Rarity of PM Basses

thegummy

The separate P, J and MM basses are a lot more common than any hybrid but there are also quite a lot of PJ basses around.

Yet, it's quite rare to see a PM bass (i.e. a P bass with a MM pickup as well). I've seen a Schecter bass with one but rarely see pics of that configuration online and don't think I've ever seen one being used in person or on TV.

Any thoughts, suggestions or opinions on why it's such an unpopular config?

Are there any inherent problems with it?

stickyfiddle

I would assume it’s because the relative pickup outputs are quite different, similar to an HSS strat with too hot a bridge pickup?

thegummy

stickyfiddle said:

I would assume it’s because the relative pickup outputs are quite different, similar to an HSS strat with too hot a bridge pickup?

Ah right - is the MM pickup higher or lower output than a J bridge?

fretmeister

Sandberg make a load of them.

fretmeister

thegummy said:

stickyfiddle said:

I would assume it’s because the relative pickup outputs are quite different, similar to an HSS strat with too hot a bridge pickup?

Ah right - is the MM pickup higher or lower output than a J bridge?

A real EBMM pickup is actually relatively low output. The preamp carries most of the work.
Other brands, especially those made for passive use tend to be higher.

fretmeister

and MARUSZCZYK




Very well regarded maker, even if not well known.

ICBM

Tradition - it doesn't 'look right' on a Fender.

I always thought it would be an improvement - a PJ usually has a weak-sounding and noisy bridge pickup unless it's a high-output stacked humbucking one.

It still doesn't look right though!

fretmeister

The Fender Tony Franklin signature was a great PJ. Was an over powered J to go with the P.
Sounded excellent.

I think the opposite issue is also true though - that on a J&M bass the neck J pickup can be very underpowered if not properly picked, even with the additional string movement there helping out.

ICBM

fretmeister said:

The Fender Tony Franklin signature was a great PJ. Was an over powered J to go with the P.
Sounded excellent.

I think the opposite issue is also true though - that on a J&M bass the neck J pickup can be very underpowered if not properly picked, even with the additional string movement there helping out.

Agreed. I basically don't think a standard J pickup works well at all if it's paired with anything other than another one.

Funkfingers

thegummy said:
... it's quite rare to see a PM bass ... Any thoughts, suggestions or opinions on why it's such an unpopular config?

The PM pickup combination first came to my attention via Pedulla and, later, Cort. The former brand is beyond the budget of many UK punters. The latter brand is perceived by some as "inferior" or beginner to intermediate level. Adopting the PM combination could be seen as trying too hard to be different.

thegummy said:

Are there any inherent problems with it?

My experience has always been that the P and 'Ray pickups do not blend especially well. It might be that an amp EQ setting that compliments one pickup detracts from the other. 

fretmeister

Do it properly if you are going to do it.

Basher

fretmeister said:

Sandberg make a load of them.

I've got one of these, a Sandberg VM4, and love it.

I've read that the pickup's position means it will not sound like a MM as it's too near the bridge. I've also read, but can't confirm, that you can't physically position the P-MM pickup combination exactly as on each original instrument as they overlap slightly. That might be part of the problem, unlike the classic P-J combination.

I guess the Sandberg humbucker has more of a beefy-J pickup sound, though I am new-ish to bass so that might not be 100% correct. I generally play it in passive mode so that's another big component removed from the MM sound.

fretmeister

True.

the MM would overlap the P.

thegummy

Aye I did notice that when I measured, they wouldn't fit but it is a small overlap so didn't think that tiny difference in placement would be a obvious reason against it.

@fretmeister I defo wouldn't mind a bass from that company. I've made dozens of mockups on their excellent website, often with P and M but it just made me wonder if there was a reason not to do it.

fretmeister

I've had 3 Sandbergs. Sold the first 2 because they were too heavy for me (medical issues) but the 3rd is perfect.

Always built very well, nice neck shape. It's all good!

crunchman

Maruszczyk will make just about any configuration you want with their configurator.

https://public-peace.de/configurator/jake-c

The zero fret on them puts me off a bit though.

fretmeister

Zero frets are excellent.
The best basses I've owned have all had them.

fretmeister

Sandberg configurator is fun too

http://configurator.sandberg-guitars.de/

rpr

Fender did one in the 90s -  Deluxe version https://reverb.com/uk/price-guide/guide/20486-fender-american-deluxe-precision-bass-1990s-standard?locale=en-GB  ;

thegummy

crunchman said:

Maruszczyk will make just about any configuration you want with their configurator.

https://public-peace.de/configurator/jake-c

The zero fret on them puts me off a bit though.

How come?

I've never had a zero fret but seems like such a good idea to me.

thegummy

I'm sure it wouldn't be too costly or difficult to even just add one to a normal precision, it's more a question of whether it's a good idea or not.

I don't think the placement should be much of an issue, it's a couple of mm out.

The output difference might be the problem, maybe the MM pickup would have to be changed so much to match the output of the P pickup that it no longer sounds like a P.

Maybe not, maybe it's just tradition and the "looks wrong" thing that stops it being common despite being a viable option.