I was going to buy a Line 6 Helix LT for convenience purposes, but........................

jellybelly

Just to clarify, plenty of millennials are over 40 now and are equally old and farty. 

Danny1969

In my experience younger people have a reduced understanding of what's happening fundamentally tech wise, but are more able to use GUI's because of that. By this I mean by knowing  a limited amount of what's happening : they move forward in the process quicker because options that would occur to someone with a broader knowledge don't occur to them. 

The greatest tech people I deal with are people who got into computers and music tech early in the late eighties and early nineties. People who are now in their fifties or older. Doing sound design with basic oscillators,  page parametric programming on tiny screens, modifying half duplex sound cards for full duplex operation in PC's with 2Mb ram ... these people aren't slow in terms of understanding or using a device,  they are seeing a bigger picture of what's going on and are thus sometimes bewildered by how piss poor the implementation is. 

I find all the Line 6 stuff about as good as any in terms of user friendly. Boss have got a lot better. All suffer the same problems of small screen size and poor visibility in strong sunlight though. A Pod Go is a good choice, it's cheap but doesn't sound any worse than the other line 6 stuff. Most people don't use the extra IO of the Helix so if it's a guitar to modeller to PA deal then the Pod Go is fine. It's more or less the same amps and speaker modelling as far as I know. 

sgosden

jellybelly said:

Just to clarify, plenty of millennials are over 40 now and are equally old and farty. 

yup, the youngest millenials are 30 this year (the oldest 45). And everyone knows your back hurts after 30 and its all down hill. 

jellybelly

Danny1969 said:

In my experience younger people have a reduced understanding of what's happening fundamentally tech wise, but are more able to use GUI's because of that. By this I mean by knowing  a limited amount of what's happening : they move forward in the process quicker because options that would occur to someone with a broader knowledge don't occur to them. 

The greatest tech people I deal with are people who got into computers and music tech early in the late eighties and early nineties. People who are now in their fifties or older. Doing sound design with basic oscillators,  page parametric programming on tiny screens, modifying half duplex sound cards for full duplex operation in PC's with 2Mb ram ... these people aren't slow in terms of understanding or using a device,  they are seeing a bigger picture of what's going on and are thus sometimes bewildered by how piss poor the implementation is. 

I find all the Line 6 stuff about as good as any in terms of user friendly. Boss have got a lot better. All suffer the same problems of small screen size and poor visibility in strong sunlight though. A Pod Go is a good choice, it's cheap but doesn't sound any worse than the other line 6 stuff. Most people don't use the extra IO of the Helix so if it's a guitar to modeller to PA deal then the Pod Go is fine. It's more or less the same amps and speaker modelling as far as I know. 

This is an interesting take because my view is pretty much exactly the opposite. I know, or have a sense, of how a front end gui connects to a database or file store or API in the backend of pretty much anything, it's sort of obvious to me and plenty of people in tech or tech related fields that are my age (around 40) but that holistic view seems to be lacking or tails off the older or younger you go. I think millennials are uniquely placed, understanding first hand a world before the internet as well as a world completely submerged in it, to grasp the full potential of new technology. I think the issue will come with newer generations who can't do anything without a GUI. 

Voxman

It depends on your definition of easy to use, as this means different things to different people. Helix users will tell you that Helix is easy to use from the perspective its well designed and relatively easy to navigate and on this basis I agree.

However, it's a complex bit of kit under the hood with a huge amount of options, settings and parameters.  Some folk will tell you it's as easy or as hard as you want to make it (and this applies also to the Pod Go, which is sort of a stripped down simpler Helix with less processing power and less options and extras). 

I've been using digital gear for umpteen years, going back to the Boss BE5 & Yamaha GW33 (these were digital/analogue hybrid), Boss GT3, GT5, GT6, Zoom G5, Zoom  G5n etc. I've had a Line 6 Flextone II Plus amp rig & I still have my Vox Valvetronix gear (digital modelling hybrids, using valves), both amps and the Vox Tonelab SE, LE and ST mfx.   Currently I also have a Line 6 Pod Go, a Valeton GP200X and a little Valeton GP5. So I think its safe to say that I'm reasonably experienced with digital modelling gear. 

Modern mfx units are great from the perspective of ever improving features, options, sound quality, and ability to play through headphones. BUT if you're used to the immediacy of a traditional amp with real dials and knobs, and haven't used modern mfx before, there's a huge learning curve.

Firstly, learning how to navigate the mfx unit. Modern mfx are heavily menu driven, although units with touch screens can make things simpler. Each manufacturer has a different approach to how their mfx works and although software edit programs can make things much easier, some are better than others. In this regard Line 6 gear is very good, they offer very good customer support, and there are tons of free patches you can load down from their Custom Tone website.

But the second challenge is learning about building your signal chain and what to select, and its the sheer amount of options that can give rise to option paralysis. Figuring out which amp, cab, mic and fx models you like and how to set these is a steep learning curve and its all too easy to spend more time tweaking than playing and its easy to get frustrated. Some folk will suggest you can buy professionally made patches but even that can be a rabbit hole and may not necessarily sound good with your gear.  And that's before we get into IRs & NAM's (that are a different way of capturing cab and amp models).

No mfx is perfect and each has pros and cons. But If you're looking for an inexpensive unit that sounds great, is pretty easy to use, with some traditional real knobs for amp parameters, the Valeton GP200 is well worth a look. It has buttons to take you straight into each amp, cab, modulation, boost, distortion, noise reduction (etc) block to minimise scrolling through menus, it has a wonderful bright, clear screen, pretty decent edit software, and because it doesn't have mic selections there's no having to choose mic type, distance settings etc, so straightaway its a simpler approach that helps make it easier to use.  And even its factory patches sound pretty darn good for the most part, which is more than can be said for most mfx. Its also Lee Andertons favourite budget mfx pedal and after having one myself, and despite some shortfalls, I can see why. And Valeton has also been pretty attentive at improving it with regular firmware upgrades too (although Line 6 are the leaders I have to say, when it comes to upgrades). It's solid metal construction (Pod Go is half plastic), has USB C, MIDI, XLR, staggered foot switches (all higher end features), 8 control foot switches, a built in expression pedal, a decent tuner & it's also compact & light (Pod Go size).  At under £300 you could do a lot worse. 

Sporky

jellybelly said:

I think millennials are uniquely placed, understanding first hand a world before the internet as well as a world completely submerged in it, to grasp the full potential of new technology.

You can say exactly the same thing about gen X.

jellybelly

Sporky said:

jellybelly said:

I think millennials are uniquely placed, understanding first hand a world before the internet as well as a world completely submerged in it, to grasp the full potential of new technology.

You can say exactly the same thing about gen X.

Tbf I don't disagree 

Sporky

It's OK. We get forgotten a lot. 

LightB4sound

Side question I’m interested in the Valeton GP but can you add multiples of the same effects? I’m not interested in it as a modeller but as a sound design tool where I can add various non guitar IRs to delays, reverbs and modulations and movable eq, like the helix?

Voxman

LightB4sound said:

Side question I’m interested in the Valeton GP but can you add multiples of the same effects? I’m not interested in it as a modeller but as a sound design tool where I can add various non guitar IRs to delays, reverbs and modulations and movable eq, like the helix?

Generally no, although there are a couple of effects that appear in more than one fx group. Although this approach may expand a little further with future firmwire upgrades, if multiple versions of the same effect are needed, other mfx eg Pod Go, might be a better fit. 

However, the GP200 has an fx loop and you could put something like a Valeton GP5 in there to give access to a second same fx. 

blobb

Try getting your head around BEEBO. 

Brio

MultiFX have never been a problem for me from the 80s onward. 
Programming my Morningstar MC6PRO took a bit of work to get my head round but I have now and it is pretty awesome.
I'm 73 and this is all easier than dealing with a PPG Waveterm with one of the the worst manuals ever.

LightB4sound

Beebo looks ideal, will have to try and track one down

Beexter

I'm 59 and have both a Fractal FM9, Helix Stomp and HX FX and have no problems getting the sounds I want from any of them. Some of my presets are quite complex and enable me to do things that I can't imagine I could do with conventional pedals and amps so easily.
If you can read and watch videos, you can soon be up to speed with any of them. The Helix ecosystem is easier to pick up but the Fractal system is way more powerful.

jackio

My Helix LT is a game changer, or is now I've stopped messing and just set it up like pedals on the floor, download a few of other's free presets, and play. Headphones are ace too, best practice sound ever

Telejester

jackio said:

My Helix LT is a game changer, or is now I've stopped messing and just set it up like pedals on the floor, download a few of other's free presets, and play. Headphones are ace too, best practice sound ever

Does the lack of a headphone vol control on the LT ever become an issue when using headphones, in terms of balancing volume between the LT and MP3 backing tracks from a separate player like a phone. ?

borntohang

I thought the main volume can be set to control the headphones on the LT, same as with any Helix? You can turn it on and off per output so you can alter the headphones without adjusting the main Outputs.

guitarmangler

borntohang said:

I thought the main volume can be set to control the headphones on the LT, same as with any Helix? You can turn it on and off per output so you can alter the headphones without adjusting the main Outputs.

Wis’d. The big volume control is on the headphones. You can set it to do lots of different things. 

jackio

Does the lack of a headphone vol control on the LT ever become an issue when using headphones, in terms of balancing volume between the LT and MP3 backing tracks from a separate player like a phone. ?

Sounds like it’s answered but I’ll check tomorrow 

borntohang

You can trim the USB input gain in the global menu too, so you can balance it both ways.