Any watch fans in here?

Pierrederesistance

I'm a big fan of the look of these https://kibblewatches.co.uk/products/2023-citizen-promaster-automatic-fugu-ny0130-08e but I don't know much about citizen. Anyone seen one in person?

Snap

Dominic said:

Snap said:

NickBotfield said:

What are people's views on fakes?  I've got a few fakes of high end stuff because there's no way I'd be able to afford them so I see it as essentially playing dress up.  I've got pink faced Fauxlex Oyster Perpetual which is actually really nice, and a Paner-lie Luminor which was essentially to see if I could pull off wearing such a big watch.  

Reader, he cannot.

Not a fan of fakes full stop. Too many links to organised crime, trafficking, exploitation. And that's before you get into the fact that faking is theft, nicking other people's ideas and craft.

I don't agree with counterfeit goods of any kind be it clothing,jewellery, instruments or ,more importantly , medicines which is actually the largest of all counterfeit operations .
HOWEVER , I get very bored and tired of the Government type tenuous links and generic catchphrases that like to have you believe there is a 'link' to people trafficking , sex trafficking , exploitation ,organised crime, sex,drugs and that Rock and Roll that's popular with today's youngsters blah,blah,blah .......probably encourages stalkers and paedos and even haters / thought crime on the interweb .....
of course it's 'organised' crime or it would be a bit rubbish ......somebody has to organise it but it's not very high on my 'crime worry list' when I'm worried about getting mugged etc etc 
I find it hard to be convinced that some naughty luthier knocking out Les Paul copies has a reciprocal arrangement with Pablo Escobar or is packing child prostitutes into guitar cases for export as a sideline  together with a few hundred AK 47s .Modern Bullshit speak to paint things black.

I don't think it's clear cut. Thinking about the "looky looky" guys in the Med - they seem pretty clearly linked to organised crime in the way they operate. Where is the gear made in the first place? In nicely managed factories, well governed in terms of working conditions and pollution? No child labour involved?. My arse no.

You buy ANY fake gear, you are tapping into a whole unregulated nasty industry. It really is that simple.

As to what's a fake - @stickyfiddle had it nailed earlier in the thread.

Homages etc, have no problem with it. Guitar land is full of various single cut two humbucker slabs, t style, s styles you name it. 
Tokai Love Rock, Squier, Epiphone etc etc.

NickBotfield

Pierrederesistance said:

Oh no, now I remember why I gave up posting. I wrote about 6 paragraphs and it only posted the first sentence. Long story short, would anyone recommend a 40mm plus diver, something I can get hold of used for less than £300 which is a bit esoteric, with some colour to go alongside my king turtle and a Sheffield Allsport in waiting to receive and fill a gap? 

How low are you willing to go in price?  You can pick up a Casio Duro for around £60 - 44mm case, proper 200m water resistance and a good variety of bezel styles.

Snap

that's a nice looking watch! Does make you think.....why pay a heck of a lot more for a Rolex!! Raises the whole watch argument based around......they simply tell the time, nothing else

NickBotfield

Yeah, the plastic strap is a bit agricultural but I've put mine on a nice Nato from WatchGecko and it's a pleasure to wear!

Pierrederesistance

NickBotfield said:

Pierrederesistance said:

Oh no, now I remember why I gave up posting. I wrote about 6 paragraphs and it only posted the first sentence. Long story short, would anyone recommend a 40mm plus diver, something I can get hold of used for less than £300 which is a bit esoteric, with some colour to go alongside my king turtle and a Sheffield Allsport in waiting to receive and fill a gap? 

How low are you willing to go in price?  You can pick up a Casio Duro for around £60 - 44mm case, proper 200m water resistance and a good variety of bezel styles.

That looks cool, but I think puts me in the same territory as the 5 sports I'm looking to get rid of, I me toned that in my original post but it got cut off as my posts always seem to. I've got a seiko srpd57 and an old quartz diver which I'll be looking to let go so I don't think a Duro would give me anything I haven't got. 

Sporky

Around that price it looks like Seiko mostly, or Tissot Seastar, Hamilton Seaview, or...

https://www.chrono24.co.uk/citizen/promaster--id35697519.htm?searchHash=9fbec0b7_6EnOIN&pos=55

NickBotfield

Sporky said:

Around that price it looks like Seiko mostly, or Tissot Seastar, Hamilton Seaview, or...

https://www.chrono24.co.uk/citizen/promaster--id35697519.htm?searchHash=9fbec0b7_6EnOIN&pos=55

That looks like it could survive a dive into Jupiter's metallic hydrogen sea it's so chonky.

AK99

Pierrederesistance said:

Long story short, would anyone recommend a 40mm plus diver, something I can get hold of used for less than £300 which is a bit esoteric, with some colour to go alongside my king turtle and a Sheffield Allsport in waiting to receive and fill a gap? 

If you're not afraid of something with a bit of heft and colour and are already a Seiko fan, possibly something like this ?

https://www.jurawatches.co.uk/products/seiko-watch-prospex-save-the-ocean-amurai-special-edition-srpd23k1

I have one I bought used for somewhere around 330-350 euros a while back. There are a few different dial colour versions, well able to brighten up a dull day.

Pierrederesistance

AK99 said:

Pierrederesistance said:

Long story short, would anyone recommend a 40mm plus diver, something I can get hold of used for less than £300 which is a bit esoteric, with some colour to go alongside my king turtle and a Sheffield Allsport in waiting to receive and fill a gap? 

If you're not afraid of something with a bit of heft and colour and are already a Seiko fan, possibly something like this ?

https://www.jurawatches.co.uk/products/seiko-watch-prospex-save-the-ocean-amurai-special-edition-srpd23k1

I have one I bought used for somewhere around 330-350 euros a while back. There are a few different dial colour versions, well able to brighten up a dull day.

Cheers, I've looked at the king samurai white dial which I like but I'm quite into the idea of branching out brand wise.

Sporky

This one's a striking unit.

https://amjwatches.co.uk/product/citizen-promaster-diver-super-titanium-1982-reinterpreted-2389 ;

Pierrederesistance

Sporky said:

Around that price it looks like Seiko mostly, or Tissot Seastar, Hamilton Seaview, or...

https://www.chrono24.co.uk/citizen/promaster--id35697519.htm?searchHash=9fbec0b7_6EnOIN&pos=55

The tissot is maybe a bit less rugged and more "fancy" than I prefer although weirdly I liked the wbna special editions, I'll look at the Hamilton. 

Dominic

"Looky looky " men ? 
You mean "Senegalese Travelling Merchants and Purveyors of fine Hats ,Sunglasses and Leather bracelets ?"
I'm being facetiously 'Politically Correct ' !They are not Master criminals disguised as Peddlars .
95% are Senegalese , they are loosely organised but a lot less organised than local gangs of kids who steal bicycles and mobile phones in a High Street near you and they are a lot less likely to be involved in Drug Dealing.
Live and Let Live .....
Do they sell goods made in Indonesian ,Viet and Cambodian Sweatshops ? Yes .
Exactly the same sweatshops that supply Shein, Ali Baba, Temu and some Amazon goods ....in fact, they probably also supply Apple,Nokia ,Motorola with cases for your phone , gig bag zip , etc etc .....Are they drug-lords and Paedo sex abusers too ?
That's just the way of the third world .....and a way that keeps the hungry 14 year old in Jakarta just about fed rather than already starved to death .Anyway ,That's another argument .
Peddling goods on the street is base economy commerce as old as time .......to connote that it is automatically linked to every form of crime known to civilisation is just bullshit and mission creep.
 I actually know one of them well ;he is quite well known in Palma,Majorca and goes by the name of 'No.1 Playboy ' !
He's a great fun dreadlocked character who sings in a little Afrobeat -Reggae ensemble ....I got him a gig at a friend's restaurant.
He sells tat together with traditional Senegalese Fans that his wife and friends make back in Dhakar.
I needed 120 horrible pink Cowboy hats for an event in Palma ...he took me to his supplier .....a very boring ,Spanish owned and operated Wholesaler on the Poligono Industriale just outside Palma on the road to Pont D'inca . There were no Drugs ,Child Prostitutes, or Crates of Firearms involved .....just two very disinterested Mallorquin girls about to go on a lunch break and a typical lazy warehouse man .
Are all these providers of tat / terrible fake handbags etc a threat to Society , Morality and a possible cause of WW3 ;I don't think so .
Is the very odd one dealing a bit of weed or pimping a girl .....probably but no different to what you get in suburban London bar or Albanian Coffee shop ,in fact ,less so but I really don't think selling some shit £5 fake Versace Sunglasses plays much part in it .

Sporky

I don't think just rubbishing and ridiculing the idea is a very strong argument. 

SteveRobinson

Wow, there are some ugly watches in this thread.

Snap

Dominic said:

"Looky looky " men ? 
You mean "Senegalese Travelling Merchants and Purveyors of fine Hats ,Sunglasses and Leather bracelets ?"
I'm being facetiously 'Politically Correct ' !They are not Master criminals disguised as Peddlars .
95% are Senegalese , they are loosely organised but a lot less organised than local gangs of kids who steal bicycles and mobile phones in a High Street near you and they are a lot less likely to be involved in Drug Dealing.
Live and Let Live .....
Do they sell goods made in Indonesian ,Viet and Cambodian Sweatshops ? Yes .
Exactly the same sweatshops that supply Shein, Ali Baba, Temu and some Amazon goods ....in fact, they probably also supply Apple,Nokia ,Motorola with cases for your phone , gig bag zip , etc etc .....Are they drug-lords and Paedo sex abusers too ?
That's just the way of the third world .....and a way that keeps the hungry 14 year old in Jakarta just about fed rather than already starved to death .Anyway ,That's another argument .
Peddling goods on the street is base economy commerce as old as time .......to connote that it is automatically linked to every form of crime known to civilisation is just bullshit and mission creep.
 I actually know one of them well ;he is quite well known in Palma,Majorca and goes by the name of 'No.1 Playboy ' !
He's a great fun dreadlocked character who sings in a little Afrobeat -Reggae ensemble ....I got him a gig at a friend's restaurant.
He sells tat together with traditional Senegalese Fans that his wife and friends make back in Dhakar.
I needed 120 horrible pink Cowboy hats for an event in Palma ...he took me to his supplier .....a very boring ,Spanish owned and operated Wholesaler on the Poligono Industriale just outside Palma on the road to Pont D'inca . There were no Drugs ,Child Prostitutes, or Crates of Firearms involved .....just two very disinterested Mallorquin girls about to go on a lunch break and a typical lazy warehouse man .
Are all these providers of tat / terrible fake handbags etc a threat to Society , Morality and a possible cause of WW3 ;I don't think so .
Is the very odd one dealing a bit of weed or pimping a girl .....probably but no different to what you get in suburban London bar or Albanian Coffee shop ,in fact ,less so but I really don't think selling some shit £5 fake Versace Sunglasses plays much part in it .

The people at the top of these piles are the problem, and buying the stuff makes the buyer a part of it, that's the point i was making, and not saying much of what you've put in there. 

But hey, if people want to buy fake stuff, that's on them. The question was asked, what do you think about it? I've answered that. YMMV as they say

NorthernStomps

I suppose there might be a kind of perverse satisfaction if you got mugged for a fake watch.

AK99

^ If ever I'm feeling hard done by in my life again @NorthernStomps  - I'm going to phone you

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jHPOzQzk9Qo&list=RDjHPOzQzk9Qo&start_radio=1

Neil

The only reason people buy counterfeit watches or fakes of any high quality item is simply to fool other people. Why else would you?

A personal experience of mine was with a sales director at a recruitment firm.
He was walking around the office flashing his Submariner.
I turned up, people knew I liked nice watches and some of the staff said "show Neil your watch".
He looked a bit coy but I had a look and pronounced it a fake. His face went very red and then admitted he had bought it in Abu Dhabi.

After he walked away the office manager said to me, "he's two bob!"

He left shortly after.

NickBotfield

Neil said:

The only reason people buy counterfeit watches or fakes of any high quality item is simply to fool other people. Why else would you?

Did you read my response to your question?  I said I didn't get them to show off to anyone, I don't intend to ever sell them (they'll go in the bin or get parted out if I want rid) and I got them to see if I liked the look of them.   I got them for me and no one else.

I'm now questioning my lack of thought into what goes into making and selling them but I'm definitely not fooling anyone.