Buying a van

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John_PJohn_P Frets: 2744
In the next few months I’m looking to buy a van - I need to carry a lot of PA gear so I need a medium or long wheel base.    Probably under £7k (way under would be better of course).   

I was thinking for the ease of parts a transit would top the list any tips or suggestions would be appreciated.  
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  • SRichSRich Frets: 762
    Don’t buy French......Renault / Peugeot / Citroen.......you’ll be tempted on price but f me, you’ll need to know the way to your repairer.

    "There's things I want, there's things I think I want 
    There's things I've had, there's things I wanna have" 
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  • Transit all the way, only problem is they rust!
    www.maltingsaudio.co.uk
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  • John_PJohn_P Frets: 2744
    SRich said:
    Don’t buy French......Renault / Peugeot / Citroen.......you’ll be tempted on price but f me, you’ll need to know the way to your repairer.
    A mate has the Peugeot boxer (same van by fiat and Citroen) that looks good but reliability is very high on the priority list.  
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  • EricTheWearyEricTheWeary Frets: 16253
    Peugeot/ Citroen/ Fiat have come out the same factories in Poland for many years ( they are the basis for ambulances, most motorhomes,etc, so parts are common enough even if you don’t often see them driven as works vans ) and Renault have been joint designs with Nissan for many years and you see them by the thousand across Europe. Iveco owned by Fiat, I think still made in Italy, and the king of heavier duty vehicles. VW and Mercedes will be expensive and expensive to maintain although older Mercedes seem to keep going for ever. I’ve never heard a nice thing about a Toyota van. 
    Transits will be the commonest and for older vehicles probably the most car like to drive compared to the competition. They can be rust buckets and a piece of piss to break into so be as choosey as you can. 
    Obviously make sure your licence covers you to drive the Maximum Authorised Mass/ Gross Vehicle Weight. Not unknown for people to buy a vehicle only to find they can’t legally drive it. 
    Tipton is a small fishing village in the borough of Sandwell. 
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  • TeyeplayerTeyeplayer Frets: 3132
    Modern transits are not what they were; from the problems a friend has experienced, best avoided. I couldn’t list the details, but it’s a list as long as his arm. 

    Iveco are definitely worth considering and are considered reliable afaik.
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  • HootsmonHootsmon Frets: 15924
    Avalon sunset is a good place to start
    tae be or not tae be
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  • m_cm_c Frets: 1211
    In that budget range, you should be able to get something reasonable.

    However, are you looking for a full size van (aka Transit/Sprinter size), or something smaller (Transit Custom/VW Transporter)?
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  • John_PJohn_P Frets: 2744
    m_c said:
    In that budget range, you should be able to get something reasonable.

    However, are you looking for a full size van (aka Transit/Sprinter size), or something smaller (Transit Custom/VW Transporter)?
    Yes a medium or long wheel base.   I see a lot of sprinters on the road but assume they will have higher maintenance costs.  I’ve had several vw’s as campers but only as modern as a T4 and I’d need something bigger - not sure if the crafter is a good compromise.  
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  • Danny1969Danny1969 Frets: 10357
    Well in addition to long wheelbase get a high top ... nothing worse than crouching while loading. The bigger the van the less weight you can carry .... because it's 3.5 ton gross total and that includes the weight of the van it's self, the diesel, your weight ect. For this reason a long wheel based rear wheel drive high top van has the worse load carry capacity. A short wheel based low top front wheel drive van will have the highest payload. Front wheeled drive vans don't have a prop shaft or a rear axle with half shafts so are lighter. 
    If you need to carry more weight than a  3.5T gross van then there are options but they are thinner on the ground and have to be tacho'ed etc. My own van is a 4.2 Ton Transit Jumbo which can take a payload of over 2 tons

    A lot of vans share the same engines these days but I've found the older engines to be more reliable simply because they don't don't have endless eco features. I've had various vans but mainly Transits because they are the cheapest van to maintain in terms of buying parts. My personal pick would be an older MK6 with the 130HP 2.2 TDCI and 6 speed box. 
    www.2020studios.co.uk 
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  • m_cm_c Frets: 1211
    So full size.

    Sprinters are the most reliable provided they've been looked after. Given pre-conceptions, spare prices aren't any different from anything else. The older engines are the more reliable of the options, as the new one, although not really unreliable, can have issues that are time consuming to fix (inlet manifold/gasket blows, but it's a 6+hr job), EGR cooler bypass valve leaks (IIRC about 4-5hr book time), but the basic mechanics are sound.

    VW Crafter. Sprinter body/running gear, with a rubbish engine in comparison to the Sprinter, and a horrendous dashboard compared with the Sprinter. Biggest issue is if anything does go wrong, VW specialist can't handle the Merc body electrics, and Merc specialists ate working on the VW engine. They are however a lot cheaper than an equivalent age/condition Sprinter.
    Both of the above will rust though.

    Transits are pretty good. I'd only go for the 2014 onwards though, as they don't disintegrate with rust like previous models. 2.2 is OK. EGR valves are much improved on the later incarnations of the engine, but still like to go through fuel vaporisers for the DPF.
    Reliability wise, the newer 2.0 is proving to have far less issues so far, but it does have a wet timing belt (due at 10yr/150k, but book time is 8-9hrs), however most 2.2s will probably need a timing chain by that mileage anyway.

    Renault Master/Vauxhall Movano/Nissan whatever are typical French vans. Do the job. Are cheap to buy. Are reasonably reliable, but gearboxes are pretty weak, and other things are very likely to give lots of niggly issues once they age. Internals always feel cheap. Door handles are likely to break regularly. Roller doors will fall off at some point.

    Fiat Ducato. Cheap. Gearboxes are also pretty poor. We've seen an increase in engines going bang lately, despite them usually being pretty reliable. Looms like to corrode causing issues with various electrics.

    Peugeot Boxer/Citreon Relay. Fiat Ducato with a Transit engine. Still got the electric/gearbox issues, but at least the engine is less likely to have French niggles.



    One major consideration for any vehicle is spares availability. Merc/VW/Ford understand this. It is very rare you'll struggle to get parts for their vans, whereas all the rest can be horrendous. It's not uncommon to wait over a week for Fiat/Peugeot/Renault for what are relatively common parts.
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  • RiftAmpsRiftAmps Frets: 3113
    edited January 2020 tFB Trader
    Can’t speak for all makes/models but in a past life I worked for both Peugeot and Ford. Transits were by far the most reliable except most had either stretched or snapped their timing chains by 100k. Most Pugs barely made it off the forecourt.

    I currently have a 2004 Vivaro 1.9 that with a reasonable amount of preventative maintenance is a good runner. All commercial vehicles are run hard so require a little more TLC than your car. I don’t overdo it but I keep on top of things and it quite happily runs about all day without a hiccup.
    *I no longer offer replacement speaker baffles*
    Rift Amplification
    Handwired Guitar Amplifiers
    Brackley, Northamptonshire
    www.riftamps.co.uk

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  • robgilmorobgilmo Frets: 3359
    Get an Iveco, seriously, I cant believe anyone would even consider a Transit. ive yet to see one that isn't a rust bucket or on its way to become one, almost as bad as Mercs. We are forever welding up Fords. 
    A Deuce , a Tele and a cup of tea.
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  • SRichSRich Frets: 762
    robgilmo said:
    Get an Iveco, seriously awful..... 
    Fixed that for you then....... ;)

    "There's things I want, there's things I think I want 
    There's things I've had, there's things I wanna have" 
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  • Danny1969Danny1969 Frets: 10357
    robgilmo said:
    Get an Iveco, seriously, I cant believe anyone would even consider a Transit. ive yet to see one that isn't a rust bucket or on its way to become one, almost as bad as Mercs. We are forever welding up Fords. 
    250K  plus on mine, only ever done pads, couple of brake pipes and changed the handbrake cable in 10 years. Never failed MOT on welding despite being nearly 15 years old 
    www.2020studios.co.uk 
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  • m_cm_c Frets: 1211
    robgilmo said:
    Get an Iveco, seriously, I cant believe anyone would even consider a Transit. ive yet to see one that isn't a rust bucket or on its way to become one, almost as bad as Mercs. We are forever welding up Fords. 
    Iveco's just rust in a not so noticeable way. We had to scrap two ten year old ones last year, after the body mounts rusted and collapsed, causing the propshafts to rub on body cross members.
    That took two new propshaft bearings, followed by lots of questions as to if the person had put the bearing spacers back in the right place, before somebody noticed the body was resting on the chassis rails...

    The big issue with Iveco's, is they're a heavy van. That's OK if you're willing to go over the 3.5t license limitation, but they're not as reliable as they were. 3.5t axle is rubbish, and we had 2 with engine issues last year. One at 70'000km losing oil pressure once warmed up, and despite new oil pump, filter housing, and checking for any other obvious issues, it was put down to excess engine wear.
    Another was done under warranty at 30'000km, after the timing jumped wiping out the valves, which one dealer let slip was a common failure, and Iveco were just supplying new engines for any that failed.
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  • skunkwerxskunkwerx Frets: 6838
    Used to drive modified Citroen's, Peugeots and renaults, all the biggest wheelbase and roof height. They were patient transport and secure ambulances so had all the gubbins and cells in the back. 

    We ragged them. And I mean fucking ragged them. 

    Surprisingly they never broke down on a shift, and most shifts were 60+ miles away out of Brighton and Hove.

    Had a lot of capers in them old vans. 


    The only easy day, was yesterday...
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  • BudgieBudgie Frets: 2099
    robgilmo said:
    Get an Iveco, seriously, I cant believe anyone would even consider a Transit. ive yet to see one that isn't a rust bucket or on its way to become one, almost as bad as Mercs. We are forever welding up Fords. 
    This. I’ve had two of them. The first literally fell apart with rust. Mechanically it was sort of okay but everything else was astonishingly bad. The second (yup, I was stupid enough to buy another) was unbelievably bad. Riddled with electrical problems and completely unreliable. It also rusted itself to oblivion. I was almost relieved when a completely inept mechanic managed to destroy the engine. My mate has a Transit custom... again, it’s woefully bad and spends more time in the garage with all sorts of electrical issues. I used to have a Vivaro and despite the gearbox having a bad reputation, it was really reliable. I currently have a VW T5.1, which is pretty decent. 
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  • RockerRocker Frets: 4947
    What about SUV type of vehicle plus a decent trailer?  
    Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results. [Albert Einstein]

    Nil Satis Nisi Optimum

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  • We've had a Trafic, a Master and an Iveco at work. Of the three I think I preferred the Master.

    The side door didn't fall off the Trafic until we had it five years. Then a year later. 
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  • John_PJohn_P Frets: 2744
    Rocker said:
    What about SUV type of vehicle plus a decent trailer?  
    That I what I use now - a Toyota hilux and a trailer but I would either need a much bigger trailer or switch to a van and it will be a lot easier to just have a van for loading as I’ll use ramps and wheel stacks and flight cases in.   
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