Death by backing track

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Rowby1Rowby1 Frets: 1258
Anyone on here do gigs with backing tracks?  

Family wedding on Saturday. The “band” looked promising setting up. Four piece, bass, drums, guitar and lead vocal. Bass player and guitarist also with vocal mics…..

Then they started……bloody backing tracks and a crap PA. 

Tracks had BVs, brass, keys, guitars and even some bass. Bass and guitar were Helix and Headrush. PA couldn’t cope, loud but in a very unpleasant way. 

Disappointing as they could actually all play quite well and the singer wasn’t bad.
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  • We are a 3 piece, bass/vox, gtr/vox & drum/vox.

    80% of our set is live, however we have maybe 6 songs that are click track guided with synth/strings/piano where applicable... think Journey, final Countdown, jump.

    We also employ some samples triggered during songs akin to Rush..

    Is it a crime? 
    My trading feedback

    is it crazy how saying sentences backwards creates backwards sentences saying how crazy it is?

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  • Rowby1Rowby1 Frets: 1258
    @bloodandtears the crime isn’t the backing tracks per se, but all that effort and tech and still sounding rubbish…..
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  • Danny1969Danny1969 Frets: 10357
    I'm not much of a fan of bands using backing tracks with instruments that aren't onstage playing prominent parts .. it's kinda like half karaoke, half band.  If you are doing something like Jump in a 3 piece then it's better to play the keys for the most part of the song and switch to the guitar for the solo, switching back for the keys solo with the guitar now on the backing. Makes more sense visually for the audience. 

    The SPD is a powerful tool, with a bit of thought you can use it ways that are subtle but very powerful. 

    I suspect the normal punters are fine with it though. 
    www.2020studios.co.uk 
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  • RockerRocker Frets: 4947
    I doubt if the average punter is aware of the difference between backing tracks and live playing.  
    Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results. [Albert Einstein]

    Nil Satis Nisi Optimum

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  • Rocker said:
    I doubt if the average punter is aware of the difference between backing tracks and live playing.  
    Then why bother?

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  • BillDLBillDL Frets: 7041
    The "PA couldn't cope" aspect could very easily be down to a band having very recently transitioned from amps to modelling alternatives and they are possibly still trying to get everything balanced out and still hear themselves.  Did they have in-ear monitoring or wedge monitors on the floor?
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  • Yes. Everything from Orchestra on backing track ( via drummer with Roland Sampler) to a duo Im in where everything except vocal and guitar is on lap top tracks. And you know what, the audience enjoys both acts just as much. We do get the occasional boomer call us karaoke, but my full wallet after the gig helps me to sleep at night.  
    Danny1969 said:
    I'm not much of a fan of bands using backing tracks with instruments that aren't onstage playing prominent parts .. it's kinda like half karaoke, half band.  If you are doing something like Jump in a 3 piece then it's better to play the keys for the most part of the song and switch to the guitar for the solo, switching back for the keys solo with the guitar now on the backing. Makes more sense visually for the audience. 

    The SPD is a powerful tool, with a bit of thought you can use it ways that are subtle but very powerful. 

    I suspect the normal punters are fine with it though. 
    The audience really isnt interested. Live music is of no interest to anyone in pubs and hasnt been for last 15 years. Id genuinely say that for every gig thats busy which folks dancing and enjoying themselves, theres 3 that are to empty rooms. Thanks fully I enjoy playing guitar, so it doesnt bother me if Im playing with a band or to a backing track, or to an empty pub or heaving.   
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  • mike257mike257 Frets: 374
    I've worked with loads of bands running clicks/tracks from arena gigs down to weddings.  It's massively popular in that wedding band scene you're talking about, because it means a smaller line-up band can throw in material that they wouldn't otherwise be able to pull off, or allow them to offer a sliding scale of budget options from low to high - I played bass for a while in a Motown band that went out from a four piece right up to a 10 piece, depending on the clients budget, with various levels of tracks in between to fill out horns, keys, BVs etc.  Unfortunately, if the PA isn't up to scratch then tracks or not, they're going to have a rough time. 
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  • StratavariousStratavarious Frets: 3597
    edited March 2022
    It’s a bit sad with a near full band if its ends up mediocre anyway.  Half the fun is making arrangements for doing signature parts with what you have.

    I’ve used them with a duo before. Made sense as I jumped between bass, keys or guitar for different songs.

    There is worse though.. discos that are way too loud!… and full karaoke
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  • BodBod Frets: 1286
    lustycourtier said:
    The audience really isnt interested. Live music is of no interest to anyone in pubs and hasnt been for last 15 years. Id genuinely say that for every gig thats busy which folks dancing and enjoying themselves, theres 3 that are to empty rooms. Thanks fully I enjoy playing guitar, so it doesnt bother me if Im playing with a band or to a backing track, or to an empty pub or heaving.   
    The final straw for me with gigging was when we played a birthday party in a big leisure centre hall a few years ago.  We played a blinding set for about 100 people standing at the back of the room.  The karaoke fired up as we were packing away and the place went nuts. 
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  • TheBigDipperTheBigDipper Frets: 4722
    edited March 2022
    We're all different. I don't like hearing "live" music where there are backing tracks in sync with the band and they're tied to a click track as a result. I don't feel the same about a human triggering samples or looping. Can't explain it, that's just what I feel. 

    I go to an open mic that allows people to sing to backing tracks and I don't like that much, either. It's karaoke. 

    <snip>The audience really isnt interested. Live music is of no interest to anyone in pubs and hasnt been for last 15 years. Id genuinely say that for every gig thats busy which folks dancing and enjoying themselves, theres 3 that are to empty rooms. Thanks fully I enjoy playing guitar, so it doesnt bother me if Im playing with a band or to a backing track, or to an empty pub or heaving.   
    I know what you mean. Where I live, there are 3-4 specialist venues for live, original music. In the main, though, the pubs and clubs in the area want generic covers bands to get the audience singing/dancing, having a good time and buying drink (which is understandable). Most people don't want to listen to music they don't already know. There are some really good bands on the local circuit and many more mediocre ones, but the audiences still have a good time with the mediocre ones, so who's to say it's not OK? 


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  • Danny1969Danny1969 Frets: 10357
    Yes. Everything from Orchestra on backing track ( via drummer with Roland Sampler) to a duo Im in where everything except vocal and guitar is on lap top tracks. And you know what, the audience enjoys both acts just as much. We do get the occasional boomer call us karaoke, but my full wallet after the gig helps me to sleep at night.  
    Danny1969 said:
    I'm not much of a fan of bands using backing tracks with instruments that aren't onstage playing prominent parts .. it's kinda like half karaoke, half band.  If you are doing something like Jump in a 3 piece then it's better to play the keys for the most part of the song and switch to the guitar for the solo, switching back for the keys solo with the guitar now on the backing. Makes more sense visually for the audience. 

    The SPD is a powerful tool, with a bit of thought you can use it ways that are subtle but very powerful. 

    I suspect the normal punters are fine with it though. 
    The audience really isnt interested. Live music is of no interest to anyone in pubs and hasnt been for last 15 years. Id genuinely say that for every gig thats busy which folks dancing and enjoying themselves, theres 3 that are to empty rooms. Thanks fully I enjoy playing guitar, so it doesnt bother me if Im playing with a band or to a backing track, or to an empty pub or heaving.   
    I think it depends where you are gig'ing. I'm very lucky to live in an area that has a healthy, well paid live scene. A decent band will pack a venue locally, people round here love live music ... to the point our local main live music pub has outsold the weatherspoons pub bang next door to it for the last 10 years. If they weren't interested in the music, I suspect they would be in the Spoons. 

    I've done the BT thing, between 1998 and 2002 I worked in a duo using BT's on minidisc. I sequenced the tracks using my keyboard and played them back live using a minidisc player in a rack. Then we added live guitar, bass and 2 vocals. It was a good earn at the time but nothing like a proper band. After 4 years I went back to a real band again and have been there ever since. 

    For me there's 2 things I don't like about bands using BT's. It's kinda lazy and a lot of bands don't understand how to integrate the BT in properly. So there's this mix of raw guitar, bass and drums with relatively unprocessed vocals and then this mastered smooth BT ..... it just doesn't gel properly to my ears. To get in convincing you really need a less processed BT and a more processed live sound ... not just the backline in terms of switching to modelling but also treating the vocals properly too. Also Less is more, I think BT's work better when they fill out the sound without being completely obvious. 
    www.2020studios.co.uk 
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  • Danny1969 said:



    For me there's 2 things I don't like about bands using BT's. It's kinda lazy and a lot of bands don't understand how to integrate the BT in properly. So there's this mix of raw guitar, bass and drums with relatively unprocessed vocals and then this mastered smooth BT ..... it just doesn't gel properly to my ears. To get in convincing you really need a less processed BT and a more processed live sound ... not just the backline in terms of switching to modelling but also treating the vocals properly too. Also Less is more, I think BT's work better when they fill out the sound without being completely obvious. 
    We (well, our drummer in our Noel Gallagher and Shed 7 Tributes) records all samples and BTs, so they are to the same level as the band if that makes sense. to Watch back footage, its as though we have an orchestra and brass section
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  • chromatunachromatuna Frets: 366
    I suspect that the ‘death by’ part is mostly a musician and few discerning audience members prejudice. Technical problems aside, the vast majority of audience members don’t give a monkeys as long as it sounds halfway decent. They are there to socialise, dance and enjoy themselves rather than appreciate the finer points of where the sound is coming from.
    This is the truth from hillbilly guitars!
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  • Danny1969Danny1969 Frets: 10357
    Danny1969 said:



    For me there's 2 things I don't like about bands using BT's. It's kinda lazy and a lot of bands don't understand how to integrate the BT in properly. So there's this mix of raw guitar, bass and drums with relatively unprocessed vocals and then this mastered smooth BT ..... it just doesn't gel properly to my ears. To get in convincing you really need a less processed BT and a more processed live sound ... not just the backline in terms of switching to modelling but also treating the vocals properly too. Also Less is more, I think BT's work better when they fill out the sound without being completely obvious. 
    We (well, our drummer in our Noel Gallagher and Shed 7 Tributes) records all samples and BTs, so they are to the same level as the band if that makes sense. to Watch back footage, its as though we have an orchestra and brass section
    Love Shed 7, so underrated.... Big fan of Noel too 
    Yep some bands have a better idea of how to do than others that's for sure. 

    www.2020studios.co.uk 
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  • Danny1969 said:
    Danny1969 said:



    For me there's 2 things I don't like about bands using BT's. It's kinda lazy and a lot of bands don't understand how to integrate the BT in properly. So there's this mix of raw guitar, bass and drums with relatively unprocessed vocals and then this mastered smooth BT ..... it just doesn't gel properly to my ears. To get in convincing you really need a less processed BT and a more processed live sound ... not just the backline in terms of switching to modelling but also treating the vocals properly too. Also Less is more, I think BT's work better when they fill out the sound without being completely obvious. 
    We (well, our drummer in our Noel Gallagher and Shed 7 Tributes) records all samples and BTs, so they are to the same level as the band if that makes sense. to Watch back footage, its as though we have an orchestra and brass section
    Love Shed 7, so underrated.... Big fan of Noel too 
    Yep some bands have a better idea of how to do than others that's for sure. 

    Ive been in tributes for years, but never known a response to a tribute like Shed Heaven. A brilliant band and not easy songs to learn either. 
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  • I played in the same cover band for over 10 years. The line up was 2 guitars, bass, drums and lead vocals. We switched to using backing tracks after around 5 years and there was a definite upsurge in bookings for us. From a sound point of view we were able to incorporate keyboard, brass and string parts. The overall feeedback we received was the bands sound became more professional and polished. 
    we used Karaoke-version custom tracks for our backing tracks. I always went in a re-mixed them so they would work live. It was mainly just minor volume tweaks here and there, just to ensure they were normalised across the whole set.
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  • MusicwolfMusicwolf Frets: 3627
    The audience really isnt interested. Live music is of no interest to anyone in pubs and hasnt been for last 15 years. Id genuinely say that for every gig thats busy which folks dancing and enjoying themselves, theres 3 that are to empty rooms.
    Just 15 years?!!!  I've been gigging since the early 80's and things were much the same back then.

    You can split it into 'Music Venues' and 'Places that put a band on'.  In the former you do get people coming out to see a band and have a good time, and they're great.  The latter are often failing pubs who try putting bands on to bring in punters and, more often than not, it doesn't work.  Last weekend my 5 piece played two pubs a few miles apart.  Friday night a non-music pub, Saturday and established venue.  We got good positive feedback from both places and we had people up dancing but in the non music venue the punters were mostly sat at the back or round the corner, the other guitarist said that he felt "quite deflated".  Saturday's music venue was quite the opposite and we had far more people coming to the front which really helps your performance.  A really good night.

    Re Backing Tracks.  I have done that in a previous band and, as has been said, the punters don't care or even notice.  It does take a fair bit of work to get the sound balance right though and, if someone goes wrong, it's a train wreck in slow motion.

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  • robertyroberty Frets: 10893
    Personally I am very intolerant of backing tracks, though I appreciate that I am not a normal punter. I am also sensitive to bad PA sound

    I love the Sleaford Mods but there is no pretence involved with them. He is honestly and unashamedly pressing the space bar on a laptop and then standing there. It makes similar acts look very silly

    Someone I know performed with a large touring act (main stage Glastonbury etc) and that show was all backing tracks except the drummer, a little bit of guitar here and there and (some of) the vocals. So it's not like it always comes down to budget. For many types of music it's just the way it's done

    I joke that playing in a rock band now is like a historical reenactment
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  • newi123newi123 Frets: 850
    We use some to add a keys part where it can`t be avoided - mainly 80s rock in our set, and we did have a keys player, but when he left we decided it`s much easier to organise 4 people rather than 5, so we now deploy `virtual Graham` where necessary - the drummer also introduces virtual Graham as the best most practised band member with some spinal tap esque story of the demise of real Graham. 

    So in a 2 hr set we`ve got non avoidable keys down to a couple of Bon Jovi numbers, Hold the Line, Jump, Final Countdown, Power of Love and Dude Looks Like a Lady. Interestingly we tried Why Can`t This Be Love with tracks, but stuck to the guitar playing the synth part as sounding much better. 

    In each case it`s only the prominent `missing` part on the track we use - there is all kinds of stuff you could put in (particularly on the Aerosmith) with percussion, 2nd guitar, BVs etc etc - we started with that and it sounded awful. Just the
    horn part sounds fine and stops the mix being too busy.

    Occasionally I miss an actual keys player, but on the plus side we now play Countdown at the correct speed and my fingers manage the solo pretty easily and consistently! 

    All things considered the tracks work well for us.
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