Is Mayer overrated?

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  • thegummythegummy Frets: 4389
    It's truly pointless trying to come up with ways for music to be measured objectively in any way. The only thing with any meaning at all is whether an individual person enjoys listening to it.

    My answer to the question is that he's underrated because he's one of my favourite musicians but not generally considered one of the best musicians of all time. For others who don't really like his music he's overrated because a lot of people speak highly of him. Neither mean anything as a general statement or are useful in any way.

    It's the reason music critics would be completely useless in theory even if there weren't other things also making them bad.

    I think the only useful reason to talk about music you like is as a recommendation to others who might never have heard of it. I don't know if I can think of any reason to ever talk about music you don't like - can anyone think of a reason for that?
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  • StavrosStavros Frets: 328
    thegummy said:

    I don't know if I can think of any reason to ever talk about music you don't like - can anyone think of a reason for that?
    Ermm, because I don’t like it?  :)
    I love my brick
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  • gusman2xgusman2x Frets: 919
    He's made two genuinely fantastic records. Anyone that can do that once in a lifetime is a success in my book. And he got feel in his playing in abundance. 
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  • ToneControlToneControl Frets: 11791
    edited August 2019
    Gulliver said:
    The live DVD Where the Light Is is I think testament to why JM isn't overrated...   He does solo acoustic, blues trio and large pop band sets in one show.   All of which are excellent. 

    His acoustic technique is phenomenal, his blues phrasing outstanding, and writes really excellent songs.

    Also - the main riff to this makes me want to touch myself:  

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CzliomTo8S0
    the DVD is very strong evidence. How many stars could do those 3 sets?

    The "new" thing for SRV was the big fat clean twangy strat sound and energetic playing
    The "new" thing for JM is the subtle stuff. I've learned a few bits, and the solos need a lot more of a touch-sensitive subtle technical approach than other stars I can think of
    The other new thing is the songwriting and singing. Name a famous guitarist who can sing and play at a top level, and in those styles, not a frequent combination. 
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  • Winny_PoohWinny_Pooh Frets: 7735
    Danny1969 said:
    I think he's incredibly skilled .... try playing Heart of Life or Stop this Train with the effortless technique he does and then sing flawlessly over the top. 
    Personally I find Hendrix, Clapton and SRV over rated in comparison and I'm not even a JM fan .....just someone who knows what he's actually doing on some songs and how difficult it is !
    Hendrix overrated? The person who has the largest share of credit for inventing the modern guitar vocabulary? You don't have a clue.
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  • HAL9000HAL9000 Frets: 9552
    edited August 2019
    Barnezy said:
    I got really in to Mayer about a year ago. He does some good pop songs but the more I listened to him the more I realised he was just ripping off others. Jimmy Hendrix, SRV mostly, I've even heard Pearl Jam in one of his songs.

    My point is, can you really be a great if you haven't bought anything new?
    Aren’t most musicians the sum of their influences though? Even the greats? Sure, they might play their own take on things but essentially...

    Barnezy said:
    TINMAN82 said:
    This is just Clapton trying to be relevant so he can sell another Blues cover album before he pops his clogs. It's like when Elton did that song with Westlife.
    I disagree. I certainly think there was a time when Clapton was an idiot and probably not a particularly pleasant person. These days, however, I think he is changed person and someone who is brutally honest. (All IMHO of course.)


    I play guitar because I enjoy it rather than because I’m any good at it
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  • thegummythegummy Frets: 4389
    Danny1969 said:
    I think he's incredibly skilled .... try playing Heart of Life or Stop this Train with the effortless technique he does and then sing flawlessly over the top. 
    Personally I find Hendrix, Clapton and SRV over rated in comparison and I'm not even a JM fan .....just someone who knows what he's actually doing on some songs and how difficult it is !
    Hendrix overrated? The person who has the largest share of credit for inventing the modern guitar vocabulary? You don't have a clue.
    Or has a different, but exactly equal, opinion to yours.
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  • menamestommenamestom Frets: 4641
    Barnezy said:
    Danny1969 said:
    I think he's incredibly skilled .... try playing Heart of Life or Stop this Train with the effortless technique he does and then sing flawlessly over the top. 
    Personally I find Hendrix, Clapton and SRV over rated in comparison and I'm not even a JM fan .....just someone who knows what he's actually doing on some songs and how difficult it is !
    Is he as skilled as these guys? 


    Apples and oranges really.

    Maybe you need to hear Tommy Emmanuel playing John Mayer to appreciate how good John Mayer is.

    I'm not even a massive fan of JM, and having loved SRV when I was younger, I'm now much less interested in the texas blues thang.  But Mayer has managed to use those skills for his own style and has put some beautiful guitar pieces together - instantly recognisable, original compositions.  These sound nothing like Hendrix, SRV, Clapton etc.


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  • soma1975soma1975 Frets: 6627
    edited August 2019
    It's not a different but equal opinion. It's a different but absurd opinion completely ignoring all the facts. Whether you like his music or not is irrelevant. 

    Absolutely winds me up when people say Hendrix is overrated. 

    He is to electric guitar and rock music what James Brown is to soul. What Chuck D or Dr Dre (or insert name here) is to hip hop. What the Beatles are to pop music. 

    It really doesn't matter if the twat out of Dragonforce can play faster. mph is not the sum total of someone's ability to change the entire musical landscape and world of possibilities for your instrument.

    I know we are supposed to say in this day and age everyone is entitled to an opinion but that doesn't mean we can't state their opinion is sillybilly and ignore just about everything else they have to say. 

    And don't get me started on people who say the Beatles are overrated!
    My Trade Feedback Thread is here

    Been uploading old tracks I recorded ages ago and hopefully some new noodles here.
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  • stickyfiddlestickyfiddle Frets: 26754
    Its songwriting that really does it, far more than just guitar licks or technical ability.

    It is - when at its best - some of the best of the last 20 years. *That* is the thing that elevates him way above his peers. Because people want to listen to songs more than anything else. I always find musicians’ obsession with just listening for guitar parts or drum lines (rather than whole pieces of music) to be quite odd.

    And there’s doubting that Slow Dancing in a Burning Room has made it as a guitar shop staple - the modern touchpoint for “Strat tone” 
    The Assumptions - UAE party band for all your rock & soul desires
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  • FunkfingersFunkfingers Frets: 14324
    Everyone is overated.
    Be seeing you.
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  • JalapenoJalapeno Frets: 6378
    Everyone is overated.
    Or even underrated.

    No strong opinion on JM, I think he's fine.  I find his overly emotive singing voice a bit wearing. However this album is great IMHO


    Imagine something sharp and witty here ......

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  • BarnezyBarnezy Frets: 2175
    edited August 2019
    It's not that I don't agree Mayer is a great player l just dont believe he deserves the status people like Clapton, BB King, Page, Gilmour, SRV get, as in my opinion he's not an innovator. He plays nice pop songs well that teenage girls like and guitar heads appreciate and feel familiar with. 

    Even though he's no where near as skilled as Mayer, I'd argue even Cobain's playing is more influential and deffinately more original than Mayer's stuff.

    Those who say there's no where else to go with guitar, need to change up their Spoitfy playlists a bit. 

    The fact Mayer doesn't appear in any of the respected top guitarist lists, might suggest he's not overrated by critics, perhaps only by his fans.

    Anyway I'm off to listen to Daughters again to see what it is I must be missing.




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  • BarnezyBarnezy Frets: 2175
    Jalapeno said:
    Everyone is overated.
    Or even underrated.

    No strong opinion on JM, I think he's fine.  I find his overly emotive singing voice a bit wearing. However this album is great IMHO


    He even dresses like SRV.... Mayer be your own person! 

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  • Paul31Paul31 Frets: 22
    edited August 2019
    Everyone is overated.

    I think every guitarist sould maybe look at things this way abit, even Jimi when interviewed once and asked maybe the best guitarist he stated he is the best one sitting in this chair.

    I for one never understand the so and so is better than arguement, music is not a sport and of course very subjective and down to taste just my twopennth.
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  • Musicman20Musicman20 Frets: 2296
    I don't really ever listen to an album because of one good guitarist. I also don't listen to blues. So I am definitely not te target audience.

    I see the guitar as a band instrument first and foremost, adding to a whole unit and not being the standout instrument. 

    My guitar 'heros' are usually what people class as anti-heroes. I find Josh Homme much more interesting to listen to than this kinda stuff.

    He is clearly very talented. The Silver Sky is also pretty damn cool. 
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  • merlinmerlin Frets: 6598
    edited August 2019
    I once toured Europe with three Hungarian Roma (Gypsy) musicians. In the back of the van one day, one of the  fiddlers, called Elemer turned to me and said; 

    "Merlin. Beatles. Not good musicians. Why famous?"

    Made even funnier by the fact that Hungarians pronounce "Beatles" as "Beet Lees".  
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  • RaymondLinRaymondLin Frets: 11814
    It is so much easier to critique than to create. 
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  • LewyLewy Frets: 4127
    Barnezy said:
    It's not that I don't agree Mayer is a great player l just dont believe he deserves the status people like Clapton, BB King, Page, Gilmour, SRV get, as in my opinion he's not an innovator. He plays nice pop songs well that teenage girls like and guitar heads appreciate and feel familiar with. 
    But where are the people that are bestowing that status on him? Most of the audiences who pack out stadiums to see him and buy his records aren't in the slightest bit interested in comparison to other guitar heroes, and those that are all seem to say exactly the same thing...great songs, great player, synthesises the styles of others to support his music etc etc. No worship as any sort of guitar innovator.

    The whole premise of him being overrated seems to have a whiff of the straw man about it to me.
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  • SimonCSimonC Frets: 1391
    I don’t know whether JM is or any other guitarist is overrated or not.
    To me it really is a nonsense term, where are the “ratings charts”, who are the “raters” and what points system or criteria do they use?
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