Poorly Bogner

spirit7

Urgh, 20th Ecstasy cut out during practice last night...here’s hoping it’s just one of the 6L6s:

WiresDreamDisasters

That looks suspicious. One tube completely burnt out and the others fine .... hopefully it is just the power tube, but you might want to monitor the biases for each socket a lot longer post retubing.

spirit7

Thanks - yeah, it’s going to a tech!

Nerine

Every Bogner I’ve owned has been unreliable. 

ICBM

That *should* be just the valve, since if it was a bias problem it would have taken out the other one on the same side as well... assuming it was running at full power and/or it’s not the inner pair which remains on at half.

But it may not be that straightforward - with such a severe valve short it could have burned out a resistor or damaged the valve socket, so I would be wary about just changing the valve(s) and the fuse - I would want a full internal check and to power it up while monitoring what’s going on.

Keefy

Wouldn't hurt to get the duster out too!

spirit7

Nerine- I've had the amp for 10 years and it’s never had a fault.

I agree. It’s going to Dickinson amps tomorrow!

John_P

Nerine said:

Every Bogner I’ve owned has been unreliable. 

I haven’t heard that before - I thought they had a good rep for being reliable.  

Is that certain models or the way you’re pushing them?
My mojado has done hundreds or gigs and rehearsals and never skipped an beat.    Added a shiva a fee weeks ago that I’m hoping to get years of gigs out of.    Aside from the usual maintenance and careful handling any valve amp needs is there anything g else to be aware of?

spirit7

Yeah, Nerine has obviously been unlucky!

monkey42

spirit7 said:

Yeah, Nerine has obviously been unlucky!

This...i have had multiple bogner amps, gigged them hard and a lot and zero issues

ICBM

John_P said:

Aside from the usual maintenance and careful handling any valve amp needs is there anything g else to be aware of?

Some of the models operate the valves at unusually high voltages, which can make them prone to failing - both because the high voltage inherently does that, and because if you bias them to 'typical' idle currents then they will be running hotter than in amps with lower voltages.

welshboyo

ICBM said:

John_P said:

Aside from the usual maintenance and careful handling any valve amp needs is there anything g else to be aware of?

Some of the models operate the valves at unusually high voltages, which can make them prone to failing - both because the high voltage inherently does that, and because if you bias them to 'typical' idle currents then they will be running hotter than in amps with lower voltages.

^ This in spades - they are fussy on output valves due to high Plate Voltages.

You need someone who really knows how these amps work to get them biased correctly.

1983

That 3rd valve looks gone to me, but should be an easy fix! 

does it cut out on the half power mode too? might be a way to trouble shoot the fault as that mode cuts out 2 of the power valves out of the circuit.

+1 vote on reliability tho, I've had a Bogner close to 10 years now and its going strong. Love these amps.

Good luck! 

Nerine

To clarify, I had two Shivas, a Barcelona, a Goldfinger 45 and an Ecstasy 101b 

The Shiva head I did gig hard for years but eventually the OT went and it wasn’t the same afterwards after having it replaced. It was also notoriously difficult for the tech to get hold of a replacement from Bogner. 

The Goldfinger, I got it home and the presence pot just failed internally. Brand new. The chassis was also a thin, weedy folded bit of steel or aluminium. No ends on it. Not a 3 sided box type thing. The pot was just disintegrated for some reason. 

The Shiva combo overheated a lot I.e. the front panel was too hot to actually touch and just didn’t sound right. Again brand new. 

The Ecstasy kept lunching preamp valves. Again brand new. 

The Barcelona blew the speaker or had a weird cabinet rattle from the get go. Couldn’t get rid of it. Again brand new. 

I really like Bogners, but Friedmans are where it’s at for me for the modded Marshall tone. I’ve had issues with all 5 Bogners I’ve had without exception. 

spirit7

Well, it is with the mighty Jon Dickinson @ Dickinson amps.  Will let you all know what happens!

spirit7

Update: 3 power amp tubes blown, taking some resistors with them.  It’s on the mend, with Tung-Sol 6L6s instead of JJs!

welshboyo

spirit7 said:

Update: 3 power amp tubes blown, taking some resistors with them.  It’s on the mend, with Tung-Sol 6L6s instead of JJs!

Make sure the Tung-Sols are Man enough for the High Plate Voltages otherwise they'll get eaten alive...

Charlie at Bogner actually recommended the Ruby Tubes brand for my Shiva over anything else and they did last longer than anything else "premium" I'd had in there.

ICBM

welshboyo said:

spirit7 said:

Update: 3 power amp tubes blown, taking some resistors with them.  It’s on the mend, with Tung-Sol 6L6s instead of JJs!

Make sure the Tung-Sols are Man enough for the High Plate Voltages otherwise they'll get eaten alive...

I wouldn't do that. Tung-Sols are not good with high voltages, whereas JJs (usually) are.

spirit7

Thanks all - I've asked him to check.  JJs are so unreliable though!

ICBM

spirit7 said:

Thanks all - I've asked him to check.  JJs are so unreliable though!

They're the most reliable of modern 6L6s in my experience. I know that may not be saying much...

welshboyo

spirit7 said:

Thanks all - I've asked him to check.  JJs are so unreliable though!

Since When? 

I’ve never had issues with JJ’s in fairness - a lot depends on where you buy them - our own Karltone testing process seems pretty good and has never caused me issues.