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  • gearaddictgearaddict Frets: 799
    I remember a similar issue with the Helix. Not sure why the real amp pre-amp is so quiet compared to the internal pre-amps. I need to crank the amp pre-amp way up and take the internal pre-amp preset level down to like 10%. If I then accidentally change to a default preset it will decapitate me!
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  • drwiddlydrwiddly Frets: 724
    I remember a similar issue with the Helix. Not sure why the real amp pre-amp is so quiet compared to the internal pre-amps. I need to crank the amp pre-amp way up and take the internal pre-amp preset level down to like 10%. If I then accidentally change to a default preset it will decapitate me!
    Loop level on the gsp and/or your amp?
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  • gearaddictgearaddict Frets: 799
    drwiddly said:
    I remember a similar issue with the Helix. Not sure why the real amp pre-amp is so quiet compared to the internal pre-amps. I need to crank the amp pre-amp way up and take the internal pre-amp preset level down to like 10%. If I then accidentally change to a default preset it will decapitate me!
    Loop level on the gsp and/or your amp?
    Like I say, there's a level button on the back but I don't think there are any internal settings to boost it. I can try boosting it with the eq block...I think that's in front of the loop. I'll give that a go.
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  • gearaddictgearaddict Frets: 799
    Ah - the EQ block is after the loop, so not much use...
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  • gearaddictgearaddict Frets: 799
    I was playing with this a bit today. In order to get the same volume out of my TH30 in 4CM, I had to crank the channel volume all the way up to 100%, which seemed a bit extreme. But when I looked into the settings of the moddelled pre-amps, the channel volumes (amp level knob on the front of the unit) of those were very high too. If I turn down the modelled pre-amp channel volume then they actually match the volume settings on my TH30 pretty well.  =)

    So I guess that makes sense and works ok. I also tried connecting my B-Hype8 PA speaker to the XLR out on the GSP...and that seemed to work well too. Although, the modelled pre-amps sounded better to me though that than the TH30. The question is - is it worth having the valve amp in there for backline, if the punters only hear it through the PA? A lot of gigs we play aren't even mic'd up, so in that case it is good to have better sounding backline. It's cool to have both options.  =)


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  • HeartfeltdawnHeartfeltdawn Frets: 14793
    I'll be joining this thread soon. Just bought one off the 'bay :)
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  • gearaddictgearaddict Frets: 799
    Cool!  =) I recently downloaded the patches from the Facebook group and it has been really interesting...it's the first time I've properly used the X-Edit software and it really helped me get to grips with it. You don't have to use X-Edit but having all the options there on 1 page is very helpful. I also realised a few things I never knew before - like you can swap the order of some of the effects. And I never realised there is a 'swell' option on the Gate block, which is really great and I will definitely use.

    The biggest revelation is how much of a difference it makes to make quite small changes to the eq block and to add in some subtle compression. Transformed my core tone...I can still feel a difference between this and my valve amp but it is becoming more 'different' rather than 'better'.

    This really is a great unit. Complete steal for the money.
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  • HeartfeltdawnHeartfeltdawn Frets: 14793
     I also realised a few things I never knew before - like you can swap the order of some of the effects. 
    Hmmm. Does it give you full control to do bizarre things such as distortion after reverb? 
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  • gearaddictgearaddict Frets: 799
     I also realised a few things I never knew before - like you can swap the order of some of the effects. 
    Hmmm. Does it give you full control to do bizarre things such as distortion after reverb? 
    Nah...I think yo can just move the modulation fx block pre or post amp. I thought you could move the compressor too but I can't see how to do that now...
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  •  I also realised a few things I never knew before - like you can swap the order of some of the effects. 
    Hmmm. Does it give you full control to do bizarre things such as distortion after reverb? 
    Nah...I think yo can just move the modulation fx block pre or post amp. I thought you could move the compressor too but I can't see how to do that now...
    You can do that on the unit itself on the compressor menu
    Is the moon asking me to stay long enough for the clouds to fly me away
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  • What are you folks playing your Gsp through at home? Long whining story which I'll cut short, but mine just sounds like it's lacking something through my current set up. I don't like Marshall sounds so it's the Fender based ones
    Is the moon asking me to stay long enough for the clouds to fly me away
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  • gearaddictgearaddict Frets: 799
    Mostly through a real guitar cab, via a power amp of some kind. I've tried FRFR using a cheap 8" PA speaker but that was a bit muddy, perhaps unsurprisingly. I don't really like the sound through headphones very much.
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  • I'm running through cheap mixer and studio style monitors (not good ones though I'm sure) but the sounds I'm trying to get whether clean or driven or between the two are missing something. Could just be volume, I dunno. Could it be because the GSP only models the preamp and it's power amp distortion I'm after? 

    Just lacks a bit of thump and size for want of better words.

    The Fuzz distortion type sounds are fine, strangely. In fact the Octavia pedal is incredible, if I could get that in a single pedal I'd be tempted to Go to normal pedals and amp (albeit with line out as I can't use amps in my small room)
    Is the moon asking me to stay long enough for the clouds to fly me away
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  • gearaddictgearaddict Frets: 799
    It does model the whole chain, so it shouldn't be lacking because of that...have you checked the output settings for the 1/4" line output? That can affect the overall sound a lot.

    I agree the drive pedals do sound good into the front end of the amp. I was trying some of them out into the clean channel of my Orange TH30 and they sounded a lot better then most real drive pedals...I've always struggled with drive pedals into that amp.
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  • thecolourboxthecolourbox Frets: 4654
    edited February 12
    It does model the whole chain, so it shouldn't be lacking because of that...have you checked the output settings for the 1/4" line output? That can affect the overall sound a lot.

    I agree the drive pedals do sound good into the front end of the amp. I was trying some of them out into the clean channel of my Orange TH30 and they sounded a lot better then most real drive pedals...I've always struggled with drive pedals into that amp.
    I don't use the 1/4" line outputs I use the xlrs. Might have time for a fiddle on Thursday morning so might just see if it's worth persevering or just giving it up for a while.

    The drive pedals I can take or leave, it's the Octavia that is brilliant to me, and the Grunge pedal is what I use for big muff fuzz sound, surprising decent. Shame they don't do the Octavia in a standalone
    Is the moon asking me to stay long enough for the clouds to fly me away
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  • gearaddictgearaddict Frets: 799
    Ah ok...yeah, maybe just the speakers you are using. How is it through headphones?
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  • thecolourboxthecolourbox Frets: 4654
    edited February 13
    Ah ok...yeah, maybe just the speakers you are using. How is it through headphones?
    The same pretty much. Probably just my ears and inability to like things!!
    Is the moon asking me to stay long enough for the clouds to fly me away
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  • gearaddictgearaddict Frets: 799
    I struggle to like the sounds I get through FRFR tbh - whether it be PA speakers, monitors or headphones. I find them functional rather than inspiring.

    The only exception for me was a Behringer v-Amp, funnily enough...I really liked that through headphones. Even though I never liked the Line6 Pod that is was copying. I used the amp version of that for a while - the V-ampire and I really liked that too...it was just pretty inflexible to use.
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  • mr-macmr-mac Frets: 198
    I remember a similar issue with the Helix. Not sure why the real amp pre-amp is so quiet compared to the internal pre-amps. I need to crank the amp pre-amp way up and take the internal pre-amp preset level down to like 10%. If I then accidentally change to a default preset it will decapitate me!
    Check the menus there is a setting for +4/- 10db for the preamp and iirc a switch on back for the preamp return.  More than likely just one of them set to +4 when amp is -10
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  • gearaddictgearaddict Frets: 799
    mr-mac said:
    I remember a similar issue with the Helix. Not sure why the real amp pre-amp is so quiet compared to the internal pre-amps. I need to crank the amp pre-amp way up and take the internal pre-amp preset level down to like 10%. If I then accidentally change to a default preset it will decapitate me!
    Check the menus there is a setting for +4/- 10db for the preamp and iirc a switch on back for the preamp return.  More than likely just one of them set to +4 when amp is -10
    I don't think there are any internal menus for the loop level...just the switch on the back. There's a setting for the xlr levels but that makes the final sound louder...not just the external pre-amp.

    I think it's mostly just that the internal pre-amps have the amp level set quite high...like 70%. If I set my real amp level that high then it's not far off.
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  • mr-macmr-mac Frets: 198
    mr-mac said:
    I remember a similar issue with the Helix. Not sure why the real amp pre-amp is so quiet compared to the internal pre-amps. I need to crank the amp pre-amp way up and take the internal pre-amp preset level down to like 10%. If I then accidentally change to a default preset it will decapitate me!
    Check the menus there is a setting for +4/- 10db for the preamp and iirc a switch on back for the preamp return.  More than likely just one of them set to +4 when amp is -10
    I don't think there are any internal menus for the loop level...just the switch on the back. There's a setting for the xlr levels but that makes the final sound louder...not just the external pre-amp.

    I think it's mostly just that the internal pre-amps have the amp level set quite high...like 70%. If I set my real amp level that high then it's not far off.
    There is a switch on back which is for loop but output or input.  There is a 2nd option in menus for the one switch doesn't effect. 

    They are opposite to what people seem to expect too +4db is quieter then - 10db as its setting it to handle the louder +4 or quieter - 10.

    So if too loud make sure the loop is set to +4.

    Will look up mine as sure I set a menu option for loop sensativity too. 
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  • mr-macmr-mac Frets: 198
    edited March 5
    Manual says....

    Loop send is always -10 the switch in is +4 reduces gain of return signal.  Or out -10 increases gain of return signal.  Defo worth checking menus though as it may be loop send was added with c63 if it was then also swapping it and seeing which is quieter. 
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  • mr-macmr-mac Frets: 198
    edited March 5
    C63 has a loop level send which has a max of 110 and is set at unity gain of 99 as standard.  So you can reduce the loop send level too.

    To see if this is case plug a cable into gsp on a no effect, no internal preamp preset (tricks gsp into thinking guitar plugged in) .  Then plug guiter straight into amp your using and have amp coming in to gsp with loop return. Play it.... 

    Then remove cable from gsp input and plug guitar in to gsp and replace cable from gsp loop to amp.  See if volume is the same as when you went direct to guitar amp.  If it is louder through gsp then reduce loop send till they both match. 

    When they both match I'll bet your internal amp models sound closer in volume to external amp.

    Also have loop return set to +4 not - 10.  Worth doing this to get gain structure correct for external as getting it wrong can easily reduce your dynamics. 
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  • mr-macmr-mac Frets: 198
    Or if its other way round and external quiet set return to - 10 and do same test as I said but this time if direct to amp is louder then into gsp and out to amp then boost loop send level a little till its same as guitar straight to amp. 

    It just gets your gain structure better and helps tone in end product getting loop level and send level spot on to match
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  • gearaddictgearaddict Frets: 799
    So I'm happy with the sounds I get via a power amp and real cab but I'm struggling a bit with the direct to mixer / in-ears sounds. My hi-ish gain rock sounds are very mushy. Would I be better off using a cleanish amp model like a bassman or something and using a pedal model for the extra gain? If so, any suggestions about amp/cab combos that might work?

    I'm actually starting to think even the GSP1101 might be too complex for my needs. It would be quite nice to have something I can mess with during practice that is sitting right there on the floor and easily tweakable to get the few basic sounds I need. Something like the Headrush gigboard would probably be perfect. If it ever gets released in the UK.
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  • drwiddlydrwiddly Frets: 724
    Of the internal IR's I found the Alt 4x12 is good for high gain sounds.
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  • thecolourboxthecolourbox Frets: 4654
    I've been using the  2101 clean preamp model on the Gsp1101 of late, which I know is based on the preamp in the gsp2101 of course, but what is that preamp based on? 

    On another note, I tried to use another preamp (Zoom G3) to try and run in parallel using the stereo loop and it didn't work which is a shame. Anybody managed this type of thing successfully? I used an aby box, A into front of Gsp, b into front of G3. Patch lead from Gsp loop send to left return, then the G3 output into the right return. Sounded awful. Can't really justify buying two external preamps to use though what with all my noise problems so just wondered if I was doing anything stupid
    Is the moon asking me to stay long enough for the clouds to fly me away
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  • thecolourboxthecolourbox Frets: 4654
    Here I am again.

    A question - the Digitech RP360 seems to have the same models and I've recently built up a nice set of four presets on the Gsp1101, but the big old track unit isn't very portable. Could the RP360 be like the HX Stomp equivalent to put on a small "open mic night" type board for ease of portability?

    Appreciate it's only got one processor compared to the GSP and no IRs, but thought it might be worth a punt
    Is the moon asking me to stay long enough for the clouds to fly me away
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