What equipment do I need to start a simple high quality recording setup?

lukedlb

Not knowing even how to begin with DAW recording, I have intentionally prevented myself from growing as a musician. A close friend in Cyprus has asked me to play instruments on his songs. It's a great opportunity to support a friend and it will push me back into producing music rather than 'reproducing' music.

I don't know what I'm doing so I could really do with your advice, with some specific brand and models.

I will supply: acoustic and electric guitar, piano, hammond organ (clone) and harmonica. Both the piano and hammond clone have audio stereo out 1/4” jack. I plan to create the ‘backing track’ to a click track for him to sing over or add his own guitar/harmonica. He uses Garageband although I plan to push him to use the same software as me.

I play (and will record) in a small 4m2 cellar with a low brick vaulted ceiling and some limited foam soundproofing. I have a selection of amps from the 60s and 70s and a recent Redplate rp50r. My speaker and cab choice is fundamental to my sound so everything will need to be mic’d. I will be recording one instrument at a time.

Piano: technics p-30 (digital reverb)

Organ: hamichord (No need for mic'ing a leslie; the leslie sim inside is good enough, plus reverb sim)

Amps: Marshall superlead, Kelly Soundmaster, Redplate RP50r (has Line out so could use it to feed a D.I, though I prefer the mic route.)

Amp cabs: 4x12, 2x12, 1x15, leslie 16
 Tornado Leslie (smaller and transportable clone of a leslie 122)

Harmonica: played through a combo 1x12 amp or Acoustic

I want to aim high on quality, although I assume the age of my Mac Powerbook may limit me somewhat. At some point I will have to invest in a new Mac, probably an iMac. I could wipe the powerbook of all non-essentials, free up space and dedicate it to recording. My little recording software knowledge tells me that it’s the synth modules, etc that eat up most of the processing power; recording is a simple thing for a computer like mine to pull off, right?

My powerbook details:

macbook pro 15” from late 2008. 2.5 ghz intel core and 2gb of memory. 250 Gb SSD. DVD writer is broken.

Running Yosemite 10.10.5

Connections and expansion

• MagSafe power port
• Gigabit Ethernet port
• One FireWire 800 port (up to 800 Mbps)
• Two USB 2.0 ports (up to 480 Mbps)
• Mini DisplayPort
• Audio line in
• Audio line out
• ExpressCard/34 slot
• Kensington lock slot

https://support.apple.com/kb/SP499?locale=en_US

I assume my shopping list will look like this:

Guitar cab microphone

Ambient microphone
 Vocal mic (perhaps)

Microphone stands and cables

Headphones (Audio technic ath m50x)

Audio interface and cable to mac

DAW program ( I already have Audacity; should I use something else?)

What else am I missing?

Please suggest some specific brands and models so I can begin the search in a direct and determined manner.

LastMantra

Reaper would probably be better as a DAW.

oaf

Budget?

andy_k

Reaper= £60 for full license, best money you will spend.
Focusrite Scarlett 2i2, about £50 secondhand, or I would be spending £100-!50 for the new things that came out at this years Namm, SSL maybe?
Shure SM57 dynamic = £75 ?
matched pair of Rode M5 small dia condensers, = £130, a Slate Virtual mic could come in handy-see below.
stands for the mics=£???
Ram for your Mac--if possible 2 x 4 gig, £50?? my macbook is slightly later, so you might be stuck with 8gig ram
Extra external hard drives to store project recordings, keep your internal SSD clean, and if your CD is not working you could get a kit to fit a 2-4TB second drive in its place.
Sennheiser HD250 closed back headphones, £50???
Sennheiser HD650 open back for mixing, £250?, only ones I have tried , and they are good.
Iloud monitors, =£250, great sounding tiny monitors, anything you use, you will have to get used to, and there will always be something better-the secret is to reference tracks that you think sound good, and try to match their production with your own selection of gear.
Fabfilter producer pack of eq,comp,dyn eq, limiter, £150??, industry standards and best there is.
Slate subscription, £12 a month, pretty much everything you need, plus a lot you will never use, but worth it for the guitar stuff and reverbs, Virtual analogue gear covers delay, bus compressers, gates, etc etc etc--the list goes on and on, it is good value at less than £150 for a year.
That would keep you occupied, and will cover anything you need to get some professional sounding stuff done, I have been using the same for the last 3 years, and I am happy with it.

lukedlb

oaf said:

Budget?

I’d say £800 (without buying a new iMac) on secondhand purchases. 

lukedlb

I’ve just remembered that I have a shure57 and a shure green bullet mic, both bought back in 1991. They’re both very dark sounding and always have been. Perhaps they need looking at or a preamp?
And I have a secondhand H2 recorder that I quickly abandoned after how long the file transfer took. Perhaps I was doing something wrong and all I need is to take some time with it. In any case, I can’t imagine it being particularly useful beyond sketching ideas or keeping a recording of a live session. 

Stuckfast

Your Mac will be fine for basic recording. If Audacity works for you there's no reason to change that.

I say get an audio interface, a couple of mics, a good pair of headphones and the necessary stands/cables -- and then save the rest of the budget until you've had a good chance to explore what's possible with what you have. The initial learning curve will be enough without also having to learn new software, plug-ins and so on.

Mic-wise the Beyer M201 is a good option but plenty of hits have been made with an SM57.

lukedlb

@AndyK inspiring suggestions that have helped me define / limit my requirements:
my MacBook Pro can only reach 4gb of ram (2 slots of 2). Making a dedicated external drive of photos, as I have of music, should help free up space on the ssd. I could also swap out the old Dvd writer for another ssd. 

Recording is to get a raw file. I’m the session player. I want to avoid any post production unless it’s some basic plugins that correspond to achieving an authentic reproduction of what I played. I know that sugar coating is necessary; gorging on the feast that Slate offers is not for me just yet. I have rare precious time to play and study as it is, what with teaching and family. I think it’s best that the songwriter gets to enjoy that side and produce the song’s sound how he feels fit. 
Bearing that in mind, the Fabfilter production pack or the like is probably more suitable. 
Reaper sounds the way to go. 
Will the focusrite handle all my instruments? Would a UA or Arturia audiofuse be overkill?

What application are the Rode mics for?

The ath m50x seems to be the recommended headphones over the sennheiser. 

Mixing isn’t currently a requirement so no need for extra headphones nor monitors. I’ll leave that to the songwriter. 

Winny_Pooh

Current laptop and Reaper will be fine.
Focusrite or Audient for interfaces.
AT m50x 
Electric - sm57 is fine
Acoustic, vocal - tricky in your small cellar, given this situation.... a Sennheiser MD421 which doubles as a second cab mic.
K&M weighted table stand (for amp)
K&M or Beyerdynamic boom stand

You can add more stuff later. 

lukedlb

Stuckfast said:

Your Mac will be fine for basic recording. If Audacity works for you there's no reason to change that.

I say get an audio interface, a couple of mics, a good pair of headphones and the necessary stands/cables -- and then save the rest of the budget until you've had a good chance to explore what's possible with what you have. The initial learning curve will be enough without also having to learn new software, plug-ins and so on.

Mic-wise the Beyer M201 is a good option but plenty of hits have been made with an SM57.

This makes sense. I’ll begin with audacity and see where it takes me. I’ll get the Mac up to spec; perhaps get a separate keyboard and track pad so I can raise my eyeliner and posture. 

An alternative is avoiding a Mac altogether and using a digital workstation. A computer does add its own set of human issues, distractions and fatigue. Working manually with a digital result might make my workflow much more natural. I’m from the tascam 4 track bouncing generation. 

Ill take a look at the beyer mic. Headphones?

lukedlb

Winny_Pooh said:

Current laptop and Reaper will be fine.
Focusrite or Audient for interfaces.
AT m50x 
Electric - sm57 is fine
Acoustic, vocal - tricky in your small cellar, given this situation.... a Sennheiser MD421 which doubles as a second cab mic.
K&M weighted table stand (for amp)
K&M or Beyerdynamic boom stand

You can add more stuff later. 

The short table stand and boom stand have been added to my shopping list. 
The cellar is probably bigger than I think; probably 12m2. 
Could the md421 work as a room mic to get more space to the guitar recording in tandem with a close mic’d Shure 57?
i will probably use the acoustic as a guide track to be later deleted or overdubbed by the songwriter himself. 

andy_k

Time spent with Reaper, will not be time wasted, it is free to try for 60 days-i think, but is not limited after-you just get a nag screen, and full license is £60, it is amazing software.
You only need a 2 input interface, which will handle stereo recording, or 2 separate mono tracks, the Rode mics are a matched pair for stereo overheads, or good for room sounds or acoustic guitars, you could just use one with the SM57 to get variety.
headphones and monitors are all personal choices, it is more about learning how they sound with reference material that you want to match.
The new SSL 2 looks like a nice modern interface, with good converters, so it is futureproof, but again, you will be fine with anything around the £100 budget here.
Your Mac, with 4 gig will be fine for recording, and only will start to struggle when you try to mix stuff with a lot of processing, again, you could spend a lot of money to get something futureproof.
The Fabfilter stuff is able to help correct anything that is lacking from your recordings, and will help to make mediocre recordings sound good, they are fairly light on processing-I have them running fine on a PC with only 4 gig ram.
You should probably get a large diaphragm condenser for vocal recording, and you will also need some sort of room treatment  to get the best results, damping etc, rooms add character that is easier to add post than it is to remove.
If I was you, I would get started with Reaper, and use some pre-recorded stuff as material to help you get familiar with it, it includes basic versions of everything that is needed-except instruments, but that is not your workflow anyway.
Ask if you need any further help.
cheers
andy k

robinbowes

Word of warning if you're buying a new interface: make sure it is supported on the OS version running on your Mac.

If it's any interest, I'm contemplating upgrading to an SSL 2+ interface and may be offloading my PreSonus FireStudio (Firewire) audio interface in the near future. It won't be expensive (£30?)

R.

Branshen

If you're tech savvy and confident you can learn to operate a DAW, I agree that learning one, like reaper, will not be wasted effort. Otherwise, using software you're already familiar with will be a better idea to get u going.

Choosing an audio interface is a bit of a minefield. I'd say that it's your central piece of gear (other than the computer) that ties everything together. Making sure it supports and will work well with your outdated computer is crucial. There are some you should avoid, like 1st generation focusrite 2i2, which tends to clip badly when recording direct in. Consider how many mic pres/inputs you want. 2 is fine if you never want to record more than a stereo/dual mono (E.g. Guitar and vocal) track at a time. 

I'd say definitely don't get external plugins ala fabfilter at this stage, before u even know how to use a DAW. All full fledged DAWs will have stock plugins which would be more than adequate for a beginner.

If you don't have a nice recording room, I'd say ditch the ambient mics, close mic everything and use digital reverb to add a consistent space to recordings.

Since you have an SM57 that you find dark, I'd say that you want another one more large condenser that you can use on vocals, acoustic guitar, harmonica. I've used a Rode NT1A for years with good results but there are plenty of reasonably priced options, E.g. Audio technica, AKG, shure, behringer. This would be in alternative to the small dia condensers which Andy suggested, which can mostly do the same job. 

Jalapeno

On Mac Garageband comes free - use that to start with as your mate already has it.

When you upgrade later discuss with your mate - I'd suggest looking at/trying Logic (as a Garageband upgrade), Tracktion, Reaper.  Also you are likely to need some virtual instruments - check out Reason and/or NI Komplete.

Jalapeno

Also .... SSL 2+ is a USBC device so unlikely to work on older Macs, plus you can get great 2ch interfaces for around £100. Focusrite Scarlett, Presonus, NI - similar price to SSL+ is Apogee (mac only)

TheBigDipper

Jalapeno said:

On Mac Garageband comes free - use that to start with as your mate already has it.

I'd agree with that. There's lots of love on here for Reaper, and rightly so, but many of our Reaper users do not have a Mac, so cannot install GarageBand or Logic. 

GB is easy to use for basic multitrack recording and delivers good results without a steep learning curve. There are lots of usable software instruments, plugins and drummers inside it for free. 

Audacity takes more effort to understand, I feel. 

Quality will come from your audio interface, mics and YOU. 

I've been using a PreSonus iTwo audio interface for a few years and I'm still happy with it. Low budget and with a MIDI interface, too.  I do a lot of demo recording and live stereo recording with GB on my iPad and it supports  that through a Lightening cable as well as USB to my Mac. 

thegummy

TheBigDipper said:

Jalapeno said:

On Mac Garageband comes free - use that to start with as your mate already has it.

I'd agree with that. There's lots of love on here for Reaper, and rightly so, but many of our Reaper users do not have a Mac, so cannot install GarageBand or Logic. 

GB is easy to use for basic multitrack recording and delivers good results without a steep learning curve. There are lots of usable software instruments, plugins and drummers inside it for free. 

Audacity takes more effort to understand, I feel. 

Quality will come from your audio interface, mics and YOU. 

I've been using a PreSonus iTwo audio interface for a few years and I'm still happy with it. Low budget and with a MIDI interface, too.  I do a lot of demo recording and live stereo recording with GB on my iPad and it supports  that through a Lightening cable as well as USB to my Mac. 

As much as I absolutely love Reaper, the Garageband recommendation seems very sensible to me.

Reaper is cheap but it's not as cheap as free.

I've heard Garageband is pretty decent in its own right, especially when you specify a simple recording setup.

Just as a thought - it might be a good thing to work with the stock effects and just use those to mix the audio with. The fancy expensive plugins are great and sound great and if you try them you'll probably want more but the stock effects on any DAW are still good - much much better sound quality than any amateur home studio of the pre-computer days - so you'd probably be very pleased with the sound those give you.

Stuckfast

Jalapeno said:

Also .... SSL 2+ is a USBC device so unlikely to work on older Macs, plus you can get great 2ch interfaces for around £100. Focusrite Scarlett, Presonus, NI - similar price to SSL+ is Apogee (mac only)

I have an SSL 2+ here right now. It's a USB2 device and comes with a USB type C to type A cable. It works fine on my 2013 Mac.

I really like it actually but not sure it's the ideal interface for close miking a very loud amp, as the mic preamps can only cope with a max level of +5dBu.

Jalapeno

Stuckfast said:

Jalapeno said:

Also .... SSL 2+ is a USBC device so unlikely to work on older Macs, plus you can get great 2ch interfaces for around £100. Focusrite Scarlett, Presonus, NI - similar price to SSL+ is Apogee (mac only)

I have an SSL 2+ here right now. It's a USB2 device and comes with a USB type C to type A cable. It works fine on my 2013 Mac.

I stand corrected, it is USB-2, not USB-C. BUT at £240 or so it's still a lot more expensive compared to Fousrite/Presonus £100 for some cork-sniffing audio quality improvements (I'm not knocking SSL - but that's a definite step above good starter gear).

robinbowes

Stuckfast said:

I have an SSL 2+ here right now. It's a USB2 device and comes with a USB type C to type A cable. It works fine on my 2013 Mac. 

Good to know it will work with both my Macs.

R.