Write Song then Produce Record vs. Produce as You Go

thegummy

Traditionally someone would write a song, possibly on a guitar or piano, and the song would exist as a sheet of lyrics, melody and chords. Then when it's time to record it they would go on to get a producer involved and they'd decide what instrumentation would be used, how the intro will work, what overdubs and decoration etc. will be added. It might not even involve the guitar or piano that it was written with.

Now with modern studios, especially home DAW-based studios, it's possible for people to write songs using these and actually produce as they go along. They might have already put together the intro and engineered it before writing all the lyrics.

So what do you think are the pros and cons of each approach?

If you make records with a DAW-based home studio, do you write the song first and have it in a bare bones state and then think about producing it or do you just write the record as you go along, engineering it along the way?

I think an advantage of the old way could be that it makes sure the song itself is strong as a raw song and doesn't rely on any gimmicks for strength. Then again, with the other way, hearing the fully processed rhythm section and the likes could be very inspirational when writing the rest of it.

guitarfishbay

Bit of both.

Write it barebones, then work on the aesthetic. Record it, then flesh it out further during the creative flow. 

I find if if I hit the DAW too soon I get too distracted by tones, when what works best for me is to start with the song and choose tones to fit. Sometimes tones can lead you somewhere interesting and new, but I find I do best if there’s a solid foundation first 

thegummy

guitarfishbay said:

Bit of both.

Write it barebones, then work on the aesthetic. Record it, then flesh it out further during the creative flow. 

I find if if I hit the DAW too soon I get too distracted by tones, when what works best for me is to start with the song and choose tones to fit. Sometimes tones can lead you somewhere interesting and new, but I find I do best if there’s a solid foundation first 

Totally know what you mean there.

I think I might start writing bare bones for that reason. What you say is a good point, there's nothing stopping me adding to it once the production starts but it does seem like a useful idea to do it bare bones at least as a start.

Grangousier

Something I've been doing recently is finding a nice idea and then literally improvising it into Logic, with the follow tempo thing turned on. Because I'm essentially noodling, there'll often be bits in almost random time signatures, which I commit myself to working out and following. Then I add a Drummer track and all the other instruments. I'm not sure that it's good, as such, but it's a lot of fun, and almost the most liberating recording experience I've had. 

Danny1969

I've made the mistake in the past of having a very bare bones idea and been in too much of a hurry to get tracking which led to a pretty weak song. Nowadays's I work it out on an acoustic guitar and keen refining it until the arrangement and lyrics and pretty much there before I hit record.

Ultimately I think the way the melody moves across the chord changes is 90% of the song. If that works and sounds good with just an acoustic guitar and a vocal then it's time to get tracking. Never being too precious to stop, change tempo or change the key if it helps the song. 

One of the problems you can end up with when you produce and play everything yourself is it's all too "You!" Working with others and their input is priceless, even if you don't like their ideas at first. I've mixed a lot of stuff done by people entirely at home on their own and ultimately they end up with something they are 100% happy with that's not so palatable to anyone else. 
Being able to let someone else actually produce a song is probably the biggest difference between amateur and professional musicians  \ bands 

Funkfingers

If a song has substance, it will survive different instrumentation arrangements.

The ultimate goal is to provide a suitable setting for the vocalist on the recording.

Sometimes, the typical guitar, bass, drums, keyboards ensemble answers that brief. Sometimes, it needs to be an orchestra. 

From the perspective of a home recordist composer, think of your own recording as a demonstration. Get the core ideas down. Leave room for arrangers and/or first call session musicians to “make it their own”. Leave somebody else to do (and finance) the promotion. Sit back and await your royalty cheques.

Musicwolf

Funkfingers said:

If a song has substance, it will survive different instrumentation arrangements.

The ultimate goal is to provide a suitable setting for the vocalist on the recording.

This, with the addendum that if the song is not strong enough then after a while the production glitter will wear off exposing the musical turn that lies beneath.

You can work either way.  Sometimes I develop the whole song on one guitar, sometimes I layer as I go, quite often I'll take a complete track then strip it all back and start again.  Whichever way I go, at the end of the process I can usually pick up an acoustic guitar or sit at a piano and play the song and the good songs will hold their own.

thecolourbox

I treat anything I record at home as a draft even if I consider it "finished", as Mr Funkfingers said, as I do not have the gravitas to fully draw a line under it as the best it could ever be.

But that said, I write/arrange with two methods and neither includes the DAW or what not. I either write it on piano then when it's decent I think about a cover version of it on guitars and full band etc, or I imagine it in my head and try to approximate it when it's ready 

I have struggles every time I try to use cubase as there always seems to be an update required or a new driver or whatever, so I avoid going there until I'm absolutely ready to do so. Then I add way too much reverb and ruin it all

IMC1980

I like to be able to play the whole song on an acoustic before I record anything, but that doesn't always happen. It is amazing being able to record and produce a track in my spare room, but also a very time intensive process that has highs (recording, creating) and lows (editing, making changes that no one who is not you can even hear). I do love it though, very cool hobby to have!