RAT

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StrummyBrummieStrummyBrummie Frets: 259
I fancy trying a Rat. Is it worth forking out for an Eighties one?
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  • dogloaddogload Frets: 1495
    Get a Mooer Black Secret. 

    They sound great and are supposed to be close to the real thing. Or a Little Bear R:Attack - even cheaper.
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  • guitarfishbayguitarfishbay Frets: 7953
    I've got a Black Secret, and a Rat Thorpy made for FelineGuitars to sound like the old ones (plus it has other modes). They honestly don't sound the same, the Thorpy rat is darker, fatter, and looser. The Black Secret is cool but sounds quite different to me.
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  • Ro_SRo_S Frets: 929
    Nah, I reckon just get a modern one.  

    Second-hand official Rats seem to go for very cheap on ebay btw.

    You may or may not prefer the Turbo Rat or the You Dirty Rat to the standard Rat.

    For a knockoff that has more than one version, yeah the Mooer Black Secret as stated above - or the Biyang Mouse.

    I know a builder who can make you an affordable custom one with mods if you're interested.


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  • Cheers @guitarfishbay & @dogload, it sounds like the Black Secret could worth investigating. What I'm really interested in hearing about though are the actual Pro Co pedals. The trouble with clone pedals for me is that without the original to compare it to, you don't know if the clone is producing an accurate representation of the sound. Great if you have an original to hand, not so good if you don't.
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  • skayskay Frets: 391
    The ProCo '85 white face reissue they did a couple of years ago is superb. It is built using the exact same components as the 80's original, a true 100% reissue.

    Compared to a ProCo Turbo Rat and a clone it is smoother and has more clarity, plus with the gain turned down to 9 o'clock it's my go-to low gainer. A bit pricey but awesome.

    With so many comparison web sites out there, how do I choose the best one?

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  • hugbothugbot Frets: 1528
    I like the black secret. I dont know if it sounds like an original but its definitely fatter in the low end than the current run rat 2s.

    Also theres the jam pedals rattler and probably like a billion other lm308 rat clones.
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  • DesVegasDesVegas Frets: 4510
    The Chinese Rat Attack is excellent, with three different modes.

    Definitely a lot of fun to play with.

    I got mine for £17.50 from ebay
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  • EdGripEdGrip Frets: 736
    I fancy trying a Rat. Is it worth forking out for an Eighties one?
    No.

    Apart from the "wrong" chip, the current RAT2 is a dead-on circuit. It's also got the sturdiest enclosure of any pedal ever. 

    But there are plenty of clones now with a dead-on circuit, the right chip, and for less money. 
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  • Cheers fellas, I live this place. I think I'll leave the clones alone for now, at least until I've tried the real thing, that way I'll know if the clone is any good or not. What I'm wondering now is does the LM 308 make a huge difference if the current Rat 2 is a dead on circuit otherwise?
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  • timmysofttimmysoft Frets: 1962
    I've got a Duecetone ProCo rat up for sale, there's four different types of rat in that box!
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  • @timmysoft I looked at the Deucetone, but I think the LM 803 chip will be my first port of call. Cheers though. :)
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  • english_bobenglish_bob Frets: 5128
    There was a discussion about this last week. General consensus among folk who had messed around with ICs in RATs was that while different RATs do sound different, it may well not be the presence or absence of an LM308 that made the difference. 


    FWIW, if you know the hot end of a soldering iron from the cool end you could do much worse than to build yourself a BYOC Mighty Mouse, which allows you to select different clipping diodes, which make way more difference to the tone (and has an LM308 if you really insist).

    Don't talk politics and don't throw stones. Your royal highnesses.

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  • @english_bob Thanks man, I'll have a read.
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  • stickyfiddlestickyfiddle Frets: 26754
    edited May 2016
    I'll echo eveyrthing english_bob said; both the BYOC and Pedalparts kits are excellent if you're happy soldering. 

    Everyone should have at least one Rat, and the clipping mods are actually well worth the time. The YDR version with germanium diodes is really great.
    The Assumptions - UAE party band for all your rock & soul desires
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  • @stickyfiddle I imagine building my own would be fun, but I've never really done any soldering and with my time being in short supply it's probably not something I'll get round too.
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  • lasermonkeylasermonkey Frets: 1940
    I built a multi-Rat which has the options of standard silicon diodes, asymmetric silicon diodes, red LEDs (as with the Turbo Rat), germanium diodes or no clipping at all for hard clipping. There's also a soft clipping option of none, silicon diodes or red LEDs, plus the so-called Ruetz mod.
    A huge amount of sounds available there.
    If you're a bass player, it worth adding a clean blend too.
    My wife asked me to stop singing Wonderwall.
    I said maybe.....
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  • english_bobenglish_bob Frets: 5128
    edited May 2016
    The YDR version with germanium diodes is really great.

    I got my Mouse in a tourbox trade so I've never actually seen the inside, but I believe they've got room on the PCB for extra clipping diodes and junk so I might look in to trying the You Dirty Rat version. What's the difference would you say? 

     "Dancing about architecture" caveats taken as read and that...

    Don't talk politics and don't throw stones. Your royal highnesses.

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  • stickyfiddlestickyfiddle Frets: 26754
    The YDR version with germanium diodes is really great.
    I got my Mouse in a tourbox trade so I've never actually seen the inside, but I believe they've got room on the PCB for extra clipping diodes and junk so I might look in to trying the You Dirty Rat version. What's the difference would you say? 

     "Dancing about architecture" caveats taken as read and that...
    Hard to describe, obviously (or paint, dance, cook, etc), the YDR is a bit more "classic rock" and a bit less shredded-face in terms of the aggression and Rat-grittiness. I guess it's a little more late-70's Springsteen or Malcolm Young and a little less Nirvana/Soundgarden. Still feels like a Rat though. LOVE IT.
    The Assumptions - UAE party band for all your rock & soul desires
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  • EdGripEdGrip Frets: 736
    FWIW I modded my RAT2 with an LM308 (I thought I might as well, since I was in there), 
    ...a diode switch (which only affects one of the two clipping diodes, and replaces it with either a silicone or germanium diode pair, or none at all. This means there's not really a "stock" mode, as all modes are assymetrical)
    ...and a resistor about 40% of the way to the Ruetz mod. Just makes it a bit more open with less going on at the bottom end. Replacing this resistor with a pot is what the 4th knob on a Four Knob Rat (FKR) is/does. 

    But you won't find endless threads on modding RAT pedals, because all RATs are basically pretty ace at being RATs already.

    I dropped mine a while ago and broke the diode switch, and I've been meaning to replace it but the damned truth of the matter is that a Big Muff is just better. ;)
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  • stickyfiddlestickyfiddle Frets: 26754
    @EdGrip - you were doing SO well until that Muff bit, and then you went completely insane...

    The Assumptions - UAE party band for all your rock & soul desires
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