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I dont think Helix is for me.

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  • I have a helix but have realised it's amp and pedals all the way for me, although my LT is a great and invaluable tool.
    I think if I was in a cover band that needed to cover a lot of ground, which did gigs through a decent sized PA it might work. 
    But I’m in an acoustic cover band and soon a Ska cover band and really I just want my own sound.  We interpret the originals but don’t necessarily want to copy them so
    to that end just an amp and a few pedals works better.  There’s absolutely no scenario I’d need a Kings of Leon, U2 or Oasis ‘tone’.
    In fact I can safely say that I would never entertain the idea of being in your classic cover band like that, I just don’t want to be involved with anything that needs me to get a facsimile of
    somebody else’s sound.  But I can see the Helix might be a better route than pedals and amps if I did.



    With my Helix LT I don’t take that approach at all.

    I just setup 4 basic sounds as I would with a normal valve amp and pedal setup. Then I have basic delay, chorus, reverb tremolo etc to add to those basic sounds.

    Works perfectly this way. I don’t want to sound like the recorded tone. I want it to be my version of that sound.
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  • VaiaiVaiai Frets: 530
    This post and all the responses just shows the difference in everyone's requirements. Helix has worked for me the last 2 years and sounds best in a PA direct, followed by in FX Return of an amp and into a guitar cab rather than FRFR (which is "ok" for me I don't want to be tweaking high and lo cut or IRs etc)

    I also have 4 base sounds and can add any effect or try different amps *if I want* but I tend not to - it's good enough to gig with - I sold my Victory V30 and 1x12 with no regrets. It's about simplicity, options and for me, sound. Lightweight, quick to set up and tear down and works in many configurations.

    All our needs are different - for those of us who love Helix it's checking enough of the boxes. For those that tried it and can't get on with it, move on and go back to amps and pedals - there's room for all of it. 

    As an aside - I was trying some gear in a shop and asked to use the Helix in store and it sounded awful - had I been demoing it to buy I would never have touched it. Setting up some good patches and sticking it in a good cab/FRFR would have made all the difference.
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  • BowksBowks Frets: 413
    edited February 2019
    I am going to take a new approach with my HX Stomp mini board, which will be deleting all the presets and building my sounds from the ground up. 

    My idea was to get a powerful yet small setup that will spend most of its time connected to a Yamaha THR10 or a small bass amp for home playing. 

    I've seen the silly routing in a few patches and by removing them, it sounds so much better to my ears. 

    This week, I'll get stuck into making the patches I want, along with the patch cables I need!




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  • VaiaiVaiai Frets: 530
    @Bowks ;
    I love that setup! I could also get away with just a Stomp in our covers band - very tempted, especially for rehearsal!
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  • Bowks said:
    I am going to take a new approach with my HX Stomp mini board, which will be deleting all the presets and building my sounds from the ground up. 

    My idea was to get a powerful yet small setup that will spend most of its time connected to a Yamaha THR10 or a small bass amp for home playing. 

    I've seen the silly routing in a few patches and by removing them, it sounds so much better to my ears. 

    This week, I'll get stuck into making the patches I want, along with the patch cables I need!




    that is badass!
    ဈǝᴉʇsɐoʇǝsǝǝɥɔဪቌ
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  • Vaiai said:
    All our needs are different - for those of us who love Helix it's checking enough of the boxes. For those that tried it and can't get on with it, move on and go back to amps and pedals - there's room for all of it. 
    Other modelling solutions are available  =)
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  • VaiaiVaiai Frets: 530
    Vaiai said:
    All our needs are different - for those of us who love Helix it's checking enough of the boxes. For those that tried it and can't get on with it, move on and go back to amps and pedals - there's room for all of it. 
    Other modelling solutions are available  =)
    Yep, I mean tried modelling generally :)
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  • BowksBowks Frets: 413
    Vaiai said:
    @Bowks ;
    I love that setup! I could also get away with just a Stomp in our covers band - very tempted, especially for rehearsal!
    Thanks!

    I don't think that I am going to really need a ton of effects, so for home use and messing aroung in a rehearsal room, I hope this will be adequate.

    My only consideration is how you patch in the H9. I either stick it in the loop or use it in pre/post mode and have to option to put it in front or after the HX. I'm leaning towards the loop right now and have ordered the requiste cables to make a stereo patch lead.
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  • John_AJohn_A Frets: 3775
    edited February 2019
    Bowks said:
    Vaiai said:
    @Bowks ;;
    I love that setup! I could also get away with just a Stomp in our covers band - very tempted, especially for rehearsal!
    Thanks!

    I don't think that I am going to really need a ton of effects, so for home use and messing aroung in a rehearsal room, I hope this will be adequate.

    My only consideration is how you patch in the H9. I either stick it in the loop or use it in pre/post mode and have to option to put it in front or after the HX. I'm leaning towards the loop right now and have ordered the requiste cables to make a stereo patch lead.
    Stick it in a loop then you can move it pre or post amp on a per patch basis, or ditch it all together and use the HX effects.  Tuner too for that matter :)
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  • BowksBowks Frets: 413
    John_A said:
    Bowks said:
    Vaiai said:
    @Bowks ;;
    I love that setup! I could also get away with just a Stomp in our covers band - very tempted, especially for rehearsal!
    Thanks!

    I don't think that I am going to really need a ton of effects, so for home use and messing aroung in a rehearsal room, I hope this will be adequate.

    My only consideration is how you patch in the H9. I either stick it in the loop or use it in pre/post mode and have to option to put it in front or after the HX. I'm leaning towards the loop right now and have ordered the requiste cables to make a stereo patch lead.
    Stick it in a loop then you can move it pre or post amp on a per patch basis, or ditch it all together and use the HX effects.  Tuner too for that matter :)
    There are still a few things that the Eventide does very well that merit me keeping it.

    I might ditch the tuner once I've got my head around how I'll be patch switching on the HX Stomp. I was considering a boost or drive pedal in that spot, but given that 3 of my guitars have a 20db boost built in, there's not much need for that either!

    That said, it's an easy way to add a little more grit when it's needed on the fly, as opposed to fumbling with patch editing.
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  • siremoonsiremoon Frets: 1524
    menamestom said:

    I have a helix but have realised it's amp and pedals all the way for me, although my LT is a great and invaluable tool.
    I think if I was in a cover band that needed to cover a lot of ground, which did gigs through a decent sized PA it might work. 
    But I’m in an acoustic cover band and soon a Ska cover band and really I just want my own sound.  We interpret the originals but don’t necessarily want to copy them so
    to that end just an amp and a few pedals works better.  There’s absolutely no scenario I’d need a Kings of Leon, U2 or Oasis ‘tone’.
    In fact I can safely say that I would never entertain the idea of being in your classic cover band like that, I just don’t want to be involved with anything that needs me to get a facsimile of
    somebody else’s sound.  But I can see the Helix might be a better route than pedals and amps if I did.
    I don't think most cover bands are looking for a facsimile of another sound, tribute bands maybe, but otherwise no.  What does your typical covers band play?  Maybe 25-30 songs from 20 odd different bands who each use different combinations of guitars and amps.  Do most covers band guitar players have modellers?  Not in my experience.  They will have one amp, one guitar, some effects and make do.  There's also no rule that I'm aware of that says an originals band have to use the same gear on every song they record so playing live may be a compromise anyway.

    I think many people do attempt to create a facsimile of another sound with a modeller - that of their own conventional rig.  Some are happy with the results and stick with it, some are not and create a new sound with the modeller, whilst some are not and abandon the modeller.

    I think the implicit notion that you can't get a good tone out of a modeller is no more true than the implicit notion that you can't get a bad tone out of a conventional rig.  Neither are plug and play, both need dialling in and refining.  I suspect some that give up on modellers after a day or two spent months or even years tweaking and honing their conventional rig.

    I'm glad I swapped to Helix and I use the hardware or Native for everything now.  I'm quite happy with the tones I have and the flexibility and sheer convenience means I will never go back.

    “He is like a man with a fork in a world of soup.” - Noel Gallagher
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  • NerineNerine Frets: 1971
    edited February 2019
    I have a question about the Helix. 

    I'm not sure I'd use it as an all in one solution, however I'm thinking of using it 4CM with my Dual Rectifier. 

    Basically to replace my pedalboard. 

    Is this a possibility: 

    The send from the Helix to the amp. Is it possible to route that to two outputs? 

    1. Line level to the amp so the wet signal hits the fx loop return on the amp and functions as normal. I.e. the delays/reverbs hit the power stage of the amp as usual and are then output to the power stage of the Dual Rec and then to the cabinet as normal. 

    2. Could that same signal, i.e. the send (preamp) from the amp, which is then effected with delays/reverb etc be sent to another output (simultaneously to the amp), with power amp and cabinet modelling direct to the PA?? 

    Thus eliminating the need to mic the amp? 

    So basically it'd be the tone of the amp but with a modelled back end to output through the PA, but my on stage sound would be the actual/real amp and cabinet. 

    Is that doable? Hope that makes sense. 

    Cheers. 

    EDIT:

    I also need alternate volumes. So if I hit the solo boost button, it would be useful for that to happen in the PA too. 

    Im assuming the way around that, would be to set up a separate block in the Helix to act as a line level boost. That way, when activated, it'd also increase the volume of the "modelled" output to the PA also?? 
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  • Nerine said:
    I have a question about the Helix. 

    I'm not sure I'd use it as an all in one solution, however I'm thinking of using it 4CM with my Dual Rectifier. 

    Basically to replace my pedalboard. 

    Is this a possibility: 

    The send from the Helix to the amp. Is it possible to route that to two outputs? 

    1. Line level to the amp so the wet signal hits the fx loop return on the amp and functions as normal. I.e. the delays/reverbs hit the power stage of the amp as usual and are then output to the power stage of the Dual Rec and then to the cabinet as normal. 

    2. Could that same signal, i.e. the send (preamp) from the amp, which is then effected with delays/reverb etc be sent to another output (simultaneously to the amp), with power amp and cabinet modelling direct to the PA?? 

    Thus eliminating the need to mic the amp? 

    So basically it'd be the tone of the amp but with a modelled back end to output through the PA, but my on stage sound would be the actual/real amp and cabinet. 

    Is that doable? Hope that makes sense. 

    Cheers. 

    EDIT:

    I also need alternate volumes. So if I hit the solo boost button, it would be useful for that to happen in the PA too. 

    Im assuming the way around that, would be to set up a separate block in the Helix to act as a line level boost. That way, when activated, it'd also increase the volume of the "modelled" output to the PA also?? 
    Certainly is. Although you wouldn't get power amp modelling. The way to do that is to send a separate feed from the amps slave output into it's own chain within Helix. That way you get the amp stage as well. 

    However. I've used just the preamp feed into a cab sim to the pa and it sounds immense. Tried the slave out too and didn't get much benefit to be honest. And theres more cable to set up. 

    I play guitar and take photos of stuff. I also like beans on toast.

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  • digitalscreamdigitalscream Frets: 26461
    edited February 2019
    Nerine said:
    I have a question about the Helix. 

    I'm not sure I'd use it as an all in one solution, however I'm thinking of using it 4CM with my Dual Rectifier. 

    Basically to replace my pedalboard. 

    Is this a possibility: 

    The send from the Helix to the amp. Is it possible to route that to two outputs? 

    1. Line level to the amp so the wet signal hits the fx loop return on the amp and functions as normal. I.e. the delays/reverbs hit the power stage of the amp as usual and are then output to the power stage of the Dual Rec and then to the cabinet as normal. 

    2. Could that same signal, i.e. the send (preamp) from the amp, which is then effected with delays/reverb etc be sent to another output (simultaneously to the amp), with power amp and cabinet modelling direct to the PA?? 

    Thus eliminating the need to mic the amp? 

    So basically it'd be the tone of the amp but with a modelled back end to output through the PA, but my on stage sound would be the actual/real amp and cabinet. 

    Is that doable? Hope that makes sense. 

    Cheers. 

    EDIT:

    I also need alternate volumes. So if I hit the solo boost button, it would be useful for that to happen in the PA too. 

    Im assuming the way around that, would be to set up a separate block in the Helix to act as a line level boost. That way, when activated, it'd also increase the volume of the "modelled" output to the PA also?? 
    Basically...yes. That's essentially the patch that I originally set up when I first got my Helix. Took me about 20 minutes from opening the box to figure it out - it really is remarkably easy.

    For the last bit, about the level boost, you could do that with one block or, better IMO, two blocks - one on the path to the amp's power amp and one to the PA, both engaged with a single snapshot. That way, you can have different levels of boost for each output path.

    It could be done with a single gain block before the split to the outputs, but honestly...my experience is that it might cause problems trying to balance the amp's output (which you're effectively using as a monitor) with the level at the desk.
    <space for hire>
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  • NerineNerine Frets: 1971
    Cool. Thanks chaps. 
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  • SlimbertSlimbert Frets: 335
    I made the switch to a full floor Helix a couple of weeks back and so far it's been all positive.

    I've kept a few pedals that are one offs and special to me for one reason or another but everything else has gone...including the actual pedalboard itself.

    It's made recording in my computer waaaay easier than I could've hoped and I also like knowing that whatever type of effect I need it's in there somewhere and that it'll be of a decemt quality. It's definitely the quietest rig I've ever used too.

    Not decided whether to go down the power amp route or if I'll use it with my TH30 head but either way, I know it'll sound plenty good enough and most importantly of all for a guy with one leg it's possible to lift in and out of a car without asking for help like I had to do with my old board.

    It's not equipment nirvana but, for me at least, it's been a genuine game changer. Can't see me being able to justify switching back.
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  • One big consideration when using the Helix live is how you monitor it. If you play in a band where everyone else uses real amps and cabs and you are plugging in to a possibly not so amazing PA, you will feel a little underwhelmed and underwhelming.

    if you are someone who really relays on having the amp on the stage thing as part of your vibe, plugging in to a PA won’t float your boat. 

    Personally I use a 1x12 and a Fryette Powerstation for monitoring and I think this set up is capable of getting very close to the experience of using a real amp on stage. The 
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  • John_AJohn_A Frets: 3775
    One big consideration when using the Helix live is how you monitor it. If you play in a band where everyone else uses real amps and cabs and you are plugging in to a possibly not so amazing PA, you will feel a little underwhelmed and underwhelming.

    if you are someone who really relays on having the amp on the stage thing as part of your vibe, plugging in to a PA won’t float your boat. 

    Personally I use a 1x12 and a Fryette Powerstation for monitoring and I think this set up is capable of getting very close to the experience of using a real amp on stage. The 
    Coming from a background of big valve amps and 4x12s I’ve very quickly got used to Helix coming back at me through a decent floor monitor.  Playing a lot smaller gigs these days and I think it works much better for the FOH mix not having a real amp or cab behind me
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  • JotaJota Frets: 463
    Bowks said:
    I am going to take a new approach with my HX Stomp mini board, which will be deleting all the presets and building my sounds from the ground up. 

    My idea was to get a powerful yet small setup that will spend most of its time connected to a Yamaha THR10 or a small bass amp for home playing. 

    I've seen the silly routing in a few patches and by removing them, it sounds so much better to my ears. 

    This week, I'll get stuck into making the patches I want, along with the patch cables I need!




    What power supply are you using?
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  • I’ve been swaying towards a helix recently I must say. 

    Had and some issues with pedals and a valve amp at recent gigs and struggling to get the consistency and reliability of the sound I have at our rehearsal room when I set it up somewhere else. Mainly with drives and their volume levels being all over the place.  

    Also, I’m finding more and more at gigs that I’m needing to turn the amp down so much that the back breaking weight I’m lugging around is a waste of effort and a risk. Perhaps I need a smaller low watt amp of course but I’m getting a beautiful room filling sound at praccy with the amp I’ve got.


    the biggest issue I have with the helix is the old tech shelf life thing. I’m probably wrong but I’m thinking iPhone scenario. I generally (‘have to’) upgrade my iPhone every two years when they become redundant. My current one is more expensive than the helix but in two years when my contract runs out I’ll end up recycling it for about £200 and get the next new one as it’ll be old and out of date and I’m stuck in that hole.

    For the outlay of a helix and the extra kit I would need for the rig that would keep me going I would expect that cost outlay to be a forever thing to some extent.  I just feel that in five or six years time (or maybe sooner) I’ll need to make a similar size investment. I would hope a helix would still be working after that long but surely all digital tech is vulnerable to failure after a while. 

    As are pedals of course course but you can swap and change and a good amp should last a life time with servicing etc
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