Another IEM thread

darius

I did search through all the recent ones but here goes anyway

We’ve got a good sound setup, do all our own FOH and Monitors. It is loud but I’ve always steered away from trying IEMs as they are more money and more faff. And as the frontman (guitar and vocals) I always feed off the audience so did not want to be isolated. 

I think they could be a benefit, but can’t afford to try them to find out they suck. 

Guitarist2 is half deaf so I think these would help avoid high monitor volumes. 

What are the options?
- wait for some great value used kit to appear - anyone got some?
- start with a wired system and live with being tied down. Invest more money in the ear buds than the system. 

- get the cheap Xvive

Got the xr18 so loads of spare Outs. 

Although band practice will be a problem as the room gear does not have separate Outs.

thomasw88

get the  behringer p2 or p1 rahter than a cheapy wireless transmitter/receiver.  they work well, are very cheap and are reliable.

For buds the salnotes zero;s are very good and around £20.    

 the ZX pros are good as well but I preferred the salnotes.  I've also got a set of the Soundbrenner waves and a set of custom molded ACS's.  There is a difference but  the ACS's cost nearly 20 times the price and aren't 20x better!


  Stick a mic on your guitar amp,. di on the bass.    if  you want/need drums, then   any mic into the kick drum, and ideally a snare or overhead.  again doesn't need to be expensive  its not for going out front, just so you can hear the mix a bit better.  you  might get enough spillage from the vox mics for drums but sometimes the drummer/bassist might want to hear the kick a bit clearer, plus if you're recording from the desk its' needed.

 Whole iem for under £50.   If you  like it then can look at upgrading but you have a backup solution as well now..
 doesnt work if you're doing stage diving or spinning like a turtle as you have a cable going from the aux out to your receiver, but its good.  I keep mine as a backup if my xvive dies, and for keyboard gigs I'll use it as I'm not moving around   In my covers band we all moved in ears (mix of behringer p1 and wireless)  and everyone prefers it. plus less gear to carry.

Gulliver

+1 for the Behringer P1/P2 (can't remember which I have).  I have a 3.5mm headphone extension cable heat-shrunk to my guitar cable, so IEMs are plugged in by my guitar cable, and the Behringer lives on/under my pedalboard. These saves me needing something else attached to me.

I basically only have my voice and guitar in my IEMs, because I'm using standard headphones (Shure SE215s) not something moulded - the seal isn't perfect so I get enough bass and drums leaking through for me to stay in time and in tune.  Is this ideal? Probably not.  But it works.

Roland

We use an XR18. It allows you to set a different mix for each player, and they can control their own individual mixes. I had vocals, side drum, kick, and vocals into Shure SE215s. Not isolating, but good enough until we got a loud drummer. Because of him I got some Cosmic Ears moulded plugs. 

We had the benefit of wireless, which we bought secondhand as they came up on eBay. You could start with a wired solution to check how you get on, and add wireless as funds allow. 

I have to say that the current band is quieter, and we only need a monitor speaker for vocals.

stickyfiddle

My thoughts in no particularly order: 

I've used the Behringer P2 kit - it's an easy solution for wired, though obviously ties you down with another cable. Personally that's fine in the studio but I don't wanna do it live, especially if there are singers with their own IEM cables to get tied in nots with.  

I have a Sennheiser XSW wireless kit and Shure SE215s (foam tips sound and feel best but are more effort). As singer & guitarist I really like being full wireless and the IEMs mean I can hear everyone properly for vocal harmonies.

I am planning on getting custom moulds for comfort and ease of use (foams need squishing so is hard to do 1-handed and/or mid-gig) but the Shures are decent enough. 

IEMs also mean everyone is a bit isolated which means my only argument about volume is with the sound guy and not the other singers. AND with digital everything it means everyone gets the same mix every time which makes setup really quick.

I haven't found audience isolation as bad as I was worried it might be, though maybe it's more extreme with moulded ones. You can get "ambient" versions of most good moulded IEMs now that let a bit more outside sound in again, for exactly this reason. 

Musicwolf

Wired is cheapest, most reliable and the benchmark for quality.  As such, it makes sense to at least start that way and switch to wireless  if and when you feel the need.  Some of the 'stages' that we play on don't justify wireless with respect to movement, but it does avoid the risk of walking off with the lead still tethered (I've done this twice).

I use Shure SE535s with custom moulded tips from Snugs.  More expensive than buying moulded plugs to begin with but it enabled me to get there in stages and, when my first set of SE535s bit the dust, I didn't have to throw the whole lot away.

Make sure that your headphone amp has a limiter and be careful setting volumes.  If you can't hear something, ask yourself what else could come down before you turn anything up.

Be prepared to work at getting your mix and getting used to IEMs.  People give up too soon.

If you need to hear the audience then set up an ambient mic on stage (feeding only the IEM mix, not front of house).  You can leave it on, or you can mute it during numbers and unmute in between.

Keefy

Musicwolf said:

…

Be prepared to work at getting your mix and getting used to IEMs.  People give up too soon.

…

Exactly this. People try IEMs for a short time and decide they don’t like them, without persevering until they’re working for them.

Roland

Musicwolf said: If you need to hear the audience then set up an ambient mic on stage (feeding only the IEM mix, not front of house).  You can leave it on, or you can mute it during numbers and unmute in between.

We use an overhead on the cymbals, and I found that gave me enough room sound 

darius

I’ll clarify we utilise the xr18 fully already. Mic all the guitars and kick, separate out mixes for each monitor etc. so will be no problem adding 1 or 2 IEMs with mixes and keep the monitors for anything like bass player. 

I went wireless guitar couple years ago despite fixed mic stand - I move around on the non vocal bits. Would be difficult to go back to a cable. But sounds like the P2 would be any easy first try

Stratavarious

Behringer P2 and run the cables together as one is a cheap intro with a half decent earbud set like a Shure 215 

Danny1969

Wired is better than wireless IMO. Unless you can run to a pro standard wireless setup, and even then you can get hassles with interference 

SE215's are fine. I've done hundreds of gigs with them. Use the buds that fit best and then tape them in with a little surgical tape if needed. 

Set yourself a stereo mix. A mono IEM mix is barbaric. The X18 is not the best mixer for IEM's but you can get 3 stereos out of it. 

Get some ambience ... set up 2 boundry mics and feed a tiny bit into your IEM's. You then get the vibe from the crowd. All my IEM products had stereo ambience mics built in. Some of the better personal monitor mixers do as well now. 

Use a better headphone amp than a Behringer P2 Those things are fatiguing because they are prone to distortion. You don't need to wear the headphone amp, that can be on your pedal board.  

darius

Bump.

OK - the plan is to start with a wired setup, put some money into the earphones and get used to using IEMs.

Meanwhile keep on the look out for a bargain used 'pro' level wireless for the price of a new mid level. 

So what would you be searching for and what not to. Sources say Sennheiser G3....

TheBigDipper

For all sorts of bad, unsatisfying reasons, my last band went for a silent stage. I wouldn’t choose that again, but if you feel you have to monitor using IEMs, then wired is good. You can put the preamp on your board and run a cable along your guitar lead (cable-tied) and it’s not noticeable by you or an audience. If you think that works, then you might change to a single cable that supports both feeds. The Behringer X18 will be fine. We used one. I thought the P2 Behringer headphone amp was fine, myself. As were Shure SE215s as IEMs.

I didn’t like using IEMs. I preferred a wedge onstage with the FOH feed for my monitor - like you, guitar and vocals. We had electronic drums, so a silent stage apart from the monitors. 

Danny1969

darius said:

Bump.

OK - the plan is to start with a wired setup, put some money into the earphones and get used to using IEMs.

Meanwhile keep on the look out for a bargain used 'pro' level wireless for the price of a new mid level. 

So what would you be searching for and what not to. Sources say Sennheiser G3....

You can buy a Senn G3 or G4 system but you can still have problems. The license free radio bands are very congested these days so you can still have terrible problems with interference. Paying for a licensed frequency doesn't help either as it's basically the wild west in terms if who uses what. You can do a scan and find a quiet frequency to get on at soundcheck only to find at show time it's no longer a quiet frequency at all. At proper events like festivals there's normally a wireless register and strict rules about who can use what frequency but not so much in theaters, clubs and other venues. 

I was always used to studio recording with nice, noise free stereo headphone mixes and that's what I wanted in a live scenario with IEM's. That's why I stopped using the Senn G2 system I had and went wired. 

My advice, get a Behringer personal monitor mixer as that gets you a decent stereo feed independent of aux sends and it has a decent enough  headphone amp. So you can have a nice stereo mix with no batteries to worry about. Add in some ambience mics and then the whole IEM experience is a lot nicer. The P16-HQ is only about £150 but is a massive step up from mixing IEM's than aux sends and a phone. 

Keefy

Danny1969 said:

darius said:

Bump.

OK - the plan is to start with a wired setup, put some money into the earphones and get used to using IEMs.

Meanwhile keep on the look out for a bargain used 'pro' level wireless for the price of a new mid level. 

So what would you be searching for and what not to. Sources say Sennheiser G3....

You can buy a Senn G3 or G4 system but you can still have problems. The license free radio bands are very congested these days so you can still have terrible problems with interference. Paying for a licensed frequency doesn't help either as it's basically the wild west in terms if who uses what. You can do a scan and find a quiet frequency to get on at soundcheck only to find at show time it's no longer a quiet frequency at all. At proper events like festivals there's normally a wireless register and strict rules about who can use what frequency but not so much in theaters, clubs and other venues. 

I was always used to studio recording with nice, noise free stereo headphone mixes and that's what I wanted in a live scenario with IEM's. That's why I stopped using the Senn G2 system I had and went wired. 

My advice, get a Behringer personal monitor mixer as that gets you a decent stereo feed independent of aux sends and it has a decent enough  headphone amp. So you can have a nice stereo mix with no batteries to worry about. Add in some ambience mics and then the whole IEM experience is a lot nicer. The P16-HQ is only about £150 but is a massive step up from mixing IEM's than aux sends and a phone. 

This wouldn't work for me on my theatre dep gigs as I'm expected to move around the stage and interact with the other performers. Wireless IEMS and wireless guitar link for me!