available under your OH login for future retrieval) 

For fewer options, look at 3Sigma which the guy from thehelixchannel on Youtube uses in all his presets

sgosden

I've looked through the folder structure they have on there that makes it more manageable,

I thought an IR pack, would be more like A cab with set speakers and maybe 50 blends of various mics and placements! 

TimmyO

Some people do all that mixing and blending themselves in a IR plugin on their computer.

Those people are all men who have never seen a vagina. 

guitarfishbay

It varies a lot by the company.

Ownhammer use a numbering system of 00 to 10 with 00 being brightest and each higher number being progressively darker.  They do this per mic, and also per blend of mics/cabs/speakers etc.

As noted by @TimmyO 3 sigma tend to do fewer options.  The packs of theirs I have are just 5 positions, with A and B poweramps (one is valve one is solid state, you'd probably use the solid state if using full Helix models).  It's not noted what mics are used for each IR other than it's a blend of the mics in the manual.  I've only got some of their bass packs but they sound pretty decent.

Redwirez tends to list mic, position, and distance, so for example SM57 cone 2 inches.  My guess is these are less user friendly for someone who isn't experienced with mic positioning.

Celestion Plus list the mic and use descriptive words like balanced, dark, bright etc.  

Drew_TNBD

Helix makes an appearance in this...

Unorthodox

Very nice Drew.

Have you got any native glass for the a6500? Looking to get one this week.