I need a plan for a Quiet PC for recording

ToneControl

I was thinking of one of these as a boot drive:

Intel 750 Series NVMe PCIe SSD/Solid State Drive 1.2TB

1.2TB Intel 750 Series AIC SSD, HHHL PCIe 3.0 (x4), Intel 20nm MLC NAND, 2400MB/s Read, 1200MB/s Write, 440k/290k IOPS

Heartfeltdawn

Drew_fx said:

Get a Fractal Design case. They lower the noise floor quite a bit.

Hell yeah. I've had the Define R4 for a while, had two changes in processor and motherboard in that time. It's a big case but totally worth it. 

I've got an AMD FX6-6300 cooled by a Noctua NH-U14S fan. Graphics card is passive (no fan). PSU is a Nexus Value 430 watt supply that's no longer made. Western Digital Caviar HD (either gren or blue). It runs quiet enough to be able to record acoustic guitars next to it and it runs quieter than the Virgin Media box I have in here. I'm sure a more modern PSU would lower the noise floor even more. 

In terms of temperature, I have one fan running on the Noctua at the lowest RPM I could get in my BIOS. I don't need to run the case fans at all. The FX6 6300 has a max TDP of 95w. My next processor choice, the i7-4790k, runs at 88w so I don't anticipate needing the case fans when I do upgrade. 

It's worth paying a bit more for a good CPU cooler. I can't fault the Noctua at all. 

Drew_TNBD

Heartfeltdawn said:

Drew_fx said:

Get a Fractal Design case. They lower the noise floor quite a bit.

Hell yeah. I've had the Define R4 for a while, had two changes in processor and motherboard in that time. It's a big case but totally worth it. 

I've got an AMD FX6-6300 cooled by a Noctua NH-U14S fan. Graphics card is passive (no fan). PSU is a Nexus Value 430 watt supply that's no longer made. Western Digital Caviar HD (either gren or blue). It runs quiet enough to be able to record acoustic guitars next to it and it runs quieter than the Virgin Media box I have in here. I'm sure a more modern PSU would lower the noise floor even more. 

In terms of temperature, I have one fan running on the Noctua at the lowest RPM I could get in my BIOS. I don't need to run the case fans at all. The FX6 6300 has a max TDP of 95w. My next processor choice, the i7-4790k, runs at 88w so I don't anticipate needing the case fans when I do upgrade. 

It's worth paying a bit more for a good CPU cooler. I can't fault the Noctua at all. 

I just bought a 4790K and a new motherboard with a Noctua cooler. Should arrive Friday, will put it all together Sunday. Then flog my old chip+mobo+cooler and get some pennies back.

Heartfeltdawn

@Drew_fx That's on the cards next year. Flog the motherboard, CPU and cooler, and throw in the 4790k. What motherboard did you go for in the end?

Drew_TNBD

Heartfeltdawn said:

@Drew_fx That's on the cards next year. Flog the motherboard, CPU and cooler, and throw in the 4790k. What motherboard did you go for in the end?

This one:
http://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B00K9R1MYW/ref=pe_385721_37986871_TE_item

ToneControl

digitalscream said:

It's worth bearing in mind that although you get 14 cores with it, you're sacrificing an awful lot of single-threaded performance to get there (not to mention that 14 cores kick out a lot of heat, which has to be dealt with somehow). There's a law of diminishing returns here - the overhead of managing 14 cores uses up a fair bit of CPU power, too.

By comparison, the Core i7 5960X has 8 cores (16 logical threads) and runs up to 3.5GHz. It'll set you back £800, as opposed to £1900 for the Xeon. Memory for the Core i7 will be cheaper, too (it uses DDR4, as opposed to the way-more-expensive ECC DDR4 the Xeon uses). For the price of the Xeon CPU alone, you can build a damn high-spec (and silent) machine around the i7. I know, I built the spec for Adji's machine around the hex-core version for a fair bit less than the cost of the Xeon, brimming with SSDs.

Don't forget that with Apple's thermal throttling, you're losing CPU power the harder you work the CPU (I believe the latest ones even shut down whole cores to save heat, but don't take my word for it). That puts you in an even worse position than you were before.

what CPU would you recommend now, I got too busy to upgrade when this thread was live, and then  held off  last year when I wasn't working, but I need a  new PC  now I think

ToneControl

ToneControl said:

digitalscream said:

It's worth bearing in mind that although you get 14 cores with it, you're sacrificing an awful lot of single-threaded performance to get there (not to mention that 14 cores kick out a lot of heat, which has to be dealt with somehow). There's a law of diminishing returns here - the overhead of managing 14 cores uses up a fair bit of CPU power, too.

By comparison, the Core i7 5960X has 8 cores (16 logical threads) and runs up to 3.5GHz. It'll set you back £800, as opposed to £1900 for the Xeon. Memory for the Core i7 will be cheaper, too (it uses DDR4, as opposed to the way-more-expensive ECC DDR4 the Xeon uses). For the price of the Xeon CPU alone, you can build a damn high-spec (and silent) machine around the i7. I know, I built the spec for Adji's machine around the hex-core version for a fair bit less than the cost of the Xeon, brimming with SSDs.

Don't forget that with Apple's thermal throttling, you're losing CPU power the harder you work the CPU (I believe the latest ones even shut down whole cores to save heat, but don't take my word for it). That puts you in an even worse position than you were before.

Scan offer the 5960x overclocked to 4.1Ghz, presumably under warranty, for no extra charge

I'm starting to think that's my best option - since I can't go totally silent until mass SSD storage gets mega cheap in 2 years

Looking at the scan offerings now,  6900X  clocked to 4.1GHz might be the way to go

Strangefan

http://i.imgur.com/mozMKJf.jpg

Snap

very timely as I am now in the market for a new music PC. I''ve done a fair bit of reading on CPUs, and from what I understand, a top i7 performs better (acc to various benchmarks) than the Xeons, which strike me as hugely expensive.

digitalscream

Snap said:

very timely as I am now in the market for a new music PC. I''ve done a fair bit of reading on CPUs, and from what I understand, a top i7 performs better (acc to various benchmarks) than the Xeons, which strike me as hugely expensive.

As I said above, it depends what you want - single-core speed (in which case, an i7 is usually better) or lots of cores (Xeon is the best choice, money permitting). Benchmarks rarely use the kind of workloads that DAW work puts on the machine - lots of low-CPU processes.

Generally-speaking, though, i7 CPUs are very good at task switching, so running multiple processes even on a single core is pretty efficient. Add in multiple cores and hyperthreading, and you probably won't notice the difference between a 3.5GHz hex-core i7 and a 2.7GHz Xeon with 14 cores unless you're running ridiculously high track counts (eg more than 120 tracks with effects all over the place).

Cirrus

The annoying thing about thread resurrections is that you see a title and think "Oh, I have opinions!"... then see you've already given them.

I'd still advocate a more open case with lots of airflow. Mine's been going for about 2.5 years in a gaming case with big open mesh panels at the top and bottom. One silent SSD and one regular HD, and the biggest and most efficient cooling fans I could fit in the case and over the CPU. Running mixing sessions where all 4 cores are reaching their limit to the point I'm having to freeze tracks to free up resources, it doesn't break a sweat even on 8 hour sessions - I think the highest temp I've seen on the monitoring software is around 40 degrees.

ToneControl

digitalscream said:

Snap said:

very timely as I am now in the market for a new music PC. I''ve done a fair bit of reading on CPUs, and from what I understand, a top i7 performs better (acc to various benchmarks) than the Xeons, which strike me as hugely expensive.

As I said above, it depends what you want - single-core speed (in which case, an i7 is usually better) or lots of cores (Xeon is the best choice, money permitting). Benchmarks rarely use the kind of workloads that DAW work puts on the machine - lots of low-CPU processes.

Generally-speaking, though, i7 CPUs are very good at task switching, so running multiple processes even on a single core is pretty efficient. Add in multiple cores and hyperthreading, and you probably won't notice the difference between a 3.5GHz hex-core i7 and a 2.7GHz Xeon with 14 cores unless you're running ridiculously high track counts (eg more than 120 tracks with effects all over the place).

this site: http://www.anandtech.com/show/10337/the-intel-broadwell-e-review-core-i7-6950x-6900k-6850k-and-6800k-tested-up-to-10-cores
was advocating considering using  2 x   the Xeon E5-2640 v4: a 10-core 2.4 GHz/3.4 GHz part that runs at 90W, and is priced at $939,
instead of a 6950k

but I remember the hassle of my current  dual Xeon setup - pricier board, memory,  sometimes OS too

ToneControl

Cirrus said:

The annoying thing about thread resurrections is that you see a title and think "Oh, I have opinions!"... then see you've already given them.

I'd still advocate a more open case with lots of airflow. Mine's been going for about 2.5 years in a gaming case with big open mesh panels at the top and bottom. One silent SSD and one regular HD, and the biggest and most efficient cooling fans I could fit in the case and over the CPU. Running mixing sessions where all 4 cores are reaching their limit to the point I'm having to freeze tracks to free up resources, it doesn't break a sweat even on 8 hour sessions - I think the highest temp I've seen on the monitoring software is around 40 degrees.

I need to check if the case ranges have improved

ToneControl

thanks to all the advice, especially @digitalscream ;

I bought a Scan 3XS one
6900K i7 (8 physical cores), overclocked to 4GHz
64G RAM
500G M2 SSD
1TB SSD
4TB SSHD
in a fractal define R4 case ( @Drew_TNBD recommends too)
with some quieter fans added and a passive nvidia card

Excellent performance, should last 5 years I think

Snap

ToneControl said:

digitalscream said:

Snap said:

very timely as I am now in the market for a new music PC. I''ve done a fair bit of reading on CPUs, and from what I understand, a top i7 performs better (acc to various benchmarks) than the Xeons, which strike me as hugely expensive.

As I said above, it depends what you want - single-core speed (in which case, an i7 is usually better) or lots of cores (Xeon is the best choice, money permitting). Benchmarks rarely use the kind of workloads that DAW work puts on the machine - lots of low-CPU processes.

Generally-speaking, though, i7 CPUs are very good at task switching, so running multiple processes even on a single core is pretty efficient. Add in multiple cores and hyperthreading, and you probably won't notice the difference between a 3.5GHz hex-core i7 and a 2.7GHz Xeon with 14 cores unless you're running ridiculously high track counts (eg more than 120 tracks with effects all over the place).

this site: http://www.anandtech.com/show/10337/the-intel-broadwell-e-review-core-i7-6950x-6900k-6850k-and-6800k-tested-up-to-10-cores
was advocating considering using  2 x   the Xeon E5-2640 v4: a 10-core 2.4 GHz/3.4 GHz part that runs at 90W, and is priced at $939,
instead of a 6950k

but I remember the hassle of my current  dual Xeon setup - pricier board, memory,  sometimes OS too

my current setup is an i7 4790 running at 4GHz, and 32 GB RAM. Its acting up a bit when I use Omnisphere 2 in Sonar. I get a few audio dropouts as I increase the VST and FX load too. Nothing really bad, but it is something I have to account for in the more complex tracks.

I'm seriously considering spending quite a few quid on the new setup so all options are on the cards really.

Sporky

Could you not locate the PC further away and use a wireless keyboard and mouse and a longish video lead?

Interface via a long USB/Firewire or similar?

stratman3142

ToneControl said:

thanks to all the advice, especially @digitalscream ;;;;;

I bought a Scan 3XS one
6900K i7 (8 physical cores), overclocked to 4GHz
64G RAM
500G M2 SSD
1TB SSD
4TB SSHD
in a fractal define R4 case ( @Drew_TNBD recommends too)
with some quieter fans added and a passive nvidia card

Excellent performance, should last 5 years I think

I got a Scan 3XS computer just under a year ago.
My spec was:
Fractal Define R4 case
I7 6700K processor (4 cores)
32GB RAM
2 x 250GB SSD
2 x 1TB HDD

So far it's been excellent and can deal with anything I can throw at it (e.g. multiple instances of u-He DIVA and AAS Chromaphone (which are reputedly CPU hungry), big Kontakt libraries etc).
Plus it's happy to run at 64 samples using a Zoom UAC-2 USB 3.0 interface, giving a latency of 1.4/4.0ms reported in Reaper, closely matching the figure measured by Oblique's free RTL Utility

Very quiet as well.

Your higher spec machine should be able to blast through anything audio related.

I'd definitely recommend Scan systems based on my experience.

ToneControl

Sporky said:

Could you not locate the PC further away and use a wireless keyboard and mouse and a longish video lead?

Interface via a long USB/Firewire or similar?

that's what I've been doing since the late 90s - running a hole through a wall, and having a separate machine room. I've done it in 3 houses now. 
The new PC makes less noise than my Netgear NAS

ToneControl

stratman3142 said:

ToneControl said:

thanks to all the advice, especially @digitalscream ;;;;;

I bought a Scan 3XS one
6900K i7 (8 physical cores), overclocked to 4GHz
64G RAM
500G M2 SSD
1TB SSD
4TB SSHD
in a fractal define R4 case ( @Drew_TNBD recommends too)
with some quieter fans added and a passive nvidia card

Excellent performance, should last 5 years I think

I got a Scan 3XS computer just under a year ago.
My spec was:
Fractal Define R4 case
I7 6700K processor (4 cores)
32GB RAM
2 x 250GB SSD
2 x 1TB HDD

So far it's been excellent and can deal with anything I can throw at it (e.g. multiple instances of u-He DIVA and AAS Chromaphone (which are reputedly CPU hungry), big Kontakt libraries etc).
Plus it's happy to run at 64 samples using a Zoom UAC-2 USB 3.0 interface, giving a latency of 1.4/4.0ms reported in Reaper, closely matching the figure measured by Oblique's free RTL Utility

Very quiet as well.

Your higher spec machine should be able to blast through anything audio related.

I'd definitely recommend Scan systems based on my experience.

I've used Scan since 1991, they are great
VIP was my other main source back then

What motherboard so you have? Will it take a 6900k?

That M2 drive really makes a difference too, 

There's mixed opinions on the value of SSHD for audio, but I think it's worth it. I'm always hitting my favourite sample instruments

Heartfeltdawn

Snap said:

my current setup is an i7 4790 running at 4GHz, and 32 GB RAM. Its acting up a bit when I use Omnisphere 2 in Sonar. I get a few audio dropouts as I increase the VST and FX load too. Nothing really bad, but it is something I have to account for in the more complex tracks.

I'm seriously considering spending quite a few quid on the new setup so all options are on the cards really.

What audio interface are you using with this?