Recording guitar: virtual instruments v direct

dilbert

Hi Chaps, I'm starting to come to terms, at snail pace, and to date have recorded my hamfisted guitar efforts through my venerable GT-8 directly into my AI. However I watched a couple of YT vids recently that showed the use of Amplitube type processing which has provided food for thought so to save me a lot of time, can I ask; who of you is using which process, the benefits and pitfalls and why? 

Cheers in advance, amigos!  

Legionreturns

I do both. 

I have my Supro and Fender amps permanently mic'd up for when I'm looking for a specific sound. 

I also go straight into my desk sometimes, and use Ampire for tones. This is for when I want something my amps / boards can't do. 

The clear advantage of going direct is that you can remove or change the plugins and start again. With an amp / already affected tone, you have far fewer options. 

Musicwolf

If you want to process your guitar through Amplitude then you could plug your guitar directly into your AI (assuming that it has a high impedance / Hi-Z / Instrument input) and insert Amplitude into the signal path so that you hear the results as you play.  The problem here is that, depending upon your system, you may not be able to achieve low enough latency without experiencing pops or dropouts.

The other way would be to play through your GT-8, so that you hear the sound with the built in amp simulation, but also record a 'clean' signal that you can process through Amplitude at playback.  This won't suffer latency problems.

I see from the GT-8 manual that there is an external effect loop.  If you set the loop to 'branch out' you can send a signal to a 2nd input on your AI.  This signal will have all of the effects pre-loop but none of the later amp sims / effects.  If you want a clean sound with no effects then position the loop at the start of the chain.

I record using a Kemper but I usually take a clean out as well for re-amping.

The benefit of taking a clean signal for re-amping, either through Amplitude or an external processor, is greater flexibility at mixdown.  The drawback can be - too much flexibility (prevarication) at mixdown.

dilbert

@Legionreturns & @Musicwolf, thanks to you both for your' constructive responses, certainly something to mull over. I haven't actually tried the straight to desk approach yet so I'll give it a go and see how I get on. I'm currently using Cakewalk as my DAW which comes with 'TH3', a virtual amp modelling package which I'm sure will suffice for a trial of the process. 

Thanks again, both. 

Fez

I mainly use Amplitube or very occasionally some of the models in ezmix for recording guitar and bass.

hassleham

I've never had better results from amp modelling VSTs than I've had from a real amp in a real room. If I was doing a big project or something to be released commercially I would always record a DI of the guitar as well as the amp in case I wanted to reamp it later.

I only use amp VSTs for demos or when the guitar is not a key instrument in the song.

Neill

I emailed the guy who does the MyTwangyGuitar vids on Youtube as I was very impressed with the sound/tone he gets.

He sent me a very detailed reply, with the number of approaches he had tried over the years and the different software, hardware etc.

To my surprise he said that his early stuff was done with Line 6's Pod Farm which is not like amp modelling VST in that you can't re-amp, but it's a very flexible tool.  These days he uses either a Helix or Kemper, and his view was now that the Kemper has pulled ahead slightly as the presets have improved vastly since the original launch. 

I've tried several of the VST platforms and never been happy, I can't afford either a Helix or Kemper but that's the road I would go down if I could.  In the meantime the Line 6 option is as cheap as you get. 

Freebird

Musicwolf said:

I record using a Kemper but I usually take a clean out as well for re-amping.

Having a DI signal is the best thing you can do. As you say the Kemper and amp sims can do this automatically, but sometimes I record all the guitars and bass DI as you can really hear how well they are melding together, and then later I experiment by reamping with different sounds.

Stratavarious

I use a mix of amps - Mesa and Marshall, sometime my GT multi-fx but the pattern over past three years or so is moving to DI into desk and amp sims.   

Main reason is the greater options for later changes/alteration by going this route and reamping remains an option.

my DI box also lets me spilt the guitar signal and record both my amp and have a DI backup.. I should do that more really.

Freebird

Stratavarious said:

I use a mix of amps - Mesa and Marshall, sometime my GT multi-fx but the pattern over past three years or so is moving to DI into desk and amp sims.   

Main reason is the greater options for later changes/alteration by going this route and reamping remains an option.

my DI box also lets me spilt the guitar signal and record both my amp and have a DI backup.. I should do that more really.

Probably worth it just for having the ability to make small edits after the fact.

Neill

Those of you who use a Kemper for DI, do you just input the analogue signal to an interface or can it output via a SPDIF cable? 

Freebird

Neill said:

Those of you who use a Kemper for DI, do you just input the analogue signal to an interface or can it output via a SPDIF cable? 

Both.

Neill

Freebird said:

Neill said:

Those of you who use a Kemper for DI, do you just input the analogue signal to an interface or can it output via a SPDIF cable? 

Both.

So which do you use in practice?  I don't have an interface with an SPDIF connection but I would assume that would be the preferred route..?

Musicwolf

I just use the analogue connections for both profiled and DI'd outs.

Freebird

Neill said:

Freebird said:

Neill said:

Those of you who use a Kemper for DI, do you just input the analogue signal to an interface or can it output via a SPDIF cable? 

Both.

So which do you use in practice?  I don't have an interface with an SPDIF connection but I would assume that would be the preferred route..?

I used to use SPDIF when I had it, and now I use XLR Line In (not Mic). SPDIF is easier for reamping as you stay in the digital domain and you can also use VST FX, but I do the same with analogue using a reamp box (it's also necessary when reamping through an FX8 unit). The cables are usually connected permanently, so practically there isn't much difference, and I like to mix the Fractal and Kemper FX (and also VST FX). Yes, I'm a bit mad, but it kicks ass