I may be about to do something silly

Tannin

Ahh, but that's not me @Mellish. Assuming you are looking at the WA May, that's the chap at Maton who puts the strings on. Those are still the factory Elixir Nanoweb 12s on it. I haven't changed them yet, partly because I only just got home yesterday, partly because the Elixirs are still in good shape, and partly because I don't know what I want to replace them with - possibly even the same again. I'm not a huge Elixir fan but they seem to suit this guitar. 

I use a very simple method. I poke the string through the hole, leave just enough slack to get a bit of traction on the peg, and wind it on with my left hand, using my right ring and little fingers to pull up on the string over the fretboard to keep the tension on, and my thumb to press it down towards the headstock so that it spirals downwards and has a good break angle. No loops, no knots, no tricks. I like to have at least one full turn for the plain strings (usually one and a half, give or take) and at least a half turn for the wound strings (usually one whole turn). 

Then I tune up roughly, cut the ends off, stretch the strings by pressing down with my thumb, tune up roughly, stretch once more, and tune up for real. Then I'll play them in for 5 or 10 minutes, and if necessary adjust the tuning one more time. 

ToneControl

Tannin said:

50mm is standard on 12-strings, ToneControl, although 48mm is also common. 

I'm meaning it would be a lot for a 6 string
You were saying you liked a wide neck, but 50mm was too much

I like 47mm-48mm

guitarjack66

Tannin said:

Ahh, but that's not me @Mellish. Assuming you are looking at the WA May, that's the chap at Maton who puts the strings on. Those are still the factory Elixir Nanoweb 12s on it. I haven't changed them yet, partly because I only just got home yesterday, partly because the Elixirs are still in good shape, and partly because I don't know what I want to replace them with - possibly even the same again. I'm not a huge Elixir fan but they seem to suit this guitar. 

I use a very simple method. I poke the string through the hole, leave just enough slack to get a bit of traction on the peg, and wind it on with my left hand, using my right ring and little fingers to pull up on the string over the fretboard to keep the tension on, and my thumb to press it down towards the headstock so that it spirals downwards and has a good break angle. No loops, no knots, no tricks. I like to have at least one full turn for the plain strings (usually one and a half, give or take) and at least a half turn for the wound strings (usually one whole turn). 

Then I tune up roughly, cut the ends off, stretch the strings by pressing down with my thumb, tune up roughly, stretch once more, and tune up for real. Then I'll play them in for 5 or 10 minutes, and if necessary adjust the tuning one more time. 

I use a method where I take the string around the post first,then through the hole,before kinking it upwise and then tightening as you do. Well,that's the theory if I have a flat surface and neck support,which I seldom do.

Tannin

Ahh, now I get you @ToneControl I spent many years playing wide necks, started on a classical (50mm) and then only had an Eston (Eko) 12-string for ages. After that, most of my playing for the next few decades was on a Yamaha 12. So I find narrow necks difficult. (By "narrow" I mean "normal 6-string".) 

Up until a year or so ago I'd have said that my ideal nut would be 47-48mm, same as you. But I started running into muscular problems in my left arm, over-use mostly, but made worse by over-stretching on the baritone (730mm scale) and the 12-string (50mm wide). So I've backed off a bit and now would (in a perfect world) go for about 46mm. Having sworn that I would never buy another damn "narrow neck" guitar (43, 44, 45mm) and would find the extra cash to have wider-neck ones custom made, last week I paid a custom-made price for ....yep ...  yet another standard size (44mm nut) guitar.

(Could I have ordered one the same only with a wider neck? Sure. It would have cost only a little extra, but there is a 6-12 month waiting list. Maybe next time. Or maybe, now that I only have six strings, I'll actually get used to 44mm. Wish me luck!

Tannin

JezWynd said:

Beautiful guitar, I'm sure you made the right choice. Looking at the pic of the fretboard in the store link you provided, the Indian Rosewood seems to have practically no grain at all; is that down to careful selection of the wood or is it treated to achieve that smooth finish?

Hi @JezWynd, I linked to a few too many different guitars, I think! Sorry for the confusion. The one I bought has an ebony fretboard. Of the two that I nearly bought, one (The Tommy Emmanuel) is rosewood, the other (the orange one) is also ebony. 

Now that you mention it, all three of them have very even, practically grainless, fretboards. I'm guessing here, but I reckon that would be down to careful selection of the woods. Maton makes about 10,000 guitars a year, but the Custom Shop makes fewer than 100: Andy gets first pick of the timbers and can reject 100 for every one he uses. Whether he then treats it as well to get such an even result I don't know.

Tannin

@guitarjack66 - When I was learning to make bread, I remember watching a video where the chap said something like:

 "There are at least five ways to knead dough. They all work."

I'm starting to think the same applies to winding strings on!

guitarjack66

Tannin said:

@guitarjack66 - When I was learning to make bread, I remember watching a video where the chap said something like:

 "There are at least five ways to knead dough. They all work."

I'm starting to think the same applies to winding strings on!

When I first started playing I watched so many string changing videos with different methods that I feared my strings would ever need changing at all. Since then though I quite enjoy changing strings as it feels like an accomplishment given how much I used to dread it.

JezWynd

Tannin said:

JezWynd said:

Beautiful guitar, I'm sure you made the right choice. Looking at the pic of the fretboard in the store link you provided, the Indian Rosewood seems to have practically no grain at all; is that down to careful selection of the wood or is it treated to achieve that smooth finish?

Hi @JezWynd, I linked to a few too many different guitars, I think! Sorry for the confusion. The one I bought has an ebony fretboard. Of the two that I nearly bought, one (The Tommy Emmanuel) is rosewood, the other (the orange one) is also ebony. 

Now that you mention it, all three of them have very even, practically grainless, fretboards. I'm guessing here, but I reckon that would be down to careful selection of the woods. Maton makes about 10,000 guitars a year, but the Custom Shop makes fewer than 100: Andy gets first pick of the timbers and can reject 100 for every one he uses. Whether he then treats it as well to get such an even result I don't know.

The one I was referring to was the Custom Shop WA May Trad. Looking at it again in detail I see traces of a very fine grain. The craftsmanship shows in every facet of the Maton, I imagine they sound stellar once they're played in. Happy new guitar day!

bertie

Tannin said:

Finally, the most visually impressive of the three,  the TE

FTFY 

I cant look at that "stripey" headstock without wincing and squinting   

guitarjack66

bertie said:

Tannin said:

Finally, the most visually impressive of the three,  the TE

FTFY 

I cant look at that "stripey" headstock without wincing and squinting   

I do think it's a visual 'faux pas' on Maton's part but I'm sure it's a fantastic playing guitar.

Tannin

Ahh, @JezWynd - the very one I ended up taking home. Thank you for your kind thoughts. I couldn't be happier with the sound, and with the way it plays. Perhaps I'll take some close-ups of it. 

Curiously, the action is quite high by my standards but I feel no urge to change it. I generally like around 2.0 to 2.3mm (bass) and about 1.6 to 1.8mm (treble). The May is 2.7mm and 2.0mm with just the tiniest smidgeon (0.12mm) of relief and that seems to suit it for some reason. I can dig in very hard (as I love to do) and it never complains. I have no plan to change it.

Tannin

A little bit of guitar porn to finish off with.

 

My three Matons: left to right, WA May, Messiah 808, SRS60C (custom). Tops, Sitka, Sitka, cedar.



And the back view: Backs: Blackwood, Indian Rosewood, Queensland Maple. Necks: Blackwood, mahogany. Queensland Maple.

Mellish

@Tannin ; 100% agree over restringing methods.

Several methods  work and work well, too. There *are* some weird ones, though. I've seen strings going to the wrong tuners with a spider's web effect in front of the headstock - and even *that* stayed in tune  

Tannin

After quite a delay when their photographer got Covid, the Acoustic Centre finally has my old 12-string up on their website. 

https://www.acousticcentre.com.au/collections/new/products/cole-clark-fl2e-bunya-blackwood-12-string-with-case

Some nice pictures of it there. Here are a couple I took myself. This first one from 2020: 



And from 2021, a close-up of that gorgeous River Sheoak fretboard. (Click to enlarge.) One of these days (and quite soon) I'll get another guitar with an interesting fretboard timber sheoak again, or Mulga perhaps. 

Tannin

(Yet another reply that I forgot to post and the forum software remembered for me. I suppose I might as well post it, though I'm not sure what the relevance is now.)

I don't know if I mentioned this earlier in the thread, but for a long time I wanted a Maton Vera May.

WE (Bill) May and Vera were husband and wife. They founded the company together in 1949, Bill building and selling, Vera doing the books and managing the money. Bill died in 1993. Vera lived to be 102 and, still alert and active, died in April this year. For Vera's 100th birthday, Maton made 100 of a commemorative guitar, the Vera May. When those guitars were sold, they made a few more the same but these weren't the numbered special edition ones, making them less collectable. (Not that I really care about that.)

Anyway, I wanted a Vera May. I made enquiries at my local Maton dealer but not being a Custom Shop dealer they weren't sure if they could get one. Later on I spotted one for sale at a shop in Melbourne (a 24 hour drive - ship - drive north of here) and seeing as I was going up[ there in a week or so, planned to call in and try it, probably buy it. Some bugger bought it one day before I got there!

Tannin

oops!

Tannin

oops