Why does no one ever talk about the artistry of playing with Distortion?

CaseOfAce

I'm as guilty as anyone of playing guitar unplugged whilst I watch Netflix - which is why I think it's always a great idea to plug in when practicing both driven AND clean - there's a lot of extraneous noise going on if you haven't got your bending, sweeping et al. technique up to par.

roberty

@MentalSharps I think in a smaller space you're more vulnerable to microphonic feedback as opposed to harmonic feedback

Greatape

Of course, a lot of guys are using a lot less gain than you think...Angus, for example

stonevibe

I think it is also playing at gig volume where a lot of players fall over. Not always with gain, but just loud enough to cope with a fairly heavy drummer and a full band.

You can hear a lot more good technique and bad technique at gig volume, whether clean or dirty.

monquixote

Gigging with an overdriven hollowbody Gretsch certainly sorts the men from the boys.

MentalSharps

roberty said:

@MentalSharps I think in a smaller space you're more vulnerable to microphonic feedback as opposed to harmonic feedback

That was an interesting rabbit hole to go down! At the bottom of it I've found a digitech freqout pedal that looks very fun for home use.

ICBM

Greatape said:

Of course, a lot of guys are using a lot less gain than you think...Angus, for example

One of the interesting things is that players who are used to modern gear with the gain levels available, often don’t realise how little ‘gain’ (ie preamp or pedal distortion) there is in classic rock sounds - most of the distortion comes from a high-powered amp’s power stage and speakers being hammered. This does make it harder to control, but also less prone to noise - which explains how someone like Leslie West could use a single P90 at stadium volume with no noise gate and not have the whole sound buried in hum, even allowing for using the guitar volume control as a basic ‘gate’ as Danny said.

Achieving the same sound at lower volume by creating the distortion earlier in the signal path and then amplifying it through either a clean power stage or by mic’ing up a smaller amp makes the noise a lot more obvious and requires technology to deal with, even if you do mute the volume control when you’re not actually playing. That’s why all of my guitars and basses have hum-cancelling pickups now, even the ones that look like single coils.

impmann

IMHO, most pub players use way too much *gain* - as @ICBM rightly says, classic rock wasn't about super saturated sounds and I'd go further and say that most of the players that created those sounds were very clever at getting the most out of those sounds. 
Folks mention Gary Moore's sound - yup, I'm sure his rig would have been impossible to control because he was a prime example of too much gain, often with too much reverb as well. I saw the Still Got the Blues tour and yes, he paired it back a bit for that but it was still a bit blistering... and genuinely not very nice at times. Amazing player, yes (although he overplayed massively) but great tone... er, no. Not IMHO.
Playing with distortion is an art - some are absolutely amazing at it and some sound like wasps in squeeling jam jars. Keeping it clean whilst filthy dirty is the trick and not disappearing into a mire of compressed dynamic less chainsaw is a skill few seem to possess... when the comfort blanket of a gate is removed.
 

ICBM

impmann said:

Folks mention Gary Moore's sound - yup, I'm sure his rig would have been impossible to control because he was a prime example of too much gain, often with too much reverb as well. I saw the Still Got the Blues tour and yes, he paired it back a bit for that but it was still a bit blistering... and genuinely not very nice at times. Amazing player, yes (although he overplayed massively) but great tone... er, no. Not IMHO.
Playing with distortion is an art - some are absolutely amazing at it and some sound like wasps in squeeling jam jars. Keeping it clean whilst filthy dirty is the trick and not disappearing into a mire of compressed dynamic less chainsaw is a skill few seem to possess... when the comfort blanket of a gate is removed.

I don’t like gates because they always seem to interfere with my playing dynamics, and although I use the ones on my multi-FX units just because they do stop annoying background interference when you’re not playing without having to turn the guitar off, I always have them at the lowest possible setting. That said I use a lot less gain than many players I know.

I have a friend who is a huge Gary Moore fan and can really play (in a different league to me), but his default settings are gain and reverb up full, even on his Marshall JVM! If there was such a thing as infinite gain, it would probably be just about enough for him .

racefaceec90

i will never know how to do it as i have never played live or in a band (i just play at home and cannot crank it up). i have also never played through a "big" amp stack either.

it definitely is a skill that i don't have for sure.

sgosden

Danny1969 said:

There's kinda 3 levels I think with high gain.  Learning to control the noise at bedroom volume which at that point is just electronic noise caused by excessive gain. This is mainly learning to mute the strings you don't want to hear. 
Then there's learning to control noise at pub gig volume, where there's now a bit of acoustic coupling between the guitar and speaker ... you can now work that a bit and get longer sustain without excessive gain. 

Then there's learning to play when mic'ed up through a giant PA ... with the acoustic coupling you have on big stages with thousands of watts of foldback you learn to use your volume like an on /off switch. If you're not playing then the guitar volume is off, you only roll it up just before you hit the chord / note 

I often have a go on friends guitars and their volume controls generally crackle because they generally just leave them on full as they only play indoors. 
I'm on my third or fourth  volume pot, they generally last about 3 years then they are worn out, not fixable with contact cleaner, the tracks actually worn away and the volume pot has to be replaced. 

Even when playing an electric unplugged on the sofa, I always do the on/off volume automatically. Never realised I did it till wife pointed it out. 

The pinky flick. Completely habitual after years of metal-high gain. 

EricTheWeary

https://youtu.be/SMTpzJ7iQy0

I was watching this last night and it touches upon some of the issues in this Discussion. More about Randy Rhoads but interesting how they acknowledge some of this stuff. 

roberty

Paul Gilbert is such a boss. I love Randy Rhoads but I think Jake E Lee edges him for best Ozzy guitarist

Vibetronic

ICBM said:

impmann said:

Folks mention Gary Moore's sound - yup, I'm sure his rig would have been impossible to control because he was a prime example of too much gain, often with too much reverb as well. I saw the Still Got the Blues tour and yes, he paired it back a bit for that but it was still a bit blistering... and genuinely not very nice at times. Amazing player, yes (although he overplayed massively) but great tone... er, no. Not IMHO.
Playing with distortion is an art - some are absolutely amazing at it and some sound like wasps in squeeling jam jars. Keeping it clean whilst filthy dirty is the trick and not disappearing into a mire of compressed dynamic less chainsaw is a skill few seem to possess... when the comfort blanket of a gate is removed.

I don’t like gates because they always seem to interfere with my playing dynamics, and although I use the ones on my multi-FX units just because they do stop annoying background interference when you’re not playing without having to turn the guitar off, I always have them at the lowest possible setting. That said I use a lot less gain than many players I know.

I have a friend who is a huge Gary Moore fan and can really play (in a different league to me), but his default settings are gain and reverb up full, even on his Marshall JVM! If there was such a thing as infinite gain, it would probably be just about enough for him .

+1 to gates, I hate them. Mute properly and use your volume!

roberty

I use a gate, the hiss level is way too high when pitch shifting into or after a noisy fuzz otherwise. It also makes time-based effects much clearer. A decent gate with a sidechain is transparent anyway. I still have to mute between songs with the guitar volume

PolarityMan

Oh my this is a boomer thread.