R8 Peach Deal

Philly_Q

Brize said:

darthed1981 said:

Why on these older LPs do the pickups sit so low in the rings?  Always wondered that!

They don't - the rings are just taller.

I think they also do sit a little lower - at the bridge at least - because the neck angle on these is shallower than a typical new Gibson USA LP, allowing the bridge and tailpiece to sit closer to the top of the body.

Brize

TINMAN82 said:

Not sure I follow the logic re neck pickup ring closer later in the year.

If you look at the BOTB reference book, a significant proportion have the gap. I don't think its designed that way, its the end result of x, y and z pieces of wood being sawn and glued together + manufacturing tolerances. Still pretty traditional and hand finished at Gibson.

When the 2017 guitars were released, the gap was very noticeable and generally much bigger than any original example. Gibson and the dealers tried to make out that it was historically accurate, which it was, to an extent. Guitars with later serial numbers in the 2017 run definitely have a smaller gap or eliminate it almost completely, so I can only assume that it was a deliberate manufacturing change.

Brize

Philly_Q said:

Brize said:

darthed1981 said:

Why on these older LPs do the pickups sit so low in the rings?  Always wondered that!

They don't - the rings are just taller.

I think they also do sit a little lower - at the bridge at least - because the neck angle on these is shallower that a typical new Gibson USA LP, allowing the bridge and tailpiece to sit closer to the top of the body.

It depends - the neck angles on Gibson Historic Les Pauls have been all over the place. I've got examples with shallow neck angles where the pickup is optimal slightly below the top of the ring, and examples with a deeper neck angle where the pickup needs to be above the ring.

terada

Brize said:

TINMAN82 said:

Not sure I follow the logic re neck pickup ring closer later in the year.

If you look at the BOTB reference book, a significant proportion have the gap. I don't think its designed that way, its the end result of x, y and z pieces of wood being sawn and glued together + manufacturing tolerances. Still pretty traditional and hand finished at Gibson.

When the 2017 guitars were released, the gap was very noticeable and generally much bigger than any original example. Gibson and the dealers tried to make out that it was historically accurate, which it was, to an extent. Guitars with later serial numbers in the 2017 run definitely have a smaller gap or eliminate it almost completely, so I can only assume that it was a deliberate manufacturing change.

Very interesting. What do you think about the TH/non TH guitars being rebranded as 'Standard' for 2017?

I've read on LP specific sites that the consensus last year was that buying a 2017 was either good value (a TH spec for a much cheaper than usual price) or poor value (a non TH spec including short tennon etc for higher than CS8/9 etc price).

Obviously at the price we've all paid it makes no difference, but the movement in pickup position is the only thing I've seen that might support this assertion.

SteveF

mli3 said:

Anyone that bought have any washed cherry pics ?

The left one (obvs)  

terada

mli3 said:

Anyone that bought have any washed cherry pics ?

Sorry for the repost for those who have already seen.

SteveF

Random question for anyone who knows about these - has anyone else noticed that the control knobs sit quite high above the body?  Certainly higher than I've had before on other LPs, even Gibsons.  Is this a historically accurate foible? Is it just a case of getting some shorter shaft pots?  If so, can anyone recommend the correct length to get to have the knobs sitting closer to the body?  

Moe_Zambeek

terada said:

Brize said:

TINMAN82 said:

Not sure I follow the logic re neck pickup ring closer later in the year.

If you look at the BOTB reference book, a significant proportion have the gap. I don't think its designed that way, its the end result of x, y and z pieces of wood being sawn and glued together + manufacturing tolerances. Still pretty traditional and hand finished at Gibson.

When the 2017 guitars were released, the gap was very noticeable and generally much bigger than any original example. Gibson and the dealers tried to make out that it was historically accurate, which it was, to an extent. Guitars with later serial numbers in the 2017 run definitely have a smaller gap or eliminate it almost completely, so I can only assume that it was a deliberate manufacturing change.

Very interesting. What do you think about the TH/non TH guitars being rebranded as 'Standard' for 2017?

I've read on LP specific sites that the consensus last year was that buying a 2017 was either good value (a TH spec for a much cheaper than usual price) or poor value (a non TH spec including short tennon etc for higher than CS8/9 etc price).

Obviously at the price we've all paid it makes no difference, but the movement in pickup position is the only thing I've seen that might support this assertion.

Are these short tenons then?

terada

SteveF said:

Random question for anyone who knows about these - has anyone else noticed that the control knobs sit quite high above the body?  Certainly higher than I've had before on other LPs, even Gibsons.  Is this a historically accurate foible? Is it just a case of getting some shorter shaft pots?  If so, can anyone recommend the correct length to get to have the knobs sitting closer to the body?  

It's a historic thing, completely weird, but normal.

mli3

Wow they are nice @terada @SteveF @Modellista super nice. Enjoy!

Twinfan

Moe_Zambeek said:

Are these short tenons then?

No.  Short tenons were only used on Custom Shop guitars in 2015 for the CS range.  They have CS serial numbers.

I don't know where terada got his info from but but it's wrong.

Brize

terada said:

Very interesting. What do you think about the TH/non TH guitars being rebranded as 'Standard' for 2017?

I've read on LP specific sites that the consensus last year was that buying a 2017 was either good value (a TH spec for a much cheaper than usual price) or poor value (a non TH spec including short tennon etc for higher than CS8/9 etc price).

Obviously at the price we've all paid it makes no difference, but the movement in pickup position is the only thing I've seen that might support this assertion.

I bow to no one in my contempt for the term 'True Historic'. I've owned Custom Shop LPs from most years since 2003 and I don't notice the difference in the plastics. Partly because I'm just not interested in that level of minutiae, and partly because they're much of a muchness. I do notice the pickup covers, though, which they still haven't got right.

In my view, the biggest changes occurred in 2013 with the change to aniline dye on the backs, the removal of the truss-rod condom, hide glue on the neck joint, and the Custom Bucker pickups. In my experience, guitars from 2013 just sound a bit more alive and, although they're all different, I don't think I've played a bad one.

I think the 2017 R8s represent exceptional value at £2,500, and I say that as someone who bought one at close to full price! They're generally great sounding, great playing guitars so the blow-out price makes them a no-brainer if you've got the money (or the credit worthiness). The gap in front of the neck pickup ring is a trivial matter and, if it bugs you, you can always console yourself that you're in good company with the original examples.

TINMAN82

Moe_Zambeek said:

terada said:

Brize said:

TINMAN82 said:

Not sure I follow the logic re neck pickup ring closer later in the year.

If you look at the BOTB reference book, a significant proportion have the gap. I don't think its designed that way, its the end result of x, y and z pieces of wood being sawn and glued together + manufacturing tolerances. Still pretty traditional and hand finished at Gibson.

When the 2017 guitars were released, the gap was very noticeable and generally much bigger than any original example. Gibson and the dealers tried to make out that it was historically accurate, which it was, to an extent. Guitars with later serial numbers in the 2017 run definitely have a smaller gap or eliminate it almost completely, so I can only assume that it was a deliberate manufacturing change.

Very interesting. What do you think about the TH/non TH guitars being rebranded as 'Standard' for 2017?

I've read on LP specific sites that the consensus last year was that buying a 2017 was either good value (a TH spec for a much cheaper than usual price) or poor value (a non TH spec including short tennon etc for higher than CS8/9 etc price).

Obviously at the price we've all paid it makes no difference, but the movement in pickup position is the only thing I've seen that might support this assertion.

Are these short tenons then?

Exactly my question. I thought all long tenon at least since 2013.

Brize

Twinfan said:

Moe_Zambeek said:

Are these short tenons then?

No.  Short tenons were only used on Custom Shop guitars in 2015 for the CS range.  They have CS serial numbers.

I don't know where Brize got his info from but but it's wrong.

Ahem. I never said that 2017 Custom Shop Les Pauls had short tenons.

Twinfan

Brize said:

Ahem. I never said that 2017 Custom Shop Les Pauls had short tenons.

Sorry - I mis-read the multiple quoting.  I've corrected it, it was terada 

Brize

Twinfan said:

Brize said:

Ahem. I never said that 2017 Custom Shop Les Pauls had short tenons.

Sorry - I mis-read the multiple quoting.  I've corrected it, it was terada 

You're forgiven!

Brize

TINMAN82 said:

Moe_Zambeek said:

terada said:

Brize said:

TINMAN82 said:

Not sure I follow the logic re neck pickup ring closer later in the year.

If you look at the BOTB reference book, a significant proportion have the gap. I don't think its designed that way, its the end result of x, y and z pieces of wood being sawn and glued together + manufacturing tolerances. Still pretty traditional and hand finished at Gibson.

When the 2017 guitars were released, the gap was very noticeable and generally much bigger than any original example. Gibson and the dealers tried to make out that it was historically accurate, which it was, to an extent. Guitars with later serial numbers in the 2017 run definitely have a smaller gap or eliminate it almost completely, so I can only assume that it was a deliberate manufacturing change.

Very interesting. What do you think about the TH/non TH guitars being rebranded as 'Standard' for 2017?

I've read on LP specific sites that the consensus last year was that buying a 2017 was either good value (a TH spec for a much cheaper than usual price) or poor value (a non TH spec including short tennon etc for higher than CS8/9 etc price).

Obviously at the price we've all paid it makes no difference, but the movement in pickup position is the only thing I've seen that might support this assertion.

Are these short tenons then?

Exactly my question. I thought all long tenon at least since 2013.

Custom Shop Les Pauls have always had long tenons - it was only in 2015 that Gibson changed this for the 'Standard Historic' guitars.

TINMAN82

Brize said:

TINMAN82 said:

Not sure I follow the logic re neck pickup ring closer later in the year.

If you look at the BOTB reference book, a significant proportion have the gap. I don't think its designed that way, its the end result of x, y and z pieces of wood being sawn and glued together + manufacturing tolerances. Still pretty traditional and hand finished at Gibson.

When the 2017 guitars were released, the gap was very noticeable and generally much bigger than any original example. Gibson and the dealers tried to make out that it was historically accurate, which it was, to an extent. Guitars with later serial numbers in the 2017 run definitely have a smaller gap or eliminate it almost completely, so I can only assume that it was a deliberate manufacturing change.

Hmm, still an assumption though, I’d  like to hear that from someone at Gibson. My 2013 Les Paul traditional had a gap just like these historics. Pretty sure that guitar wasn’t designed to have a gap. Anyway, clearly something most don’t care about.

darthed1981

Is it wrong while looking at these earlier I actually found myself wanting this one...?

https://www.coda-music.com/gibson-usa-2018-les-paul-standard-cobalt-burst-180050268.html

Brize

TINMAN82 said:

Hmm, still an assumption though.

Yes, granted, it's an assumption. But when all low serial number guitars have the gap and that gap is closed or eliminated on all later serial number guitars, it seems a reasonable assumption to make.