Giant Steps at 330 bpm

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  • DaveB666DaveB666 Frets: 85
    This is my fave version of Lovers (other than Jeff Beck) - the more I hear of Lettieri the more I like. 
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  • carloscarlos Frets: 3426
    This thread is classic tFB:
    - "plays too fast with no feel"
    - "that's good but I know this other guy who can play it better"
    - "that's just notes one after the other" 
    - "here's a different guitarist playing a completely different tune"
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  • danishbacondanishbacon Frets: 2694
    Honest question @carlos, what would have been a more suitable set of responses?

    The video was posted without much context on an open forum so I think it’s to be expected that others will chime in with their own reaction to it.

    From a theory standpoint it all works. From a technique standpoint it also works. To my ears it’s devoid of the musicality and expression I look for when I listen to jazz. 

    Good/bad is subjective, but I think that by going down the route of ‘it’s bebop, sounds exactly like bebop’ seems to have elicited some responses from those who might disagree with that particular statement. What is Bepop about, in its essence? There are different shades of it for sure. 

    At the end of the day, the beauty of jazz is that you can take any piece of music and make it your own, whatever way you like. It’s free isn’t it. That’s certainly what attracted me to the genre. 

    The player in the OP has buckets of technical talent. Really blows it out of the water, and I 100% appreciate the appeal of technique for technique’s sake. Jazz is about pushing yourself in whatever direction you wish to go. As Jim Hall once said, playing IS the reward. Whatever rewards you I suppose :)
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  • carloscarlos Frets: 3426
    @danishbacon ;
    Oh, I was expecting this response, but I did find it funny that it went the same route as the Chappers knife thread and the Yngwie mutton chops thread.
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  • CoffeeAndTVCoffeeAndTV Frets: 433

    The thing with Giant Steps, 26-2, Countdown, and the other tunes which incorporate three or four tonic systems is they are just seen as a flex.

    Great tunes to learn and play, but it gets to certain point where it’s just seen as a vehicle to show how hip your lines are and how fast you can play over it.  

    I’ve always thought the tunes on Coltrane’s Sound is a much better record at showing his approach to harmony much more than the album Giant Steps. 

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  • Jimbro66Jimbro66 Frets: 2419
    Surely you don't really believe that you can control a thread so that the responses are solely what you personally think they  aught to be?

    Not everyone shares your opinion, I stress 'opinion', no matter how qualified you consider it to be.
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  • vizviz Frets: 10647
    edited April 2021
    rsvmark said:
    viz said:
    Omg
    Nothing that the great @viz couldnt handle! In fact I reckon you would improv a harmony in double stops for fun!
    Haha you must be joking, no way! I wish!
    Roland said: Scales are primarily a tool for categorising knowledge, not a rule for what can or cannot be played.
    Supportact said: [my style is] probably more an accumulation of limitations and bad habits than a 'style'.
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  • Blimey. That guy is amazing. I have trouble thinking that fast !
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  • AK99AK99 Frets: 1563
    Jimbro66 said:
    I can certainly appreciate the incredible dexterity and technical ability of players like this but the relentless barrage of notes sounds to me more akin to an endlessly nagging woman than anything of musical appeal. Sorry.
    Yes. Brings firmly to mind Joey (The Lips) Fagan of The Committments, and his take on jazz.. :)
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  • GuyBodenGuyBoden Frets: 733
    edited April 2021
    I think this Slonimsky pattern is a great tune, it's not just a chord sequence to blow over, play the tune, man.





    "Music makes the rules, music is not made from the rules."
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  • jdgmjdgm Frets: 850
    edited April 2021
    The whole point of "Giant Steps" originally was to play it and solo as fast and as fluently as possible. That is why the tune exists, no?

    However there are quite a few other guitar versions, from Joe Pass (sensible tempo, beautiful chords) through Pat Metheny to Jennifer Batten. 
    May I direct forum ears to Roland Prince (gone now, alas) whose version has everything it should have.  Prince was from Antigua, as good on piano as he was on guitar, and played with Elvin Jones.











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  • DominicDominic Frets: 16013
    Jimbro66 said:
    I can certainly appreciate the incredible dexterity and technical ability of players like this but the relentless barrage of notes sounds to me more akin to an endlessly nagging woman than anything of musical appeal. Sorry.
    100% agree.

    An utter waste of noise.
    An absolute crock of shit and waste of electricity.I cannot hum or whistle a single note let alone a tune .Therfore to me it simply isn't music .........just annoying noise. It just sounds like a random computer generated soundtrack for a video game when things go mad.
    Zero Music although I'm sure the player knows an Arpeggio or two.
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  • carlos said:

    I want a full transcription on my desk by Monday morning, class!
    And yes, Ben Eunson has joined the Ibanez AZ army.

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  • wizbit81wizbit81 Frets: 443
    Dominic said:
    Jimbro66 said:
    I can certainly appreciate the incredible dexterity and technical ability of players like this but the relentless barrage of notes sounds to me more akin to an endlessly nagging woman than anything of musical appeal. Sorry.
    100% agree.

    An utter waste of noise.
    An absolute crock of shit and waste of electricity.I cannot hum or whistle a single note let alone a tune .Therfore to me it simply isn't music .........just annoying noise. It just sounds like a random computer generated soundtrack for a video game when things go mad.
    Zero Music although I'm sure the player knows an Arpeggio or two.

    Angry old man shouts at things he doesn't understand.
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  • ftumchftumch Frets: 679
    carlos said:

    I want a full transcription on my desk by Monday morning, class!
    And yes, Ben Eunson has joined the Ibanez AZ army.
    We've had a guy down the jam night once with the same approach to lead solo as this, he'd only been playing a week. I realise now he must have been a genius!
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  • GuyBodenGuyBoden Frets: 733
    One of my favs, check out the exceptional harmonic sequences. A bit too complex for most, but I like it.


    "Music makes the rules, music is not made from the rules."
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  • axisusaxisus Frets: 28280
    It's impressive, and I like impressive playing. 

    If I wanted to listen to music I wouldn't choose that sort of thing though.
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  • carloscarlos Frets: 3426
    As some idiot said elsewhere in this forum: "he's just playing scales really fast!"
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  • carloscarlos Frets: 3426
    ftumch said:
    carlos said:

    I want a full transcription on my desk by Monday morning, class!
    And yes, Ben Eunson has joined the Ibanez AZ army.
    We've had a guy down the jam night once with the same approach to lead solo as this, he'd only been playing a week. I realise now he must have been a genius!
    Takes guts to admit someone with a week of practice can outplay you thoroughly. Hope his career takes off.
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  • carloscarlos Frets: 3426
    Dominic said:
    Jimbro66 said:
    I can certainly appreciate the incredible dexterity and technical ability of players like this but the relentless barrage of notes sounds to me more akin to an endlessly nagging woman than anything of musical appeal. Sorry.
    100% agree.

    An utter waste of noise.
    An absolute crock of shit and waste of electricity.I cannot hum or whistle a single note let alone a tune .

    Try whistling really, really fast and in tune, following the chord progression. Do you want me to post the chart? Start at a slow tempo and build it up!
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