Alternate ..sweep ..legato ect..

What's Hot
Whats everybody using ...i know it dependson what we want to achieve soundwise ect ..but whats everbodies prefered way around the fretboard..maybe ..scales arps ect and what are the pit falls of each ...i have my own thoughts on this but would like to hear how others approach and the good and bad of them 
0reaction image LOL 0reaction image Wow! 0reaction image Wisdom
«1

Comments

  • Alternate mostly, with either a hammer on or pull off to ensure the last pick stroke is a downstroke  before I change strings.  

    I dont think about scales, unless I’m in pentatonic mode, just what notes are in the chord im playing over. 
    0reaction image LOL 0reaction image Wow! 0reaction image Wisdom
  • sweepysweepy Frets: 4158
    edited December 2017
    It depends what I’m after, my default is alternate picking on shorter bursts and a more legato approach to sneakier bits. This probably stems from listening to too much Al DiMeola and Allan Holdsworth in my early mad years
    0reaction image LOL 0reaction image Wow! 0reaction image Wisdom
  • Is the question about ways of creating the notes (e.g. picking, legato etc) or about fretboard visualisation (e.g. seeing/hearing patterns/shapes, scales etc)?
    It's not a competition.
    0reaction image LOL 0reaction image Wow! 1reaction image Wisdom
  • Danny1969Danny1969 Frets: 10356
    I pretty much hybrid pick everything with a pick and one or two fingers now. It's such a great technique when parts call for jumping over strings or there's very fast banjo rolls. I honestly think hybrid picking should be taught from day one, it really is the most efficient way to play and you get the best of both finger and pick tone. 

    To give the most impression of speed I tend to use a little trick that's 3 very fast picked notes on one string and then 3 legato notes on the next one. Even after years of trying I still don't have a very good consistent picking speed
    www.2020studios.co.uk 
    0reaction image LOL 0reaction image Wow! 0reaction image Wisdom
  • BarneyBarney Frets: 614
    Is the question about ways of creating the notes (e.g. picking, legato etc) or about fretboard visualisation (e.g. seeing/hearing patterns/shapes, scales etc)?
    More about right hand picking and most economical ways..there are pit falls in them all in my opinion apart from alternate which is the hardest to master as well I think..
    0reaction image LOL 0reaction image Wow! 0reaction image Wisdom
  • stratman3142stratman3142 Frets: 2177
    edited December 2017
    Barney said:
    Is the question about ways of creating the notes (e.g. picking, legato etc) or about fretboard visualisation (e.g. seeing/hearing patterns/shapes, scales etc)?
    More about right hand picking and most economical ways..there are pit falls in them all in my opinion apart from alternate which is the hardest to master as well I think..
    OK. I understand now. Sorry for being a bit slow.

    I mainly use alternate picking mixed in with hammer-ons and pull-offs, when I want rhythmically controlled lines.
    I occasionally throw in a bit of hybrid picking.

    I also use extended legato, which comes fairly naturally because I'm left handed but play right handed. However, I tend to float over the beat and land phrases on targeted beats with that technique - the rhythmic equivalent of "falling down stairs and landing on my feet". I'm currently working through a Tom Quayle instructional video to try to improve my ability to apply more precise rhythmic control with legato.

    I only use economy picking for that EJ/JB double downstroke thing. Apart from that I struggle with economy picking.
    I occasionally use sweep picking (not very well) but I struggle with maintaining precise rhythmic control.

    It's not a competition.
    0reaction image LOL 0reaction image Wow! 0reaction image Wisdom
  • BarneyBarney Frets: 614
    Danny1969 said:
    I pretty much hybrid pick everything with a pick and one or two fingers now. It's such a great technique when parts call for jumping over strings or there's very fast banjo rolls. I honestly think hybrid picking should be taught from day one, it really is the most efficient way to play and you get the best of both finger and pick tone. 

    To give the most impression of speed I tend to use a little trick that's 3 very fast picked notes on one string and then 3 legato notes on the next one. Even after years of trying I still don't have a very good consistent picking speed

    I have been using Hybrid quite a bit lately and find I get more control than economy timing wise and control over what want to instead of what the technique dictates to me in order to flow ..but still I feel as though alternate will give me more control than any other to technique apart from the speed aspect ...especially legato which I have done in my playing mostly over the years ...but again it sort of dictates what you play in the faster passages ...I feel as though with alternate wherever I am in the song alternate will work and I can get the accents where I want or need them ..
    0reaction image LOL 0reaction image Wow! 0reaction image Wisdom
  • BarneyBarney Frets: 614
    Barney said:
    Is the question about ways of creating the notes (e.g. picking, legato etc) or about fretboard visualisation (e.g. seeing/hearing patterns/shapes, scales etc)?
    More about right hand picking and most economical ways..there are pit falls in them all in my opinion apart from alternate which is the hardest to master as well I think..
    OK. I understand now. Sorry for being a bit slow.

    I mainly use alternate picking mixed in with hammer-ons and pull-offs, when I want rhythmically controlled lines.
    I occasionally throw in a bit of hybrid picking.

    I also use extended legato, which comes fairly naturally because I'm left handed but play right handed. However, I tend to float over the beat and land phrases on targeted beats with that technique - the rhythmic equivalent of "falling down stairs and landing on my feet". I'm currently working through a Tom Quayle instructional video to try to improve my ability to apply more precise rhythmic control with legato.

    I only use economy picking for that EJ/JB double downstroke thing. Apart from that I struggle with economy picking.
    I occasionally use sweep picking (not very well) but I struggle with maintaining precise rhythmic control.


    Yeah I have done work on the Tom Quayle vid....really good info from it but sometimes I feel as iff I tuned in 4ths some of the shapes would be more accessible for me but then it's a whole new learning curve and probably best doing it that way from earlier on ..
    0reaction image LOL 0reaction image Wow! 0reaction image Wisdom
  • bingefellerbingefeller Frets: 5723
    edited December 2017
    What are you having problems with?  Changing strings when alternate picking?

    Post a picture of you doing some alternate picking so we can work out your picking orientation.  Play at a fast, but comfortable for you tempo.  Try to get the camera facing down the neck, like in the thumbnail of this video (which I would also recommend watching):



    0reaction image LOL 0reaction image Wow! 1reaction image Wisdom
  • BarneyBarney Frets: 614
    edited December 2017
    What are you having problems with?  Changing strings when alternate picking?

    Post a picture of you doing some alternate picking so we can work out your picking orientation.  Play at a fast, but comfortable for you tempo.  Try to get the camera facing down the neck, like in the thumbnail of this video (which I would also recommend watching):





     Probably not the best example but what I done a while back ..there is its of all kinds in but i would not be able to alternate pick this
    0reaction image LOL 0reaction image Wow! 0reaction image Wisdom
  • BarneyBarney Frets: 614
    0reaction image LOL 0reaction image Wow! 0reaction image Wisdom
  • You look like an downward pick slanter, meaning you pick escapes the strings after a upstroke, so you want to orientate your lines so you're changing strings after an upstroke.    

    The fast line at 50 seconds is definitely downward pick slanting and it looks pretty good.   You should continue on like this if you wanted to get faster.  Check out some of Chris Brooks material for an in depth look at downward pick slanting.

    You are also doing what looks like some two way pick slanting movements, around 17 / 18 seconds.  

    Interestingly I looked at another video you had, called 16th October 2015, and you were playing some jazz on a Telecaster.  You were playing using some crosspicking type movements and a little bit of two way pick slanting.  I'm guessing the crosspicking comes from changing strings after only playing one note on a particular string.  

    You should figure out one movement and stick with it.  Based on this clip I would reckon downward pick slanting would be the way to go.


    0reaction image LOL 0reaction image Wow! 0reaction image Wisdom
  • BarneyBarney Frets: 614
    You look like an downward pick slanter, meaning you pick escapes the strings after a upstroke, so you want to orientate your lines so you're changing strings after an upstroke.    

    The fast line at 50 seconds is definitely downward pick slanting and it looks pretty good.   You should continue on like this if you wanted to get faster.  Check out some of Chris Brooks material for an in depth look at downward pick slanting.

    You are also doing what looks like some two way pick slanting movements, around 17 / 18 seconds.  

    Interestingly I looked at another video you had, called 16th October 2015, and you were playing some jazz on a Telecaster.  You were playing using some crosspicking type movements and a little bit of two way pick slanting.  I'm guessing the crosspicking comes from changing strings after only playing one note on a particular string.  

    You should figure out one movement and stick with it.  Based on this clip I would reckon downward pick slanting would be the way to go.



    Thanks ...I'm not really sure what downward pick slanting is but will certainly look into it ..I tend to use legato on some faster bits ...not that I want to play fast all the time ...just wondering what everybody most economical way is and downfalls and gains of them :)
    0reaction image LOL 0reaction image Wow! 0reaction image Wisdom
  • vizviz Frets: 10643
    Barney said:
    Awse as always. Is it based on mcalpine? It sounds like him, not only the progressions and soloing but also the keyboard sound and your rather dark guitar sound. Nice. 

    I think you hold the plectrum so only a teeny weeny bit protudes, which allows you to play those machinegun sections and obviously enables you to play legato too - hence why you can switch between them so easily. I can’t quite see that it’s downslanted, but then I am looking on a mobile phone so Mr. Binge is probably right!
    Roland said: Scales are primarily a tool for categorising knowledge, not a rule for what can or cannot be played.
    Supportact said: [my style is] probably more an accumulation of limitations and bad habits than a 'style'.
    0reaction image LOL 0reaction image Wow! 0reaction image Wisdom
  • viz said:
    Barney said:
    Awse as always. Is it based on mcalpine? It sounds like him, not only the progressions and soloing but also the keyboard sound and your rather dark guitar sound. Nice. 

    I think you hold the plectrum so only a teeny weeny bit protudes, which allows you to play those machinegun sections and obviously enables you to play legato too - hence why you can switch between them so easily. I can’t quite see that it’s downslanted, but then I am looking on a mobile phone so Mr. Binge is probably right!

    He is using some upward pickslanting at times, but on the fast part at 50 seconds it's downward pickslanting because of the angle of his wrist.  Look at how the forearm is against the body around 44 seconds - this is a typical upward pickslanting position.  He then changes and the forearm moves away from the body of the guitar before the fast picked run - this is because he is changing to downward pickslanting and the pick wants to change strings after an upstroke. 
    0reaction image LOL 0reaction image Wow! 0reaction image Wisdom
  • BarneyBarney Frets: 614
    viz said:
    Barney said:
    Awse as always. Is it based on mcalpine? It sounds like him, not only the progressions and soloing but also the keyboard sound and your rather dark guitar sound. Nice. 

    I think you hold the plectrum so only a teeny weeny bit protudes, which allows you to play those machinegun sections and obviously enables you to play legato too - hence why you can switch between them so easily. I can’t quite see that it’s downslanted, but then I am looking on a mobile phone so Mr. Binge is probably right!

    I remember listening to a few albums of Tony mcalpine years ago but not really tried to learn any of his stuff...this backing track was just a random one off YouTube.. so maybe with the backing track tried to get the same sort of feel :)
    0reaction image LOL 0reaction image Wow! 0reaction image Wisdom
  • welshboyowelshboyo Frets: 1808
    edited January 2018
    Barney said:
    @Barney ;;;

    bastard...that is all ;-)


    Seriously though - I've always strived for that Holdsworth/Dunnery Legato but can never quite get it - I've got the speed and Legato technique but I just can't get that fluidity and its probably the 4 note per string piece that I struggle to stretch to that holds me back..

    Envious
    0reaction image LOL 0reaction image Wow! 0reaction image Wisdom
  • BarneyBarney Frets: 614
    welshboyo said:
    Barney said:
    @Barney ;;;

    bastard...that is all ;-)


    Seriously though - I've always strived for that Holdsworth/Dunnery Legato but can never quite get it - I've got the speed and Legato technique but I just can't get that fluidity and its probably the 4 note per string piece that I struggle to stretch to that holds me back..

    Envious

    LOL...if listened to lots of Holdsworth but very early on I realised he had long fingers and I had short..lol so the 4 note a string stuff I keep away from most of the time ..just use 3nps
    :)
    0reaction image LOL 0reaction image Wow! 0reaction image Wisdom
  • vizviz Frets: 10643
    viz said:
    Barney said:
    Awse as always. Is it based on mcalpine? It sounds like him, not only the progressions and soloing but also the keyboard sound and your rather dark guitar sound. Nice. 

    I think you hold the plectrum so only a teeny weeny bit protudes, which allows you to play those machinegun sections and obviously enables you to play legato too - hence why you can switch between them so easily. I can’t quite see that it’s downslanted, but then I am looking on a mobile phone so Mr. Binge is probably right!

    He is using some upward pickslanting at times, but on the fast part at 50 seconds it's downward pickslanting because of the angle of his wrist.  Look at how the forearm is against the body around 44 seconds - this is a typical upward pickslanting position.  He then changes and the forearm moves away from the body of the guitar before the fast picked run - this is because he is changing to downward pickslanting and the pick wants to change strings after an upstroke. 
    Ah, ok cool, got it now. Cheers!
    Roland said: Scales are primarily a tool for categorising knowledge, not a rule for what can or cannot be played.
    Supportact said: [my style is] probably more an accumulation of limitations and bad habits than a 'style'.
    0reaction image LOL 0reaction image Wow! 0reaction image Wisdom
  • viz said:
    viz said:
    Barney said:
    Awse as always. Is it based on mcalpine? It sounds like him, not only the progressions and soloing but also the keyboard sound and your rather dark guitar sound. Nice. 

    I think you hold the plectrum so only a teeny weeny bit protudes, which allows you to play those machinegun sections and obviously enables you to play legato too - hence why you can switch between them so easily. I can’t quite see that it’s downslanted, but then I am looking on a mobile phone so Mr. Binge is probably right!

    He is using some upward pickslanting at times, but on the fast part at 50 seconds it's downward pickslanting because of the angle of his wrist.  Look at how the forearm is against the body around 44 seconds - this is a typical upward pickslanting position.  He then changes and the forearm moves away from the body of the guitar before the fast picked run - this is because he is changing to downward pickslanting and the pick wants to change strings after an upstroke. 
    Ah, ok cool, got it now. Cheers!
    No problem.  

    As as a general rule of thumb, whenever someone is playing with their forearm against the body of the guitar they are likely using upward pickslanting and the pick strokes escape the strings on the downstroke.  

    Andy James and Guthrie are upward pickslanters and start a lot of phrases on a single string with upstrokes so they finish on downstrokes and they can make the string change smoothly.  

    Downward pickslanters have their forearm away from the body (supinated) and change strings  best with upstrokes.  
    0reaction image LOL 0reaction image Wow! 0reaction image Wisdom
Sign In or Register to comment.