Leg pain and driving

guitarfishbay

I drive a manual Skoda Fabia and am 6 foot / solid build.

I've been driving it for over a year now and originally found it fine for anything less than a long several hour journey, which is what I expected from a small car.  But in the past few months I've developed a lot of pain in my left leg, both around the hip and in my hamstring.

It is as if A) the seat is too short and narrow and no matter where I angle myself (believe me I've tried) my hamstring is constantly being irritated by the seat when operating the clutch.  I feel the hamstring pain all the time like a dull ache but it is exacerbated every time I drive the car. I can't get the seat far enough back - it is already all the way back and I still feel my hip is all bunched up, and it feels tight all the time even when out of the car (but again is only really exacerbated in the car).  The only solution to be is leaning the seat quite far back so I can get an extra inch or so away from the pedals.  And C) The footwell is pretty small and the footrest for my left foot feels too far forward meaning my leg is feeling permanently cramped up.  Though nowhere near as bad as some cars I've tried (Pug 207 was a total write off for the footwell alone) I just can't give my hip a rest.

I've been going to a physio and have hit my limit to what I'm willing to spend there.  There was an initial drastic improvement (I was in a lot more pain before going) but then it really leveled out to the point where I just felt I was maintaining my comfort level but paying lots of money.  I'm doing all the exercises, stretches, and have a foam roller that I use daily, along with a rolling pin.  This weekend I bought an orthopedic cushion to leave on my seat, which in truth has helped slightly as it lifts my hamstring over the part of the seat that is directly bugging my hamstring.  It hasn't helped with the hip bunching and I am still uncomfortable.  I have also replaced old worn out shoes in the previous weeks so I can't see what else I can do at this stage, it pretty much must be the car.

I'm slowly and agonisingly coming to the conclusion I might just need to buy a different (potentially larger) car.  Has anyone experienced this before and just found a car uncomfortable to the point you can't drive it anymore?  There is nothing actually wrong with the car otherwise which is most annoying.  It is economical and has proved 100% reliable, and easily fits all my gear in with the seats folded (or removed entirely).  I'm in my mid 20s and don't have kids so really don't care about rear legroom, but I do really wish this seat could go further back.  I had zero issues with leg pain with my previous car, which was an old Mistu Carisma - a family sized car which cost far too much in petrol but was far more comfortable to drive.

I don't even know where to start looking for another vehicle, or if it is even worth looking at the moment while I'm still in pain.  I've got a lot of driving to do next week as I'm holidaying in Wales with my g/f, I'm looking forward to the holiday but I know I'm going to get annoyed with several hours of driving and she can't share any of it because she doesn't drive.

stickyfiddle

What's your inside leg? I'm 6 foot (32" trouser leg) and never get my car seat anywhere near fully back- always at least 3 clicks forward of the stops. I drove a '98 Corsa for the last 3 years until March and I could get near-as-dammit the same driving position in a Polo or Fabia as in the Corsa.

I'm just wondering if your seating position is actually further back than it needs to be and you're having to stretch too much to fully depress the clutch?

Also, are you resting your left foot to the left of the pedals when not using the clutch?

(apols for potentially obvious questions, just want to cover obvious driving posture stuff before anything else!)

Bogwhoppit

guitarfishbay said:

Has anyone experienced this before and just found a car uncomfortable to the point you can't drive it anymore?   

 

I had zero issues with leg pain with my previous car, which was an old Mistu Carisma -

 

Yes. I get pains in the shin of my right leg in my current car to the point of having to pull over and walk about. On the second point I also had a Carisma and never had an issue with the driving position.

ROOG

I used to get back pain in my old E34 5 series BMW, never had the same pain before or since, lovely car but it took me ages to find the best seating position in that car.

All by trial and error I'm afraid.

Jalapeno

I used to be similarly afflicted. Switched from a saloon to a Chelsea tractor, no issues now.

Sitting more upright might help.  Also - take a break now an again to stretch your legs.

Phil_aka_Pip

I'm a shortarse but I get a pain in my left leg after more then 30 miles in my Vauxhall Combo van. It's a dull pain that seems go from the upper left buttock down the back of the thigh and down the back of the calf to the ankle. Doesn't seem to be muscular, can't say it's skeletal but it's there nonetheless. I wonder if getting a drivers seat from a more luxurious vehicle would help. Because I'm a shortarse I need to have the seat quite a long way forward otherwise I can't depress the clutch enough to stop the gearbox graunching

guitarfishbay

stickyfiddle said:

What's your inside leg? I'm 6 foot (32" trouser leg) and never get my car seat anywhere near fully back- always at least 3 clicks forward of the stops. I drove a '98 Corsa for the last 3 years until March and I could get near-as-dammit the same driving position in a Polo or Fabia as in the Corsa.

I'm just wondering if your seating position is actually further back than it needs to be and you're having to stretch too much to fully depress the clutch?

Also, are you resting your left foot to the left of the pedals when not using the clutch?

(apols for potentially obvious questions, just want to cover obvious driving posture stuff before anything else!)

I'm a 33" I think, not been measured in a long time, currently wearing 34" jeans because the other option was 32" and they were too short.  Generally long ish arms and legs for my height, short-ish torso.  I am overweight but not obese.  I've honestly tried being close or far away, as well as high or low.  I get the least pain far away currently, a few weeks ago I was driving closer and higher up.

I'm resting my left foot to the left of the pedals on the little rest.  It feels like when I put my foot there I'm aggrivating my hip, no matter the position.  It is as if the seat is at the wrong angle all the time - and it also has a lip to the side like a soft bucket, which is always catching my hamstring when I try and rest my foot (hence recently buying the cushion).

I'm pretty certain the Mitsu seat was wider and had a less distinctive bucketing shape compared to the Fabia (not an actual bucket seat, it is just a standard model not a sports car).  The footwell was also much larger in the Mitsu and I didn't have to cramp my foot to the side.

I really feel like it is the seat design and smaller footwell that is causing me all the agro.  No matter how I set the backrest it is as if the bottom part of the seat is angled all wrong and catching my hamstring all the time when I try and rest my leg.  I also feel like the bottom of the seat is too short.

I can't even remember a trigger incident, I just remember things feeling less and less comfortable.

BenSirAmos

The Fabia hasn't got sporty seats, has it? I had a problem with a boring car (Focus) but the bucket-style seat that they put into it meant I couldn't rotate to find a comfortable position - the firm side cushioning meant my feet naturally ended up between the pedals rather than directly on them - I was in severe pain after a long drive. I tried changing the angle of the seat without success and got rid of the car. 

guitarfishbay

Jalapeno said:

I used to be similarly afflicted. Switched from a saloon to a Chelsea tractor, no issues now.

Sitting more upright might help.  Also - take a break now an again to stretch your legs.

The problem with being upright in this car is that the seat is so short it means I am pushed forwards in the seat because of how the low back support is designed.  I feel like I need to lean the seat back to be able to move myself backwards and get enough seat length.

I honestly felt the Fabia was the most comfortable out of all the other small cars I tried, and had no problems for the first few months.  Really gutted to be finding it so uncomfortable currently, as otherwise on paper it is the perfect vehicle for my current needs.

guitarfishbay

BenSirAmos said:

The Fabia hasn't got sporty seats, has it? I had a problem with a boring car (Focus) but the bucket-style seat that they put into it meant I couldn't rotate to find a comfortable position - the firm side cushioning meant my feet naturally ended up between the pedals rather than directly on them - I was in severe pain after a long drive. I tried changing the angle of the seat without success and got rid of the car. 

They are bucket shaped yes.  The side cushioning is screwing with my left leg positioning and I've had to get an orthopaedic car cushion to lift my leg over the side.  It honestly didn't seem like a problem at first but now the seat design feels all wrong and I can't get comfortable.  The cushion I bought isn't great tbh, it isn't especially comfy on my backside as it squishes weirdly, but it is helping with my hamstring.  Not really helping with my hip though and arguably makes that angle slightly worse as it pushes my leg higher.

digitalscream

Surely the obvious solution is to replace the seat rather than the entire car?

guitarfishbay

digitalscream said:

Surely the obvious solution is to replace the seat rather than the entire car?

Honest reply - where from?

I've had a quick look, my options are direct replacement (no point) off the shelf 'classic' designs like they sell on this site (which look less aggravating but still bucket style) - http://www.sportseats4u.co.uk/returns-and-cancellations/info_8.html but they won't accept any returns if you fix and sit in the seat... or a custom build.  I don't think commissioning a single custom seat makes any sense for a Skoda Fabia and it will probably negatively affect resale too.

On the face of it changing the seat sounds like the logical choice but I can't see how it can be done in a way I can be sure I'll like the results.

viz

digitalscream said:

Surely the obvious solution is to replace the seat rather than the entire car?

Or the leg.

digitalscream

guitarfishbay said:

Honest reply - where from?

I've had a quick look, my options are direct replacement (no point) off the shelf 'classic' designs like they sell on this site (which look less aggravating but still bucket style) - http://www.sportseats4u.co.uk/returns-and-cancellations/info_8.html but they won't accept any returns if you fix and sit in the seat... or a custom build.  I don't think commissioning a single custom seat makes any sense for a Skoda Fabia and it will probably negatively affect resale too.

On the face of it changing the seat sounds like the logical choice but I can't see how it can be done in a way I can be sure I'll like the results.

Excellent points. It'd probably be a lot of work, but might it be possible to take a seat from a scrapped car that you already know is comfortable, and get somebody to modify it to fit? If you modify the seat rather than the car fittings, then it should be a relatively simple job to refit the old seat if/when you want to sell the car, thus not affecting the value.

Phil_aka_Pip

do insurance companies care if you replace the seat?

ICBM

guitarfishbay said:

I'm a 33" I think, not been measured in a long time, currently wearing 34" jeans because the other option was 32" and they were too short.  Generally long ish arms and legs for my height, short-ish torso.  I am overweight but not obese.  I've honestly tried being close or far away, as well as high or low.  I get the least pain far away currently, a few weeks ago I was driving closer and higher up.

You may actually have the opposite problem than you think - I'm only 5'6" but my inside leg is 31", and I'm not "all leg". It sounds like you might actually have *short* legs for someone your height, so putting the seat fully back may be the wrong thing to do, especially if it means the front edge of the seat is pressing hard on the underside of your thigh.

If so and you're tall with relatively short legs, you may want the seat further forward but lower down so your leg is lifted up off the seat.

Phil_aka_Pip said:

do insurance companies care if you replace the seat?

If it's not in the list of modifications that you have to inform them about, no. I wouldn't modify a seat though - that might be dangerous even if it wasn't specifically forbidden.

It's unlikely that a seat from any other car manufacturer, except VW Group, would fit - and possibly not within that either. The best bet would be a larger Skoda, eg Octavia. Even then I have no idea if they standardise things like the rail dimensions across the range.

Phil_aka_Pip

ICBM said:

 I wouldn't modify a seat though - that might be dangerous even if it wasn't specifically forbidden.

It's unlikely that a seat from any other car manufacturer, except VW Group, would fit - and possibly not within that either. The best bet would be a larger Skoda, eg Octavia. Even then I have no idea if they standardise things like the rail dimensions across the range.

If you take the old seat out and weld brackets to the underside of the new seat so that it has mounting points just like the old one I don't think there would be a problem ( so long as you didn't make it too high by adding the extra metal)

guitarfishbay

Phil_aka_Pip said:

do insurance companies care if you replace the seat?

No idea but I'd guess yes unless proven otherwise, on the basis that the driver is permanently in direct contact with it.  I wouldn't be surprised if seat design was counted as part of a car's safety rating too as it will surely contribute in physical terms.

@digitalscream again that seems a good idea on paper but other cars surely have different geometry with how the rest of the drivers position is orientated (pedals, footwell design, steering wheel) so I'd still assume some speculation though potentially less cost.

As things stand I probably am looking to replace it as at least I could (in theory) find something that ticks the boxes that matter to me.  Something larger would cost more to run but would make more sense from a practical standpoint as well as a comfort one (in theory).

I guess I was just looking for confirmation that other people had done the same thing and replaced an otherwise functioning car due to the driving position/seat.  Much as I like the car I don't think it is worth being in pain.

ESBlonde

I think you might need to raise the rear of the seat squab, I know your head will brush the roof but the support will help hip and thigh better I think.

stickyfiddle

ICBM said:

You may actually have the opposite problem than you think - I'm only 5'6" but my inside leg is 31", and I'm not "all leg". It sounds like you might actually have *short* legs for someone your height, so putting the seat fully back may be the wrong thing to do, especially if it means the front edge of the seat is pressing hard on the underside of your thigh.

If so and you're tall with relatively short legs, you may want the seat further forward but lower down so your leg is lifted up off the seat.

I'm inclined to agree. If the clutch footrest is too far away that suggests to me the seat is too far away. Your leg should still have a slight bend when the pedal is fully down, and be actually quite bent when not pressing the clutch.

If the seat has height adjustment (which is almost guaranteed on anything less than 20 years old) then moving that to its lowest position should also help- your leg will lifted more at the knee assuming the same geometry otherwise.

guitarfishbay

ICBM said:

guitarfishbay said:

I'm a 33" I think, not been measured in a long time, currently wearing 34" jeans because the other option was 32" and they were too short.  Generally long ish arms and legs for my height, short-ish torso.  I am overweight but not obese.  I've honestly tried being close or far away, as well as high or low.  I get the least pain far away currently, a few weeks ago I was driving closer and higher up.

You may actually have the opposite problem than you think - I'm only 5'6" but my inside leg is 31", and I'm not "all leg". It sounds like you might actually have *short* legs for someone your height, so putting the seat fully back may be the wrong thing to do, especially if it means the front edge of the seat is pressing hard on the underside of your thigh.

If so and you're tall with relatively short legs, you may want the seat further forward but lower down so your leg is lifted up off the seat.

It isn't the front edge that is pressing on my thigh it is the side edge lip.  If I try to rest my foot to the left of the clutch I feel like the bucket lip presses in to the outside of my hamstring.  The actual seat part of the seat feels too narrow and the bucketing too severe, even though it is a normal seat and not a sports seat.

This a left hand drive picture of the interior but you can see how angled the bucketing is on it, that centre part seems to dig right in to where the pain is on my hamstring.  Also the seat rolls downwards as it heads towards the back at an angle which I feel makes it seem even shorter - hence why I've been reclining my backrest to feel like I've got a longer seat.