How to gig with a floating trem?

EricTheWeary

impmann said:

EricTheWeary said:

I went to a small festival a few years ago which was local bands then a ‘name’ headliner. Mostly the local bands didn’t get much of a response but one did, was really winning over the crowd. Lead singer, guitarist broke a string and no spare and lost the crowd in the time taken to restring. You don’t always get the leeway that Rory Gallagher might have been granted.

True... but it depends on if you just stand there like a gormless lemon or carry on playing/band carries on. 

And just for reference:

No he stood there like a gormless lemon. Probably would have been okay if he wasn't also the singer. Obviously in the anxiety of the moment it's a lot harder to restring than at home so it won't be quick either. Again maybe different for a seasoned pro who is more comfortable on stage. 
The OP obviously owns two guitars and unless he has to get to gigs by public transport it isn't a particularly large or heavy item to take. 

ICBM

It's worth remembering that until rock music got quite a lot more 'professionalised'/'corporatised'/'classicised'/'ossified' (hard to think of the right word here...), many of the greats didn't even *own* a spare guitar, let alone take one to every gig to play to fifteen people and the bar staff. It didn't seem to stop them playing inspiring shows.

fretmeister

ICBM said:

fretmeister said:

Take a second guitar to a gig. Always.

Its unprofessional to not do so.

I would say it’s unprofessional not to have a plan for getting out of trouble if something goes wrong, which is not necessarily a spare guitar. I’ve never once taken a spare guitar or bass to a gig in thirty years, and never needed it. I do take enough spares and tools to fix most predictable problems, I always check my gear is maintained properly, and I choose it carefully as well - there’s some gear I wouldn’t use, because I would feel nervous gigging without a spare. (eg most Gibsons, because of the headstock issue.)

One of the reasons I use a Rickenbacker bass is because with its stereo wiring, it has two pickups, two sets of controls and even two jacks - I can always get a sound out of it even if something breaks. I also take a spare machinehead. (Really! One which can be used on either side.) Ok, if something went badly wrong it might take me a few minutes to fix it, but it could be done, unless it’s something so unlikely that I’ve never seen it as a repairer.

The alternative is to carry two of literally everything, which often isn’t practical - it makes transport more difficult, and it also increases the amount of gear on stage, actually increases the risk of breakage, and especially theft… and at the end of the day just makes the whole process significantly less enjoyable, which would take away a big part of the reason why I want to play gigs in the first place.

So on the original question - yes, I gig with guitars with floating trems, but not without some means of un-floating them. The ones I used last had Trem-Setters fitted, and got me through string breaks a couple of times. Before that, I always set Strat-type bridges up for down-bends only, or it was a Jaguar with the little lock button, which also works fine. The bigger problem is working out how to play the rest of your solo with one string missing… although I did once change the broken one between the two solos in Hey Joe (just under a minute I think!) which got me one of the best audience responses ever .

I get that. But for me unprofessional includes any reasonable step that was not taken to preserve how the show is performed.

String change in between songs - it's a dead space. If the band has a tight time schedule then that's a song that has to be dropped.

Strings / installing a new machinehead etc is all a far longer disruption to a gig than just putting another guitar on.

I always take 2 basses and 2 amp heads. I take 1 cab because that's all I can fit in the car. But either I'll have a suitable Sansamp type thing or 1 of the heads (at least) will have the ability to run straight to the PA without a speaker load if the cab goes down.

Maybe it's because I've spent a lot of time in power trios where there isn't a 2nd of anything to cover a problem and a non-functioning instrument would end the show.

Dodge

Creed_Clicks

Try changing a string on a Floyd while a bit drunk in a dimly lit room!  

ManWithoutSkin

I played in a signed touring band for almost a decade.  We learnt the hard way quite early on to carry spares of everything.  

We week or so before the show, we were asked to open main stage of Reading festival. At the time, we'd just left our first small record label and our manager was planning to step aside.  We knew we had management and labels coming to watch us, so this show was a huge showcase for us. Plus the BBC were filming and recording the day for both the red button and Radio 1. 

As openers, you get the luxury of a quick soundcheck just before the gates open. Our other guitarist turns his amp on. It powers up but there's no output. We have no spare, so panic ensues. Someone is sent to try and borrow an amp from anyone who will lend us one. No one will. Then one is found, the but the band lending to us are stuck in a traffic few miles away. A runner is sent to literally run and get it off them. In this time we manage to get hold of the dead amp's manufacture and they tell us the amp has a computer that protects the valves and that's probably the issue.  It can be reset by turning on and off the amp and that may work. After dozens of attempts the amp finally works again. We don't dare turn it off and it gets us through the show. Eventually the runner also turned up with an amp, so we now have a spare too!

We learnt our lesson that day and bought a backline with a spare of everything as soon as we could afford too. We still had the occasional issue though. I had my main amp and spare both die in a power surge in Belgium and had to borrow the other guitarist's spare for a few shows.  I had a guitar tech leave my spare amp in a trailer, the day I had a preamp valve die in the first song and my amp loose all its balls. I wasn't much fun limping through some songs as he had to go find the trailer keys and then the person who had parked behind it stopping him opening the trailer doors!

ICBM

ManWithoutSkin said:

I played in a signed touring band for almost a decade.  We learnt the hard way quite early on to carry spares of everything.  

We week or so before the show, we were asked to open main stage of Reading festival. At the time, we'd just left our first small record label and our manager was planning to step aside.  We knew we had management and labels coming to watch us, so this show was a huge showcase for us. Plus the BBC were filming and recording the day for both the red button and Radio 1. 

As openers, you get the luxury of a quick soundcheck just before the gates open. Our other guitarist turns his amp on. It powers up but there's no output. We have no spare, so panic ensues. Someone is sent to try and borrow an amp from anyone who will lend us one. No one will. Then one is found, the but the band lending to us are stuck in a traffic few miles away. A runner is sent to literally run and get it off them. In this time we manage to get hold of the dead amp's manufacture and they tell us the amp has a computer that protects the valves and that's probably the issue.  It can be reset by turning on and off the amp and that may work. After dozens of attempts the amp finally works again. We don't dare turn it off and it gets us through the show. Eventually the runner also turned up with an amp, so we now have a spare too!

We learnt our lesson that day and bought a backline with a spare of everything as soon as we could afford too. We still had the occasional issue though. I had my main amp and spare both die in a power surge in Belgium and had to borrow the other guitarist's spare for a few shows.  I had a guitar tech leave my spare amp in a trailer, the day I had a preamp valve die in the first song and my amp loose all its balls. I wasn't much fun limping through some songs as he had to go find the trailer keys and then the person who had parked behind it stopping him opening the trailer doors!

With respect - since you've been in a proper touring band and I haven't, although I have done a few festival gigs where limited or no soundchecks are the order of the day - a lot of that is down to bad planning!

First, I wouldn't rely on an amp with that sort of nonsense in it - it's unnecessary and causes more problems than it solves. Keep it simple, use proven tech and learn what brands/models of amps are reliable and what aren't if you're gigging with limited backup.

Don't panic when things go wrong - you need to have a plan you can put into place straight away, even if that's only a pedal you can DI into the PA (that you've practiced getting a usable sound with like that) which will buy you time to find a better solution if you have that option.

Don't rely on others to look after your backups - you need to have them to hand where you can get at them yourself if your tech has buggered off to the toilet/bar/tent with groupie at the exact moment your gear breaks... because it will! Unless you're at the sort of level where you have a full support team to handle *all* of it, anyway.

Not very rock'n'roll I know, and I'm always the boring sod who won't leave the gear unattended at a gig while everyone else goes for a carry-out too...

Voxman

Like most folk here I can't recall ever having a string break at a gig, but I always take a spare guitar just in case. I'd rather have it and not need it than need it and not have it.  It's a comfort thing and even just knowing it's there helps me being relaxed. 

welshboyo

Buy an Axis

I use a Floyd (RG550) live but always carry a spare for the just in case moments - that spare can vary between my Axis (which is also floyded but set up to dive only ala Eddie), PRS, LP or L3 - all dependant on the mood.

TBH, I don't need a Floyd for the set we do and anything that needs that type of action (VH etc) I can get away with it on a hardtail quite easily - apart from the harmonic divebomb in Animal by Leppard - and even then I could..

Really couldn't be arsed with the faff of changing a string on a Floyd in the heat of a gig.

darius

OP I think you’ve answered your own question. 

If you like a Floyd and it’s your main guitar, then it’s unplayable if you break a string. You need a spare or you accept the risk.

I run Floyds as dive only, so I can finish the song after a string break. I always take a spare, and have it tuned and nearby on stage. (Not still in the car). Have swapped to the spare mid song at least twice in our gigging career. Why risk everything going to silent shit for the sake of a bit of space?

Of course it means you need 2 guitars which not everyone has the luxury of.

And as a two guitar band, we usually have 1 spare amp for either of us. Needed a couple of times too. But usually that’s at setup time, so a lot less stressful a problem. 

Danny1969

Voxman said:

Like most folk here I can't recall ever having a string break at a gig, but I always take a spare guitar just in case. I'd rather have it and not need it than need it and not have it.  It's a comfort thing and even just knowing it's there helps me being relaxed. 

I remember it being more of an issue 30 years ago, when strings weren't made or stored so well. In the early nineties I was doing 4 gigs a week and often broke a string if I didn't change them after 3 gigs. I did the WD40 trick and wiped them down but still broke a string. 

I agree with @ICMB a lot of disaster prevention is achieved by planning and choice of equipment. It also seems, in such weird quantum way that somehow the act of being prepared for failure collapses the wave function and removes the possibility of failure. Time and time again this has proved to be the case in my line of work. In my van I have a spare mixing desk, spare guitar amp, spare wedge monitors, the correct cables to rewire the 4 bass bins should one amp fail internally. We also have spare router, spare network cables, fuses, DVM, screws, bolts and even some basic components like bridge rectifiers and caps. 
The biggest problem I've had recently is a digital desk failing which was used to run our ears on stage. The audience were none the wiser but we had no ears at all for the first half and with no backline or wedges onstage this was a bit of a problem ...especially for the keyboard player and drummer. Ironically our tech spec does say emergency FOH  mix to be set in 2 monitors then muted unless needed but after a lot of gigs without needing that we let it slide. Which kind of proves my quantum failure theory. 

PolarityMan

I always take a backup guitar. I mean I take 2 normal ones anyway so we dont waste time retuning but o always either pick 2 that can back each other up or a 3rd guitar.

andy_k

I like the way that SRV clip always comes up, what a guy.
Note, he is playing 13's on a decked strat, and has a roadie to bring him a backup guitar.
I used to think bands used a lot of equipment on stage, then I realised there was usually 2 of everything, and only one of the amps was lit up.
I think that is also the point I realised, the show must go on, I don't think we have ever rehearsed a bit while we wait for the bass player to find his spare strings and fix things, but I have finished a song on 5 strings and picked up my spare in the break between songs to finish the gig.
I don't carry 2 amps these days, but I do have a Flyrig on my board, which gets regularly checked to see if the tone through the PA will get me through a set, it might not sound as good as my amp, but it will do the job on the night if needed.
Borrowing gear might sound like a backup plan, but in reality, I wouldn't want the support band to be messing with my settings before we played, stress is a buzzkill.
Unprofessional to not have a backup ready to go.

fastonebaz

Thanks team. So general concensus seems to be:

If you're Floyd rosing it, bring a spare.

If you're hardtailing it, prolly OK to gamble on 1

If you're unsure, always have two

If you're pro, have a bunch of guitars and a tuning tech between each song. 

I've not played a down-only floyd rose setup so that's worth exploring too.

More #gas  

Handsome_Chris

fastonebaz said:

If you're pro, have a bunch of guitars and a tuning tech between each song. 
 

Tuning tech?!  I thought that the guitar/bass tech would be able to handle that sort of stuff, unless of course you have a piano, then I suppose that a tuning specialist would be necessary.  

@fastonebaz , does your tuning tech tune the piano before you good people bang out November Rain, Home Sweet Home, or 7 o'clock? 

fastonebaz

Handsome_Chris said:

fastonebaz said:

If you're pro, have a bunch of guitars and a tuning tech between each song. 
 

Tuning tech?!  I thought that the guitar/bass tech would be able to handle that sort of stuff, unless of course you have a piano, then I suppose that a tuning specialist would be necessary.  

@fastonebaz , does your tuning tech tune the piano before you good people bang out November Rain, Home Sweet Home, or 7 o'clock? 

I don't even have a chauffeur let alone a tuning tech  

roberty

Harley Benton FTW. Don't even need a case for it just throw it in the back

skullfunkerry

Flying Vs make good backup guitars, because you can stand them virtually anywhere and they won't fall over

EricTheWeary

skullfunkerry said:

Flying Vs make good backup guitars, because you can stand them virtually anywhere and they won't fall over

Tom Dumont used to balance his Hamer Vs on their ‘feet’ in the middle of the stage. Although I’d only recommend trying this if you have a plentiful supply of Flying Vs. 

midlifecrisis

i always take a spare guitar to a gig. although i havnt broken a string in years, i did have an incident while tuning up my les paul before we were on, a machine head literally broke in my hands. An easy repair if you happen to have a spare machinehead on you at a gig?. luckily i had a spare guitar with me but it confirmed my need to carry a spare guitar. You never know what might fail. i dont carry a spare amp but i have contingency of being able to plug my multieffects straight into pa.