Anyone gone guitar to 6 string bass?

Megii

I currently have a (not very brilliant) 5 string bass - I'm originally and still primarily a guitarist. Anyhow, for some happy reason, my brain seems to automatically understand it's kind of the bottom 4 strings of a guitar an octave down, plus a low B, and I can play it fine without hitting bum notes. So - I'm now considering upgrading to a better quality bass, but it occurs to me I could expand to a 6 string - I sometimes do feel like I want that bit of higher range when playing the 5 string.

But would I run into trouble with tuning and the old brain not adapting? - a) with the 6 strings, it might be hard not to think like it's standard guitar tuning. b) I guess I could tune the top sting to a B, but that might not work either, and be equally as confusing. c) obviously could tune the top sting to a high C, but then would my brain cope with that?

Anyone done the guitar to 6 string bass move, and was it easy, and any advice welcome. Of course I do have the option to stay with 5 string, which at least I already know works well for me, cheers!

octatonic

Master 4 string bass before you add more range.

Megii

octatonic said:

Master 4 string bass before you add more range.

Cheers, but as I said, I'm already good with 5 - not going down to 4.

Bridgehouse

No, and you shouldn’t, because as per the International Treaty on Bass Technique (Geneva) 1947, it clearly states:

”Do not play bass with a guitarist mindset, or you will sound like a guitarist playing bass”

Megii

Honestly not wishing to upset anyone, and I do respect peoples rights to hold whatever opinion regarding the progression when learning bass guitar. Perhaps I did the wrong thing going straight to 5 string, I'll accept the possibility at least - but I'm too far down the line now, and I honestly don't see why not re the 5 string. But that's just me! Anyhow, really hoping to hear from any guitarists who have experience with 6 string bass, cheers.

Winny_Pooh

6's are fairly neck heavy and big. Try some in person and you may find little value in a high C. 

Megii

Winny_Pooh said:

6's are fairly neck heavy and big. Try some in person and you may find little value in a high C. 

Good points, and could well be true in my case. Obvious point I suppose, so yes of course I really should try one or more 6 strings to see how I find them, thank you!

Phil_aka_Pip

IMO the value of the low B is that you don't have to go to the low frets on the E string to get the notes below A, you can stay in the 5th position and use frets 5 and upwards on the B string instead, thus saving yourself a position shift and having to negotiate frets that are tbh way too far apart.

Whereas all the high C string will get you is weedy notes you're not going to use. Stick with 5 strings.

Jalapeno

Fender Bass VI would be a good bridge to a full 6 string bass.

Megii

Thank you @Phil_aka_Pip and @Jalapeno - you make fair points. Re the Fender Bass VI that is interesting, but I think the logical conclusion for me would be to then go to a 7 string tuned like a guitar an octave down plus a low B. But I really think that would be a bit mad.

Anyhow, I've thought more on the whole issue, and have come to the conclusion that I'm better off staying with 5 string, for quite a few reasons. So it looks like what I would be after is a better quality 5 string. The one I have is not bad in some ways, but there are issues with upper frets ramping up, which the truss rod can't cure, and it limits what I can do to lower the action. So a shame about that, but I didn't pay a lot for it. Anyhow, I digress, and thanks again to everyone.

DLM

Go try some really good basses with all sorts of configurations. My fretted 5 (Sandberg Ken Taylor) has 24 frets, and whilst I'm crap at playing them, the top notes on the G sound fine and are all playable. I've heard proper bassists doing really nice things with 24-fret 5s that could lead one to think they were using a 6. (I'm a Sheehan fan, I don't fear bass solos!)

Basses are so much less homogeneous than guitars, where it's Strat/Tele style or Gibson style what feels like 95% of the time. Try some sixes with wide and narrow string spacing, some fanned-fret models, short- and long-scale instruments, a seven-string monster, whatever you can get your hands on. I've seen bassists tune sevens to a more "guitar" tuning for familiar and more workable chord shapes... There really are no rules, do whatever makes you happy.

As for playing like a guitarist, the string tone and note attack/dynamics are so different, I find I play totally differently.

Rocker

Play it as a bass guitar not a lead guitar!  Four strings are where it is at.  Get yourself a good bass amp.  Learn to listen to the other musicians in the band.  Lock in to the drums.

fretmeister

Get a good 5 with a Great low b.

ignore Rocker completely. I’m surprised he’s not complaining about when double basses added a 4th string in the 16th century.

Its all about 3 strings man!!!!!

Other than easier reaching, a low B allows the player to follow piano scores without jumping octaves in ways that ruin the direction of the phrase. Very useful if you play tunes in several keys depending on the others you’re playing with.

EricTheWeary

Phil_aka_Pip said:

IMO the value of the low B is that you don't have to go to the low frets on the E string to get the notes below A, you can stay in the 5th position and use frets 5 and upwards on the B string instead, thus saving yourself a position shift and having to negotiate frets that are tbh way too far apart.

Whereas all the high C string will get you is weedy notes you're not going to use. Stick with 5 strings.

That's pretty much how I see it, a 5 string is easier than 4 in some ways. A 6 adds an extra level of complexity for a few notes I wouldn't use much. 

fretmeister

Most of the time, and even the flashiest players know this, the bass is there to be part of the rhythm section and provide counter melodies.

But it's also there to NOT get in the way of the sonic space of the other instruments. To be fair, a lot of guitarists are really bad at leaving the low end space - they crank their bass to the max and then wonder why all the low end has disappeared when they solo - it's because the bassist had to EQ around an excessively bassy guitar sound.

Sometimes a 4 string does not have the range to sit under the other instruments in the key that the piece is being played in.

This happens a hell of a lot if you ever play with brass and woodwind - the key is usually chosen to suit B flat or E flat instruments. That often means the bass part cannot be played at the same interval below the melody instruments if it is on a 4 string.

So the bass part is played correctly - just an octave up. That clashes with the 'bones and the bari-sax and the bottom end of the tenors. There's no space and there's a volume war ruining the mix.

Just having those few extra notes on a 5 string allows the bass part to retain the composers intended interval to the other instruments.

The thing that many "Jaco never needed more than a 4 string" type people forget is that just because the Low B is there doesn't mean you have to play it all the time. Just like every other note choice, the choice has to be a good one. (And Jaco had a 5 string too - just didn't gig it very often. It was an acoustic)

Leave it alone when it's not needed - just like on a piano.

But if you are learning a tune where the lowest note is an Eb or lower, particularly if that low note is at the end of a run where all the instruments are heading downwards - you won't have to ruin the feel by having to play that last note up instead.


But - if you are thinking about chordal work then a 6 is sometimes the only way to get the entire voicing or a chord. Anthony Jackson plays a massive 6 (has HUGE hands) with a 36 inch scale and plays a lot of chord work.

There's also the option of something like the Musicman Silhouette Bass - it's a baritone really, but can be tuned E-E an octave down. It's an excellent instrument. It won't go down to a B though as stock as the low string won't intonate. Not enought room to move the saddle back enough with modification.

It's a very easy instrument to play - certainly easier than the usual monster 6 string necks. It sounds very different to a 34 inch scale neck too. Not many of them about though!

Megii

Thank you all for your further replies and thought - I respect your rights to hold whatever view with regards to 4 vs 5 vs 6 or more strings. And I'm sure there is some validity to the "learn 4 string first" view, although as already stated, I'm used to a 5 string now, and won't be getting a 4, at least in the foreseeable - not least because I'm just wanting to have one bass. So arguably did things wrong there, but it's too late now. But I'm certainly not of the 5 is more than 4 and therefore better opinion, it's just how things are for me.

I think the advice to go and try a few is spot on - all too easy to just order something on the web, which avoids the hassle of having to make a journey etc. but could so easily lead to a mistake. And yes, OK, I won't rule out a 6 (or 7!) at this point, although it seems unlikely. I have watched a few great 5 string bassists, who do indeed do great things with a 24 fret neck. Chordal work I guess would tend to head me towards a 6, but I have heard 5 stringers doing nice chordal/double stop stuff, and I don't have AJ's huge hands. Plus I will always be a guitarist in the main, so always have that for when I'm feeling really "chordy".

And I do appreciate the genuine wishes of all of you to help me make a good/right decision, cheers

Megii

Have been in touch with my local music shop, and they have a few interesting tempters, so will be heading over there to try some stuff out tomorrow. Should be useful, whether or not I make a purchase.

Megii

Shop visit made, sadly no purchase though. They had a Squier Precision 5 string of some sort - 2 oblong passive pickups, rather than the classic split P bass type - anyhow, didn't like it at all, the neck felt very bulky and also suffered from fret ramp up syndrome where it bolts on, and a bit of a cheap feel overall, at least to me.

The other bass I tried was a Cort A5 - not the current version. It was a nice, well-made instrument, 5 piece thru-neck with solid flame maple wings no less. The neck was noticeably slimmer than the Squier, and with 24 frets, which is really something I would want. I think I probably prefer the neck profile on my existing bass all the same though. Unfortunately the electrics did not seem to work properly - one control seemed to do nothing at all, in either active or passive mode, and I'm not sure all the other controls were quite as they should be either. Would be a decent buy if working right I guess - the shop owner is going to have his tech look at the bass and hopefully fix any issues, and then he will message me. If so will be worth another look, but I'm still not sure it's for me really.

So goes to show the value of trying things out...

PolarityMan

octatonic said:

Master 4 string bass before you add more range.

Surely it depends on what music you want to play.

Megii

PolarityMan said:

octatonic said:

Master 4 string bass before you add more range.

Surely it depends on what music you want to play.

Good point I would say. Anyhow, just in case anyone cares, an update. The local shop has not got back to me, so maybe the electronics on the Cort had been messed about with more than they thought. I could contact them to find out what's going on, but on reflection, I'm going to leave it. Having played a few 5 strings recently, I have to say the one I have is not so bad, although there is a bit of an issue with the dusty end frets rising, but I'm going to stick with it for a while at least - I like the neck profile on it better than anything else I tried for one thing. Cheers again for your thought though all

VJIves

I actually found it hard to get my head around a 5 string bass after going from guitar to bass and back again, so you may have done things in the right order there. Also the first time I played a uke I was absolutely baffled by the high string at the bottom. Baffled.