A Question of Gig Transport!

Bellycaster

A question of 2 parts.

PART 1

If you don't have your own transport, should you not even consider seriously joining a band.

I have a desire to get back into gigging, but owning and maintaining a vehicle would push my purse strings to bursting point.

Problem: A newer vehicle will be more expensive and generally more reliable whereas a cheap old Jalopy is easy to afford but you will spend more on Rabbit's feet warding of the "Breakdown Demon".

I know some bands will have transport, but it kind of makes you feel reliant and I don't like that and you also might miss out on a great gig where you need your own transport but did not have it etc.

PART 2 Very Important!

Having said all that, all of you with your own transport, if you take yourselves to the gig only, what do you use (Car, Van, Aircraft Carrier)

Whatever the vehicle you use, how do you secure your expensive Head (Tubes), Cab, Guitar, Gig Bags etc.

The last time I was in a gigging band was 1994 and all the band's gear was packed so tight into a VW Van, it secured itself (we only had solid state amps anyway) but in your solitary vehicle you would have to pack out the spaces and reduce manoeuvrability of your lovely gear.

May seem obvious to the experienced, but to someone who may be going back into it anew and one who's had 4 large bottles of Peroni is struggling with the concept.

Cheers for your input.

:-)

 

digitalscream

I don't drive, but I've always been up-front about that with the bands I've been in...and I always pay more than my share of petrol money. It's never been an issue thus far, although it could be with the current lot; only two out of five drive, which might be problematic. That said, my wife drives and is happy (in principle) to take on taxi duty until the situation is resolved. In my experience, only 3 need to be able to drive in a 5-piece. More is more comfortable, and with compact rigs it's possible with just two as long as the cars are of a reasonable size.

BenSirAmos

I would be reluctant to join a band if some members don't have their own transport. There are two types of experience I don't want to repeat.

1. They say they'll get a cab. But they don't. The next door neighbour's cousin will bring them to the gig for a couple of pints. If his old heap starts. If he's not too late home from work. If he doesn't have to take his kids to a party. If if if

2. The end of the gig arrives and they say - "I'll just finish this pint". But there is no real incentive for them to stop drinking because they have another mug band member acting as the cab/roadie, who can't drink, can't charge waiting time, and has a car full of gear that doesn't belong to him. And will only get a handfull of change towards the petrol because the rest has been spent on beer.

No thanks

Bellycaster

@digitalscream

Thanks for the reply. I've got no qualms about chipping in for Petrol etc. It's good that you seem to find a way, have you always been a Gigger though (no breaks etc)? People tend to get used to the drill if the don't stop etc.

It's a bit foreboding when you've been out of the picture as long as I have but then you may join up with guys who have never stopped gigging etc. Do you see where I'm coming from?

Handsome_Chris

Two bad experiences with musos who don't drive.  One was a drummer who didn't drive, so a non-starter there.

The second was a vocalist who didn't drive, and I believe that he expected the band to transport him everywhere. Even a train ride was to much for him.

I've seen it before with other bands, where the non-driver is getting boozed up while the drivers pack up the rig.  IIRC it started a heated exchange of ideas.

If I've got enough room to transport my gear and, a bit of band gear too, why should I be expected to haul somebody's kit on a regular basis? 

hywelg

Don't gig much but I own the PA and with all my guitar gear the vehicle is chocker (Ford Galaxy with all the seats removed) so I'm never in a position to offer lifts. Current band all drive so not a problem but members of the previous band were remarkably reluctant to help shift the PA and load it up after the gig, they'd always sort their own gear first and take their time about it. Current band are brill, everyone mucks in and shifts everyones kit.

Si_

I wouldn't consider any band members that don't have transport, and that transport needs to be big enough to carry their gear. I'm not driving 20-30 mins to get to someone else's house to pick them up, then try to   squeeze their kit into my car, then at 1AM have to do the reverse. Trains, taxi's and other public transport is no good as often they won't be running when a gig finishes.

If anyone wants to be in a band, get transport, it' simple.

I take a Qashqai (although i've had several cars over the years from Huge 4x4s to little Fiesta's), it has enough room for all my gear, plus 1/4 of the PA and band gear (lights etc). I don't do anything special to secure it, just put the rear seats down and pack it sensibly. Most gig gear is built very sturdy so I wouldn't get too hung up over transporting it in a car, rattles, movement and bumps are not going to bother it at all.

Si_

hywelg said:

Don't gig much but I own the PA and with all my guitar gear the vehicle is chocker (Ford Galaxy with all the seats removed) so I'm never in a position to offer lifts. Current band all drive so not a problem but members of the previous band were remarkably reluctant to help shift the PA and load it up after the gig, they'd always sort their own gear first and take their time about it. Current band are brill, everyone mucks in and shifts everyones kit.

We have a good system worked out, after the gig we all pile our individual gear together (so we have 4 separate piles of equipment), we then all chip in and fill 1 persons car at a time, makes clearing down quick and efficient and everyone is helping everyone else. Since we started doing this we save a good 30-40 mins of take down time over just doing it randomly, and no-one feels like they are doing more work than others.

Danny1969

All the 4 bands I'm involved in use dedicated vans which are brought, insured and mot'ed from the bands kitty. 2 of these vans have day cabs so can take 3 band members in the front and 3 in the day cab. It's a good crack all going to the gig together and it uses less fuel. 

I'm always happy to share the driving so always drive to the gig ...........

If you want your gear to survive life in a van then best thing is to flightcase everything and guitars need hard cases really. A bit of common sense when packing will go a long way though. 

Using your own car is gonna be a pain to gig with cos your gonna have to load it before the gig and unpack it after. And if your only insured social and domestic then your probably not covered on the way to a paying gig carrying a car load of PA equipment. Might be wrong on that point, depends on your insurer. If you do run a dedicated van then the typical bills are 

Buy a van would be  £500 to 4K ish depending on how much you like wielding spanners, sockets and a MIG welder . Choose your van carefully if you need to carry a lot of heavy stuff. A non "plated" van is 3.5 Ton Gross weight so it includes the weight of the van it's self, all the gear, the people and the fluids etc. A short wheel based front wheel drive van can thus carry more weight than a long wheel based rear wheel drive van because the vans own weight is less. Once you get to carrying around flight cased Ampeg 8 x 10" cabs and racks of outboard you need a 4.5 ton van and that means a tacho, operators licence etc. 

Insurance is about £700 a year but you can pay monthly, I always do the MOT work myself so rarely spend more than £100 or so on an MOT. Cheapest vans to maintain are Transits, front pads for a Transit are £13 for example. Engines are capable of Galactic mileage, 300k not a problem for a diesel Transit 

So I spose you need to budget about £120 a month to run a van once you have brought it. Not a problem if you gig a lot but probably not worth it if you don't. 

stickyfiddle

I've been in a band where only 1 had transport, and a band where everyone did. I'm never doing option 1 again.

It's SO much better when everyone helps with load-in/out until everything is in/out that I wouldn't want to do it any other way.

Bellycaster

Danny1969 said:

All the 4 bands I'm involved in use dedicated vans which are brought, insured and mot'ed from the bands kitty. 2 of these vans have day cabs so can take 3 band members in the front and 3 in the day cab. It's a good crack all going to the gig together and it uses less fuel. 

I'm always happy to share the driving so always drive to the gig ...........

If you want your gear to survive life in a van then best thing is to flightcase everything and guitars need hard cases really. A bit of common sense when packing will go a long way though. 

Using your own car is gonna be a pain to gig with cos your gonna have to load it before the gig and unpack it after. And if your only insured social and domestic then your probably not covered on the way to a paying gig carrying a car load of PA equipment. Might be wrong on that point, depends on your insurer. If you do run a dedicated van then the typical bills are 

Buy a van would be  £500 to 4K ish depending on how much you like wielding spanners, sockets and a MIG welder . Choose your van carefully if you need to carry a lot of heavy stuff. A non "plated" van is 3.5 Ton Gross weight so it includes the weight of the van it's self, all the gear, the people and the fluids etc. A short wheel based front wheel drive van can thus carry more weight than a long wheel based rear wheel drive van because the vans own weight is less. Once you get to carrying around flight cased Ampeg 8 x 10" cabs and racks of outboard you need a 4.5 ton van and that means a tacho, operators licence etc. 

Insurance is about £700 a year but you can pay monthly, I always do the MOT work myself so rarely spend more than £100 or so on an MOT. Cheapest vans to maintain are Transits, front pads for a Transit are £13 for example. Engines are capable of Galactic mileage, 300k not a problem for a diesel Transit 

So I spose you need to budget about £120 a month to run a van once you have brought it. Not a problem if you gig a lot but probably not worth it if you don't. 

Thanks @Danny1969 and all the others too.

Danny, if a member of one or more of your 4 bands decides to leave and you take on a newbie who didn;t have transport, what would the new arrangements be regarding him?

In these 4 bands, did you join them and they already had the van or did you all chip in from the outset etc?

I wasn't sure what you meant by a non plated van?

As regards doing my own Mechanics on a vehicle, that would not be an option due to having no idea whatsoever.

It seems most bands have different arrangements and I like I said earlier, I have no qualms about chipping in money and doing my share of lugging the band's gear in and out of the vehicle etc. But like @BenSirAmos says, it all depends on logistics of where everyone lives in relation to each other and the time spent ferrying people home.

If you have a dedicated van, this will be the normal routine I suppose. We used a van back when I was last gigging, like you say, great fun all going to the gig together, the van belonged to the drummer and he used to take everyone home after the gig and in return he used to get less unloading to do and more of the money, which wasn't much seeing as we were only doing pub gigs for £60-£70 back in 1993/94. He was a good guy.

The difference is we all knew each other before the band, so that scenario is unlikely to happen again.

Thanks again

 

digitalscream

Bellycaster said:

@digitalscream

Thanks for the reply. I've got no qualms about chipping in for Petrol etc. It's good that you seem to find a way, have you always been a Gigger though (no breaks etc)? People tend to get used to the drill if the don't stop etc.

It's a bit foreboding when you've been out of the picture as long as I have but then you may join up with guys who have never stopped gigging etc. Do you see where I'm coming from?

The key is to be honest, from my perspective - I don't drive and I have no immediate plans to, so I won't go into a band saying, "Yeah, I'll be driving in 6 months" or any of the usual crap like that. If a band can't live with my lack of transport, that's fine and I don't bitch and moan about it.

That said, I don't need anyone to pick me up for rehearsals and the like - wifey's more than happy to run me over to the studio on a weekly basis, so it's not like I'm a regular pain in the ass for it

I actually started gigging properly about 4 years ago after a 13 year break from regular playing. Since then, I've probably done 100 or so gigs and nobody's had a problem with it; then again, I'm not the sort to go out and get wrecked to rub it in over the drivers, mostly because I don't actually like being drunk I've always taken on extra duties in the bands anyway, such as managing the band's online presence, promotion etc.

Danny1969

@Bellycaster

We have one guy with no transport at the mo, he's got a license but as a student doesn't need the expense of a car. So we will pick him up. We've gigging in Swanage tonight, some 75 miles from Portsmouth so will all go together in the van, picking all the band members and crew up on route

2 of the bands had vans already, for the other 2 we had to buy vans. First we used to borrow a van from work, then we saved up £500 for a battered old Mark 3 Transit. Then we brought a better van, then we exceeded 3.5 tons and had to get a plated 4.5 ton van. A non plated van is anything up to 3.5 ton but few bands realize how easy it is to overload a 3.5 ton van when the van it's self weighs close to 2 tons and it's carrying 250Kg of band members. 

It all comes down to planning and seeing it as a business. You infest in a van and a good PA etc because you know the returns gonna be good. The stuff we got cost thousands but we have had that back tenfold. 

Another option is a box trailer, you can various sizes, some can hold more than a typical SWB Transit. All the band members can then all sit in the car. 

Bellycaster

@digitalscream

Thanks.

As for drink, I understand you're reasons there, I would not even consider drinking while playing a gig, I don't mind a drink, but I do not play guitar well after even a couple of pints.

Definite no no.

 

John_P

I think the non driving is awkward but with the right band. (Like one of Danny1969's).    So decent, conscientious and organised people can find a way around it but as you already appreciate that it's your responsibility to get where you need to be.  It's just that, that would be easier if you had a car.  

Roaster

Mondeo estate which carries: 2 x Mackie SRM 450s, Laney active wedge, Blackstar Series one 45 combo and 2x12 ext cab, Diago Tourman pedalboard, large wheeled Stanley toolbox which is now cable box, Drum hardware bag full of mic stands, ext reels guitar stands etc, 3 guitars usually and the mixing desk....who needs a van! Lol. Thing is mate you ave made your situation clear to whoever you play with so it's all up front and has been said above, the right people will help where they can

Bellycaster

Thanks @Roaster

 

tonyrath

Well that settles it for me. I can sing, play keys, play electric - fingerstyle and bass but can't drive Not worth applying for jobs then Oh and I can read music and busk 

Bellycaster

@tonyrath

It's only a small sample size on this thread and I respect everyones answers, but out there you don't know how many different attitudes there are within bands regarding transport. It will be a pretty mixed bag.

I can drive, it's a question of finance, but I'll just have to keep my options open.

Handsome_Chris

tonyrath said:

Well that settles it for me. I can sing, play keys, play electric - fingerstyle and bass but can't drive Not worth applying for jobs then Oh and I can read music and busk 

Well as long as you can get yourself and your gear to rehearsals and gigs, I've got no problem.

mike257

I got fed up of all the messing and bought a giant Transit, converted it to a splitter and gave it 7 seats. My busiest band is a 5-piece function outfit and only two of us drive so we meet in the middle (and pick the rest of them up on the way) load the gear, stash his car and all ride in the van. I don't mind the driving and I get a bigger cut to cover my costs. Works for me and I can get our 4k rig, lights, all the backline and drums and half a dozen guitars comfortably in the back.

I'm everyone's best mate when they're moving house too!