Blackstar IDX Floor 3 - anyone tried one yet?

Voxman

Hi all, just wondered if anyone has bought or tried one of these through FRFR yet, and what your thoughts are?

boogieman

@DiscoStu and myself both have one. Stuart gave me a heads up yesterday about a software glitch that I hadn’t noticed before. I’ll let him fill you in with the details but there’s some reviews and info in this thread. 

https://www.thefretboard.co.uk/discussion/291910/nad-blackstar-idx-100#latest

I’m currently using mine into the fx return of a valve combo but planning to get the smaller Blackstar FRFR cab or possibly a couple of small Headrush units to use in stereo. 

Voxman

Thanks @boogieman ;

Yup, the screen size is a concern for me too. For gigging you need to be able to see it from a standing position & whilst I need to try one, I think that could be a problem. 

Cirrus

I picked up a floor one this week to cover a radio gig. In build quality and sound I think it's solid, actually, but the tuner is very, very poor. I wouldn't gig one again without a decent tuner.

DiscoStu

I bought a Floor 3 last week. 

I think for what it costs and for what it's trying (or rather, NOT trying) to be it's really good. 
I'm mostly a rock/metal/indie guy and I'm a rhythm player more than lead and multifx historically have scrambled my brain, so when this was announced it really caught my eye due to it's simple, usable, layout.

I've been using Tonex for the last two years and although spoilt for choice with it, it's a nightmare to filter through the thousand of captures let alone use the actual Tonex software. 
I loved my old Blackstar HT Stage 60. Three channels, and all sounded great to my ears. Just too heavy for me to carry these days so got rid.

Enter the ID:X Floor 3.
The idea would be to simplify my rig and user experience and for the most part it does that. 
Amps sound good. Some of them REALLY good. I think I actually prefer the Ampton ones to the Blackstar ones, the Twin is particulary fine. But yeah, 12 amps and a few acoustic/bass tones should be enough for most folk. If you really hanker after boutique stuff then look elsewhere.
It sounds full and meaty through my Fender FR10, and the cleans have a real warmth to them. The higher gain stuff fits my style and sound brilliantly.

Having switchable effects is great, for all the effects I use there are more than enough.
The wah sounds good to me, the button click is lighter than my Crybaby and less effort to switch off and on.

So yeah, as an all-in-one user friendly, good sounding unit it is punching well above its price point.

But it's not perfect.

I've had a couple of issues with it (mentioned in a previous ID:X thread) which I have been speaking to Blackstar about.
Fair play to them, they contacted me directly on here after seeing my comments and got me to raise a ticket with them. Kudos for that. They're probably watching this thread too 

1. Changing between some patches results in a slight detune and then a slide back up to pitch. I'm not aware of ever hearing that before on previous fx units but Blackstar have said it's due to different patches having different delay times and trails and the pitch wobble is due to the change between these settings, and is normal.

2. Switching banks automatically switches the patch in the same location. If you're using patch 01-3 and bank up, it automatically switches to 02-3. You can't change banks and keep your existing patch playing until you select another patch. So the obvious workaround is to treat each bank as a completely separate 3 channel amp, or set it up to be one bank per song.

3. It's been quite hissy at times. Not all the time, but sometimes. 

4. The tuner is poor. I'll still need an external tuner which kinda defeats the all-in-one thing I was looking for. 

And lastly, the screen. It's not faulty, it's just not big enough to read clearly standing up. I get that this unit is repurposed innards from the ID:X amps but they could have maybe tried a bigger screen for this product.

In summary, I like it. I want to love it as it's the kind of thing I've wanted for years but the niggles are taking the shine off it and I worry that it won't be suitable for live use which is what I want it for.
Definitely try one. The tones are great and I even think the acoustic sim would work well in a band mix.

Something came up on Facebook earlier about a firmware update but having searched for it I can't find it now.

Voxman

Great review @DiscoStu. The screen size, bank changing and poor tuner would definitely be problems for live gigging. The last two of those can be sorted via a firmware upgrade.

The tuner in the Valeton GP200 was poor too and the unit had an odd quirk that when pressing a footswitch, it engaged on the release not the press, which was off putting and counter intuitive. But both were sorted in firmware updates. 

But that small screen was a STUPID judgement error by Blackstar and even if they fix the other things, its unlikely I'll be buying one unless I see a used one going cheap. A real shame as it looked promising. So, its still my old Tonelab LE for gigging. 

DiscoStu

Well, I've had an equally great and crap afternoon with the Floor 3.

Been playing it for a couple of hours and it really does sound great, I think their ITR (In The Room) setting makes it sound, well, ampy!
Just cycling through the presets I've been having great fun and some have made me play stuff I've never really tried before. Good times! 
I bought an electro nylon classical recently and tried it through the Acoustic 2 setting. Wow! Incredible! 

This unit, tonally, really does cover a lot of ground and more than enough for my gigging needs.

But... On top of the previous glitches I mentioned, a major design/manufacturing flaw came to light. I was using the wah pedal and suddenly heard a loud clunk. I thought the pedal had broken but it was actually the top of the unit pushing the side of the unit outwards.
They are separate sheets of metal and not joined together, and there would appear to be no support under the top plate. 
And now that it's done it once, it's doing it constantly. 

Not good. It's going to have to go back now.

Voxman

@DiscoStu thanks for sharing. That's just an awful design flaw. I'm frankly amazed that got through all the design R&D, QC and testing protocols.

DiscoStu

It's disappointing. I was having real fun with this yesterday. 

The tones are there. The application needs improvement.

Voxman

DiscoStu said:

It's disappointing. I was having real fun with this yesterday. 

The tones are there. The application needs improvement.

Especially as you said it had that 'amp in the room' tone and feel. The tuner & bank switching issues can be sorted by a firmware update but the metal case and small screen are simply poor design issues.  I can see Blackstar maybe making a production change at the factory for new units by putting in a brace to support the metal casing.  Such a shame, but even if they fix 3 out of 4, the screen makes it a no-no for gigging. Of all the three units the IDX Floor 3 is specifically with gigging players in mind yet that screen simply isn't fit for purpose & I simply don't understand what Blackstar were thinking. 

Maybe they'll bring out a revised improved version but that's unlikely to be for quite some time.  @DiscoStu ;Have you shared these flaws and your vid with Blackstar? It would certainly be interesting to hear what they say. 

DiscoStu

Yeah, I've made Blackstar aware. We spoke through the week about the glitches and I sent them the casing flaw video yesterday. 
I've started the return process to GuitarGuitar, it's getting collected on Tuesday.

If Blackstar want to send me an improved version then I'd be up for that... 

dawb

I really like the Floor 3 - I agree with the comments but it suits what I am doing live - as said, you effectively have a bank of 3 different amps for any specific song then change banks if you need but generally I can work with the 3. I have the FRFR 50 with it. To be honest, I have been using the Amped 2 till now and this gives some better sounds set and options from the Amped but I work ok with both of them

DiscoStu

I'm kinda annoyed by my Floor 3 experience. 
The sounds are really good and right up my street, it was just that the pitch glitch and the banking wasn't what I was expecting and it took the shine off it.
I got my head around the 'one bank per song' thing so gave it another run through last Saturday and was really enjoying myself - it does sound properly good! - but then the casing/chassis failed under the expression pedal...

I don't know is this is a one off or a design flaw as I am the first to report it to Blackstar, and it's been passed to their R&D dept.
I really dig the tones and the layout of the unit but I'm reluctant to buy another one given how quickly the one I had failed.

Have you felt anything cracking under your pedals @dawb ;@boogieman ? Are you enjoying yours?

boogieman

Mine has been fine, with no pedal issues so far. I like it a lot… mostly because I can get a really nice tone easily and then save it with minimal buggering about. The Ampton/ amp 2 options definitely sound better. 

There’s mostly enough effects to get what I  want. I’ve put a couple of extra pedals in the loop for the ones it either doesn’t cover or aren’t quite up to the standard of what I wanted (univibe being the biggest culprit, it’s just not “throbby” enough for me). That’s a common issue with multifx though, you have to live with the manufacturers take on effects; even if 90% of the rest are decent there’ll always be some that aren’t quite up your street. 

The Helix I was using  (now up for sale) is probably a vastly superior product but it’s really overkill for me as just a home guitarist. I found I ended up spending ages chasing tones whereas the Blackstar is so much simpler and I can concentrate on playing more. 

It’s a good product, shame about the minor niggles. Hopefully the pedal issue was a one-off.  

DiscoStu

I hope so, for Blackstar's sake.

It's a great concept, a modeling floor unit that acts like an amp footswitch and small pedalboard rather than the overload you get with the likes of Helix.
Most of us will get by with three decent tones, and it's really easy to get three decent tones from the Floor 3 with little effort. 

dawb

I do play live and as above have about 3 sounds with some effects over the top so switching is good - no issues with the pedal so far

Voxman

I'm tempted to try an IDX Floor 3, but the only place I'd buy it from is Thomann because of its no quibble 30 day free return.  And although its showing a price of £245, trouble is they are out of stock with a 10-13 week wait showing on their website!

DiscoStu

I see I made TheGearPage! 
The Floor 3 really does seem like a lot of bang for buck but perhaps the bucks were saved in manufacturing. 

I got mine from GuitarGuitar, @Voxman and returned it within 14 days. Surely you can do that with any UK online order under the distance selling rules?

Voxman

DiscoStu said:

I see I made TheGearPage! 
The Floor 3 really does seem like a lot of bang for buck but perhaps the bucks were saved in manufacturing. 

I got mine from GuitarGuitar, @Voxman and returned it within 14 days. Surely you can do that with any UK online order under the distance selling rules?

You're a superstar, what can I say!   The trouble with the standard distance selling rules is (a) you only get 14 days but (b) you also have to arrange the return yourself ie find your own courier, and pay for it. I had that problem when I had to return a guitar to Peach & on that occasion it cost me £40 and was hugely inconvenient, so I won't do that again. Thomann give 30 days so less of a rush (especially to try at band rehearsals), they arrange and pay for the return and they also give a 3yr warranty should I decide to keep it (especially useful for electronic DSP gear that's only just come out with no reliability track record).  I'm in no hurry, I have other gear, & prices will come down anyway.  

DiscoStu

Well yeah home trial would be at your own cost right enough.
I returned mine due to the casing being faulty and they arranged collection foc.

Voxman

DiscoStu said:

Well yeah home trial would be at your own cost right enough.
I returned mine due to the casing being faulty and they arranged collection foc.

Which they have to do of course if there's a fault.  Did you opt for a replacement or did you just want a refund (I'm assuming its probably the latter)?