If I wanted to buy a 410 cab and head...

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prlgmnrprlgmnr Frets: 3964
Mainly for my practise room/studio but also to cover me in terms of power requirements such that I would never ever find myself in my life wanting to buy a more powerful bass amp (I just think that lots of speakers and plenty of wattage is the best way to get decent clear bass at any volume), what should I get?

Ampeg SVT410 HLF and some kind of SVT-Pro?

GK Neo 410 and whatever head, I don't really know the range?

Orange OBC410? I have an Orange 2x12 and it's a great cab.

I'd been considering Ashdown or Trace Elliot to keep the price down but @ICBM has turned me off these what with the "almost definitely will set on fire" thing.

As I'm a guitarist first, a drummer second, a vocalist third, a saxophonist fourth and a bassist soundly last I don't want to go past lets say £700-1000, so probably ruling out Mesa gear unless I find an absolute bargain.
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Comments

  • fretmeisterfretmeister Frets: 23906
    Or get a modern 2x10 that will actually shift the same amount of air as an old 4x10.

    Barefaced Two10 will do that with ease. Lightweight, very loud indeed. They come up used on Basschat sometimes too.

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  • ICBMICBM Frets: 71950
    Markbass Little Mark III head and a Barefaced cab, or Mark cab if you can't afford that.

    *Old* Trace Elliot gear is not actually that unreliable, but it weighs an absolute ton and there's really no need for that these days. Ashdown appear to be less bad now than they used to be, but I still don't trust them...

    Modern Ampeg gear isn't that good and mostly weighs too much as well.

    For what it's worth I'm using an Ibanez Promethean 500W 1x10" combo, and it's (just) loud enough to keep up with a drummer and a guitarist with a cranked Orange Rocker 30 head and a 2x12", even without using an extension cab, so I don't think the old idea of 'if you can't lift it, it can't sound any good' applies to bass gear any longer. It's true that the Promethean doesn't have the sheer thump of my old Peavey T-Max 500W 1x15", but on the other hand it weighs 26lb... not 114lb.

    "Take these three items, some WD-40, a vise grip, and a roll of duct tape. Any man worth his salt can fix almost any problem with this stuff alone." - Walt Kowalski

    "Just because I don't care, doesn't mean I don't understand." - Homer Simpson

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  • prlgmnrprlgmnr Frets: 3964
    My aversion to 1x15s and 2x10s might be more due to my band's bass player's ability to dial in a sort of blanket of sub lows that drown out all other sound while somehow simultaneously remaining inaudible rather than any actual inherent limitations.

    I hadn't heard of Barefaced and this looks like quality stuff.
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  • GrunfeldGrunfeld Frets: 4027
    edited April 2019
    prlgmnr said:
    Mainly for my practise room/studio but also to cover me in terms of power requirements such that I would never ever find myself in my life wanting to buy a more powerful bass amp (I just think that lots of speakers and plenty of wattage is the best way to get decent clear bass at any volume), what should I get?

    Ampeg SVT410 HLF and some kind of SVT-Pro?

    I have FS an Ampeg B-410HLF and Ampeg B500DR,
    £500 for the pair.  (+ delivery cost).  (Was my son's rig before he moved to the States and asked me to sell it.  I'm seriously tired of looking at it).
    The amp is totally fine, the cab is too actually -- although the tweeter went in it but sound-wise made no significant difference so I didn't replace (it's not an expensive fix though).
    Plenty loud enough for a practice room and gigs.  And, genuine judgement although subjective, I think Ampeg just sounds distinctive.
    Amp is in a 1u rack case so has been well-protected and is in good cosmetic condition too; cab is gigged but in fairly good cosmetic condition because has a heavy duty vinyl cover.
    Biggest hassle, if you were interested, is logistics as I'm in London.  But all do-able.
    I really keep meaning to put this FS on Basschat.
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  • ICBMICBM Frets: 71950
    prlgmnr said:
    My aversion to 1x15s and 2x10s might be more due to my band's bass player's ability to dial in a sort of blanket of sub lows that drown out all other sound while somehow simultaneously remaining inaudible rather than any actual inherent limitations.
    Sounds like an EQ set-up error. Probably too much deep lows and not enough mids. I like a fairly scooped bass tone too, because it keeps out of the way of the guitars, but you can definitely overdo it.

    "Take these three items, some WD-40, a vise grip, and a roll of duct tape. Any man worth his salt can fix almost any problem with this stuff alone." - Walt Kowalski

    "Just because I don't care, doesn't mean I don't understand." - Homer Simpson

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  • FunkfingersFunkfingers Frets: 14320
    ICBM said:
    Sounds like an EQ set-up error. Probably too much deep lows and not enough mids. 
    Could even be from any onboard active EQ in the bass guitar itself.

    prlgmnr said:
    My aversion to 1x15s and 2x10s might be more due to my band's bass player's ability to dial in a sort of blanket of sub lows that drown out all other sound while somehow simultaneously remaining inaudible rather than any actual inherent limitations.
    I suspect that your bass player has fallen into the trap of dialling in a sound that seems full for home/solitary practice and simply turning up louder for stage sound pressure levels rather than tweaking to sit in a full band mix. 
    Be seeing you.
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  • fretmeisterfretmeister Frets: 23906
    ICBM said:
    prlgmnr said:
    My aversion to 1x15s and 2x10s might be more due to my band's bass player's ability to dial in a sort of blanket of sub lows that drown out all other sound while somehow simultaneously remaining inaudible rather than any actual inherent limitations.
    Sounds like an EQ set-up error. Probably too much deep lows and not enough mids. I like a fairly scooped bass tone too, because it keeps out of the way of the guitars, but you can definitely overdo it.
    It's probably more because mixing 15s and 10s together has always been an EQ compromise.

    It was a shit idea when it first came out, and now it's even worse. 
    Find the speaker you like and if you want more - add more of the same. Don't expect more of what you like by adding something different. That's just crazy talk.
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  • ICBMICBM Frets: 71950
    edited April 2019
    fretmeister said:

    It's probably more because mixing 15s and 10s together has always been an EQ compromise.

    It was a shit idea when it first came out, and now it's even worse. 
    Find the speaker you like and if you want more - add more of the same. Don't expect more of what you like by adding something different. That's just crazy talk.
    I don't think so at all.

    I had a Mesa 'Powerhouse' cab once that had a 15", a 10", two 6"s and a horn - and no crossover, except for the horn. They just allowed the natural frequency responses to work together, and it sounded absolutely massive - full-range without being too hi-fi. Unfortunately it was also about the size and weight of an office block, and with the world's most uncomfortable side handles.

    I also had a Trace Elliot stack with a 1x15" cab and a 2x10"+2x5" cab that was nice. The small cab had an internal crossover for the 5s, but both cabs were run in parallel from the amp.

    I'm currently thinking of getting a lightweight 1x15" to go with my 1x10" combo.

    "Take these three items, some WD-40, a vise grip, and a roll of duct tape. Any man worth his salt can fix almost any problem with this stuff alone." - Walt Kowalski

    "Just because I don't care, doesn't mean I don't understand." - Homer Simpson

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  • jpfampsjpfamps Frets: 2723
    Grunfeld said:
    prlgmnr said:
    Mainly for my practise room/studio but also to cover me in terms of power requirements such that I would never ever find myself in my life wanting to buy a more powerful bass amp (I just think that lots of speakers and plenty of wattage is the best way to get decent clear bass at any volume), what should I get?

    Ampeg SVT410 HLF and some kind of SVT-Pro?


    The amp is totally fine, the cab is too actually -- although the tweeter went in it but sound-wise made no significant difference so I didn't replace (it's not an expensive fix though).

    You mean made a significant improvement.....
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  • pintspillerpintspiller Frets: 994
    I use a Hartke Transporter 410 that cost me £120 used. Heavy as be-damned though when I carry it upstairs after a gig. With a Sound City 50+ head. I think they cost about £350 these days. Plenty of headroom and probably as loud as 200w solid state. I don't play any louder that 5 at gigs.
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  • MattBansheeMattBanshee Frets: 1498
    Not a 4x10 recommendation, but I have an Ashdown compact 1x12 bass cab that I put an Eminence 400W speaker in. Total cost ~£150 (cab used, speaker brand new). Paired with an Ampeg PF350 head, it easily competes in the mix with a loud grunge band in the studio, and is almost excessive for gigs. It's a 1-handed carry too, and easily fits in the boot of the car.
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  • MattBansheeMattBanshee Frets: 1498
    I use a Hartke Transporter 410 that cost me £120 used. Heavy as be-damned though when I carry it upstairs after a gig. With a Sound City 50+ head. I think they cost about £350 these days. Plenty of headroom and probably as loud as 200w solid state. I don't play any louder that 5 at gigs.
    My dad has a Sound City 120 mk5 in the garage somewhere. I keep meaning to requisition it for bass duties.
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  • bassborabassbora Frets: 132
    Late to the party but I would defo give the 4*10 idea a miss.  I have been using Bergantino 2*12 with Mesa Subway D800 and I have never run out of volume.  

    If I was doing it again I would probably have two 1*12 so you can scale up if you need two cabs.  There are so many brands out there today and usually quite good.

    As for amps its all down to personal taste and I am not going into valve vs solid state arguments or class D because personally I dont care.  I use the gear to play music and no one in the audience cares really how I sound like as long as they are moved by the groove.  But I would go with a decent light amp as well.
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