On stage monitoring

smigeon

I've posted a bit on here about my ongoing trials and tribulations in attempting to hear myself properly on stage as a singer and guitarist with a lively pub rock band. I'm one of those folks who need to hear myself very clearly to pitch properly and to put expression into my singing. And I need to hear my guitar clearly even when the sound man tells me to turn down :-).

In the last couple of years the band has played a series of summer festivals with venue provided PA and foldback, and I've *never* been happy with the monitoring in these situations - despite the fact that the sound guy invariably says "no problem - you'll certainly hear yourself with my gear and my mixing expertise". 

A couple of years ago I flirted with In Ear Monitors. I could hear myself beautifully, but the downside was that I felt disconnected from the rest of the band and we seemed to lose energy.

So, this year, I tried a different approach. My setup is as shown in the photo (sorry photo is sideways on :-/):

https://www.dropbox.com/s/rplyyqjmy4uwcgx/beh.jpg?raw=1

Essentially, I use one channel of s cheap 2-channel splitter box ("IMG Stage Line 25.1680 2-Channel 3-Way Line Splitter") to feed my vocal mic simultaneously to the desk and to my personal stage monitor ("Behringer Eurolive B2015D"). And, using the other channel of the splitter box, I do exactly the same thing with the signal from my (DI'd) guitar amp. The two feeds (voice and guitar) each have their own separate channels in the Behringer so they can be mixed to taste for local monitoring.

In the photo, the feed from my vocal mic to the splitter box is via the orange coloured lead.

With this simple setup I have total local control of my vocal and my guitar in the little Behringer - which, as you can see, is mounted on a stand close to my mic stand (and hence my ears). The Behringer is cheap but surprisingly capable, and I can hear my vocal and guitar with perfect clarity no matter how loud the band gets or how crap the PA and sound guy are :-). I was skeptical when I got the Behringer that it would be loud enough for a festival stage; but it's always been fine - very impressive for the low cost. And I am completely independent of the desk/sound guy, and have full EQ control and (as mentioned) dedicated channels for vocal and guitar. In fact there is a third channel which I could use for a monitor mix from the desk, but I've never actually felt the need for this. And the setup is simple enough that I can comfortably handle the super-quick turnaround times you get at these festivals.

I really feel I've cracked monitoring with this setup - it's both effective and cheap - and thought I'd share. Of course it's no doubt not for everyone, but for my use case, it just works!

Musicwolf

I bought one a few years ago (Behringer B205D).  I was expecting it to sound like shit but it really cuts through the mix.  Our drummer uses it these days as I've got a better monitor, although I usually use in-ears.  Doesn't take up much space in the car either.

uncledick

Looks like a decent plan.  Our local venues wouldn't have room for that.  I have to put my pedals on top of the amp as it is.

 We were actually asked to play a festival last week:  "Can you do 7 - 8.30?"  "Yeah no problem, does that include set up time?" "Oh I don't know."  "Do we need our own PA?"  "Not sure - you'd better bring one."  "It's an outdoor gig, is the stage under a shelter?"  "No need, the forecast isn't bad!"  Then the organiser found that he'd told all his staff the wrong date, so there was no-one to run the bar or anything else. 

You couldn't make it up...

smigeon

Yeah, that ^ seems about the standard level of organisation for these events :-). A major reason why the 100%-under-your-own-control vocal/guitar self-monitoring is so attractive.

@Musicwolf: yes - the Behringer B205D was a real surprise package for me. I learned about them from a thread on here, actually: http://www.thefretboard.co.uk/discussion/124937/. The thing is that you can actually hear them clearly in almost every circumstance (at least I've never yet encountered one where you couldn't). In isolation, they don't necessarily sound so great, and the bass end soon farts out, but in context that doesn't matter (turn the bass down, cos all you need is mids), and they are audible, controllable and positively pleasant-sounding.  What did you replace yours with? And do you still use it on a stand, or on the floor?

But I'm equally enthusiastic about the IMG line splitter box. I was surprised that you can so easily split a mic signal (and guitar amp DI signal) with a passive device: one branch locally to the Behringer, the other branch off to the desk. In practice, there doesn't seem to be any degradation. Maybe the gain at the desk needs to be slightly higher, but there's really no perceptible loss.

Jalapeno

Piano player in the 8-piece jazz band I'm in uses one as his main amp. 

Amazed at the robustness and volume these little fellers can pump out. I've used one at rehearsals for vocals instead of a PA, perhaps a bit tinny, but would certainly cut-through and be great as a personal foldback monitor.

Musicwolf

smigeon said:

.  What did you replace yours with? And do you still use it on a stand, or on the floor?

I bought one of these https://www.thomann.de/gb/the_box_pro_mon_a10.htm  which sounds ok (and the wedge angle means that you don't need to have it 4 feet in front of you).  I now have an AltoTS210 to give my Kemper / Helix some stage vol and I use in ears so both the Behringer and the Mon 10A are almost surplus to requirement.  The Behringer is easy enough carry and it allows the drummer to hear the vocals.  I have a short tripod but often it will end up on a table if we're crammed into the corner of a pub.

smigeon

Sorry for all the questions, @Musicwolf, but what "short tripod" did/do you use? I am using the smallest K&M mic stand I could find, but annoyingly it's still too long folded to fit inside my cables bag.

I'd be delighted if I could find a more portable stand.  

Musicwolf

https://www.thomann.de/gb/millenium_ms2002.htm

p90fool

We've used a pair of those Behringers for years, just dotted around for whoever wants them, they're excellent. 

Nikc

I was thinking about buying one of those - cheers for that