(Resolved) Returns to Thomann not quite what I expected

TheBigDipper

New experience for me. Everything I've ever bought from Thomann in the past has been something I've kept, but recently, I returned a Plethora X3 because I was having MIDI problems with it not properly processing what my ES-5 was sending it. 

So, when I bought the pedal it took just 3 days to arrive in the UK from Germany to my front door. 

I shipped it off as a return on 27th Sep. The return address was in the UK, which I took as a good sign, expecting they’d do the return processing there rather than ship in to Germany. Otherwise, why not just send it direct to Germany? It was delivered on 29th Sep. 

I'm still waiting for a refund. Nearly three weeks after their UK address received it, they say it's still waiting to clear customs. Now that may be totally true. I can't verify that because it has been with them within 2 days of me shipping it. I've got this terrible suspicion that their UK partner waits until the van is full before driving over to Thomann with the contents - and that might only be once a month! 

Anyone else got any experiences to share? Am I just unlucky? 

exocet

I suspect that they probably do "accumulate returns" in order to keep the processing costs down.

ToneControl

there is no rush with returns, 20 days as standard, and to be fair returns are harder to do I think, needs a lot of forms 

before they used the UK proxy, I returned an item and it went round Germany, then came back a month later, damaged with the pointy end of the guitar sticking through the inner and outer cardboard. UPS were awful

TheBigDipper

ToneControl said:

there is no rush with returns, 20 days as standard, and to be fair returns are harder to do I think, needs a lot of forms 

before they used the UK proxy, I returned an item and it went round Germany, then came back a month later, damaged with the pointy end of the guitar sticking through the inner and outer cardboard. UPS were awful

There should be. Andertons and GAK have never failed to refund a return within 4-5 days of me dropping it off with the delivery service. Maybe I've been spoiled. I recently sent a Ridge to Kernom in Lyon (for a firmware upgrade) and that only took 3 days to get there.  And similar to come back. This 20 days seems like a deliberate policy. 

Wazmeister

Always been decent returns with Thomanns

roberty

Happened to me once. After X amount of time they assume it's lost and refund you anyway. Keep on them though because they will need prodding

TheBigDipper

roberty said:

Happened to me once. After X amount of time they assume it's lost and refund you anyway. Keep on them though because they will need prodding

Really? Maybe they have lost track of it since they (or their partners) took it back. Currently, their suggestion is that I wait until 25th Oct before prodding them again. 

Wazmeister

Dont worry, they will sort the refund out.

BillDL

Do you recall the UK company and address you were told to post it to or that was on the prepaid return label?

roberty

TheBigDipper said:

roberty said:

Happened to me once. After X amount of time they assume it's lost and refund you anyway. Keep on them though because they will need prodding

Really? Maybe they have lost track of it since they (or their partners) took it back. Currently, their suggestion is that I wait until 25th Oct before prodding them again. 

It was held up in customs. But they needed a prod after the time had passed before they issued the refund. They don't just do it from my experience, but they will do it

roberty

I don't blame them, they didn't vote for Brexit. Must be a massive pain for the returns dept

idiotwindow

roberty said:

I don't blame them, they didn't vote for Brexit. Must be a massive pain for the returns dept

I wouldn't feel sorry for them. They are a big company and are choosing to do business with UK consumers. There's no reason to expect instant refunds but 20+ days (and needing periodic prods) is poor customer service.

I guess, rather than try and save a few quid by buying from Thomann, it might be better to buy locally in the UK in the first place?

roberty

idiotwindow said:

roberty said:

I don't blame them, they didn't vote for Brexit. Must be a massive pain for the returns dept

I wouldn't feel sorry for them. They are a big company and are choosing to do business with UK consumers. There's no reason to expect instant refunds but 20+ days (and needing periodic prods) is poor customer service.

I guess, rather than try and save a few quid by buying from Thomann, it might be better to buy locally in the UK in the first place?

I agree about buying from a UK supplier. I only shop Thomann if the cost saving makes it worth the risk of dealing with returns hassles

TheBigDipper

idiotwindow said:

roberty said:

I don't blame them, they didn't vote for Brexit. Must be a massive pain for the returns dept

I wouldn't feel sorry for them. They are a big company and are choosing to do business with UK consumers. There's no reason to expect instant refunds but 20+ days (and needing periodic prods) is poor customer service.

I guess, rather than try and save a few quid by buying from Thomann, it might be better to buy locally in the UK in the first place?

You'd be right if you were right in your assumption, but only Thomann had any in stock. I like to use Andertons and GAK for online purchases - they've always been a pleasure to deal with and looked after me if things weren't as they should be. Not that Thomann aren't being polite and professional, they are, but it's been a long time... 

Leisceoir

Recently returned a bass to them. Took way longer than I expected, but they did answer every email I sent and it was within their (quite long) expected timeframe. You may also have a bit of a wait from when they refund you to when the money actually shows in your account. 

TheBigDipper

An update:

Thomann in Germany appears to have no idea where the pedal is, although they accept that I got it back to their UK agent on 29th Sep. When they tell me "it's stuck in customs" I've learned/deciphered that what they really mean is "our UK agent isn't telling us exactly where it is and we're asking them to be more accurate". 

So far, despite me asking for a refund anyway, they have not yet agreed to do it. Instead they wish to query the UK agent some more regarding the specific location of the pedal first. 

This is extremely disappointing, but I'm now starting to feel the problem lies with whoever is doing the returns processing and shipping as the Thomann agent in this country. 

I did ask the Thomann rep what value is added for me or Thomann by the customer sending UK returns to a UK address rather than straight to Germany. He didn't really know what to say. 

In contrast, Kernom knew exactly what I had to put on my customs form when I sent my Ridge back to Lyon for a firmware upgrade recently. It took three days (Royal Mail) to get it there and three days (DHL) to get it back. 

BillDL

Who is the "UK Agent"?

TheBigDipper

BillDL said:

Who is the "UK Agent"?

According to the postage label, they're called Century Logistics, in Bury St. Edmunds. In 2022, they were acquired by a Canadian company called Metro Supply Chain.

roberty

TheBigDipper said:

BillDL said:

Who is the "UK Agent"?

According to the postage label, they're called Century Logistics, in Bury St. Edmunds. In 2022, they were acquired by a Canadian company called Metro Supply Chain.

Can you do a credit card/PayPal chargeback? Or threaten them with one. It has been too long now and this is their fuck up

BillDL

Hmmm.  That's a pain in the arse.  Just one more courier in the chain to cause problems instead of using DHL from source to destination.  I wasn't aware of that.

From a few searches I see that there are quite a few other German companies using them to handle returns from the UK, and photos of the inside of their warehouse tend to indicate that their freight is all palletised, so it is probable that they wait until they have sufficient returns to consolidate them into full pallets.  I would surmise that they will use road freight across (ferry) or under the channel, but there will likely be one or more other 3rd-party handlers and the goods will be gradually split down at intermediate logistics hubs before they reach their respective destinations in Germany.  I could be wrong, and it's possible that the freight is dropped in at a DHL hub on the other side of the channel, or even that a DHL driver comes across to the UK to collect and swap trailers.

Obviously the longer an item is in transit and the more handlers and hubs it passes through, the more potential there is for it to be misplaced, lost, stolen, or wrongly routed, and that chain of custody takes a while to track, however that should not be your problem given that you and Thomann have proof that the package was picked up by or on behalf of their nominated handler.  They should be issuing a refund now while they pursue their handlers for the tracking details.

boogieman

You followed their returns procedure, it’s not your fault it’s rubbish. They've also acknowledged the return has already been received at their UK depot, at that point it’s their problem, not yours. They should issue a refund immediately they see it’s with their UK agent. 

Maybe send them a link to this thread, I’m sure they won’t want to lose a ton of potential customers.