How do YOU play guitar ?¿?

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  • james said:
    paul_c2 said:
    Tab is a pet hate of mine too. I've almost never seen a tab which has rhythm on it - thereby making it almost useless, since I will then need to refer to the music itself to find that out. And a lot of the time its simply wrong, or the notes are correct but the position/string chosen for the sequence of notes is bizarre.
    This, a lot. I find TAB really hard to play from in comparison to notation as it just doesn't tell you enough about the music itself. 
    I did find a tab site that had the rhythms written in under the tab, which was really helpful for some pieces. 
    " Why does it smell of bum?" Mrs Professorben.
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  • impmannimpmann Frets: 12641
    Danny1969 said:
    I see everything in notes and intervals, being old n all but these days a lot of players don't because they learn from tab and tab teaches you fuck all about music. If you know Mr Brightside or whatever starts on the 17th fret of the A string and then it's 16th fret d string what has that taught you .... nothing! But if you know it's a D then an F# etc then you might notice it's 2 notes of a D major triad. 

    These days we have people who can play Malmsteen licks but they don't even know what key they are playing in..... it's musically illiterate and its caused by people more desperate for the youtube views than their want to actually teach something of substance 
    Hmmmm - well, I know nothing of music theory (and realistically, I don't give a flying badger's arse about it either). I taught myself to play by listening to music and playing along with it. If someone tells me the root note of the initial chord I can usually work it out from there but I have no idea or nor do I care about the theory behind it.

    I'm pre-YouTube generation, although I do use it as a resource if I'm learning a song for a particular gig.

    TBH, I get more annoyed by music fascists who seem to think that the only way to play a musical instrument well is to be able to use theory. There's far more to life than learning rules! I wouldn't know a major triad if it got up and bit me, but I'm sure that if I needed to play it I could and I would be able to connect it to my *own* way of playing guitar - which so far has been pretty successful.

    Tab is useful for those of us who don't equate squiggles on a stave with the guitar. I can hear the rythmn if I listen to the track - I can copy that easily if I hear it. I just need to work out where the notes are and I'm away. What's so wrong with that? However, that said... I totally agree that a lot of it is bollocks that has been transcribed by a tone-deaf chimpanzee with only a working knowledge of the guitar. Its usually far easier for me to do it by ear.

    There are more than 15 ways to skin a goldfish, as someone once said. And none of them are wrong...


    Never Ever Bloody Anything Ever.

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  • scrumhalfscrumhalf Frets: 11262
    I play my guitar happily.

    I understand that there are those who put great importance on learning theory, but to me it's the sound that matters. That's why I prefer the electric to the acoustic and it's why I prefer records/CDs to sheet music.

    I have undoubtedly picked up some theory along the way without knowng it, I know that some things sound right and some things sound wrong, but not necessarily why in terms of theory. And that's fine.
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  • richardhomerrichardhomer Frets: 24793
    edited August 2016
    I suppose what the OP is asking, is what goes through your mind as you play - how do you 'think through' what you're doing?

    I think it depends on your level of experience; when you're learning, thinking in patterns makes it (relatively) easy to play something that will fit - though not necessarily a genius piece of improvisation.

    I can 'hear' the note I want when I improvise and 'know' where it is on any string - in other words I've 'learned' the fretboard. This allows me to think far more about phrasing and dynamics, as the 'which fret/string' part of the process occurs without any real conscious thought.
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  • octatonicoctatonic Frets: 33725
    Do you play notes, intervals or patterns ?

    I thought it would be interesting to gauge how people on here approach playing, how you "see/feel" music and the guitar in particular...

    And what do you feel the strengths and weaknesses of each approach are, etc ? (if you have an opinion on it, of course)   ~O)
    Patterns are a dead end street.
    Notes and intervals for me.
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  • Danny1969Danny1969 Frets: 10356
    impmann said:
    Danny1969 said:
    I see everything in notes and intervals, being old n all but these days a lot of players don't because they learn from tab and tab teaches you fuck all about music. If you know Mr Brightside or whatever starts on the 17th fret of the A string and then it's 16th fret d string what has that taught you .... nothing! But if you know it's a D then an F# etc then you might notice it's 2 notes of a D major triad. 

    These days we have people who can play Malmsteen licks but they don't even know what key they are playing in..... it's musically illiterate and its caused by people more desperate for the youtube views than their want to actually teach something of substance 
    Hmmmm - well, I know nothing of music theory (and realistically, I don't give a flying badger's arse about it either). I taught myself to play by listening to music and playing along with it. If someone tells me the root note of the initial chord I can usually work it out from there but I have no idea or nor do I care about the theory behind it.

    I'm pre-YouTube generation, although I do use it as a resource if I'm learning a song for a particular gig.

    TBH, I get more annoyed by music fascists who seem to think that the only way to play a musical instrument well is to be able to use theory. There's far more to life than learning rules! I wouldn't know a major triad if it got up and bit me, but I'm sure that if I needed to play it I could and I would be able to connect it to my *own* way of playing guitar - which so far has been pretty successful.

    Tab is useful for those of us who don't equate squiggles on a stave with the guitar. I can hear the rythmn if I listen to the track - I can copy that easily if I hear it. I just need to work out where the notes are and I'm away. What's so wrong with that? However, that said... I totally agree that a lot of it is bollocks that has been transcribed by a tone-deaf chimpanzee with only a working knowledge of the guitar. Its usually far easier for me to do it by ear.

    There are more than 15 ways to skin a goldfish, as someone once said. And none of them are wrong...


    I spose it's a pet annoyance for me when working with other muso's, because if the singer decides he can't sing Hotel California in Bm, could we lower the key ?  I think the people I'm working with should be able to instantly play it in A for example and not have to "work it out" in Am ..... it's just basic maths after all and if we've trying to recreate a horn part from a record and I want someone to double my part in thirds I think they should be able to do that pretty much instantly in tune. I've got some friends who can find the right notes if given a few seconds but they will hit a load of wrong ones before finding the right ones. 
    If playing on your own or within your own band I spose it's not a problem 
    www.2020studios.co.uk 
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  • dindudedindude Frets: 8534
    edited August 2016
    impmann said:
    dindude said:
    Forget that, the real question is how do you get an upside down question mark?
    LMGTFY

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inverted_question_and_exclamation_marks


    Ha, I had to google LMGTFY to find out what it meant!


    Could LMGTFY also be the correct response to every post @thomasross has ever posted¿

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  • RolandRoland Frets: 8590
    Do you play notes, intervals or patterns ?
    All three. Mainly I think in notes. When harmonising I might think interval first, and then name the note in my head.
    octatonic said:
    Patterns are a dead end street.
    True, but sometimes when soloing my fingers say "the note you want is this one here" because my head has gone straight from target sound to finger placement without working the name of the note or where it fits in the harmonic framework.
    Tree recycler, and guitarist with  https://www.undercoversband.com/.
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  • octatonicoctatonic Frets: 33725
    impmann said:
    Danny1969 said:
    I see everything in notes and intervals, being old n all but these days a lot of players don't because they learn from tab and tab teaches you fuck all about music. If you know Mr Brightside or whatever starts on the 17th fret of the A string and then it's 16th fret d string what has that taught you .... nothing! But if you know it's a D then an F# etc then you might notice it's 2 notes of a D major triad. 

    These days we have people who can play Malmsteen licks but they don't even know what key they are playing in..... it's musically illiterate and its caused by people more desperate for the youtube views than their want to actually teach something of substance 
    Hmmmm - well, I know nothing of music theory (and realistically, I don't give a flying badger's arse about it either). I taught myself to play by listening to music and playing along with it. If someone tells me the root note of the initial chord I can usually work it out from there but I have no idea or nor do I care about the theory behind it.

    I'm pre-YouTube generation, although I do use it as a resource if I'm learning a song for a particular gig.

    TBH, I get more annoyed by music fascists who seem to think that the only way to play a musical instrument well is to be able to use theory. There's far more to life than learning rules! I wouldn't know a major triad if it got up and bit me, but I'm sure that if I needed to play it I could and I would be able to connect it to my *own* way of playing guitar - which so far has been pretty successful.

    Tab is useful for those of us who don't equate squiggles on a stave with the guitar. I can hear the rythmn if I listen to the track - I can copy that easily if I hear it. I just need to work out where the notes are and I'm away. What's so wrong with that? However, that said... I totally agree that a lot of it is bollocks that has been transcribed by a tone-deaf chimpanzee with only a working knowledge of the guitar. Its usually far easier for me to do it by ear.

    There are more than 15 ways to skin a goldfish, as someone once said. And none of them are wrong...

    Theory is simply an approach to the instrument- it isn't fascism- it facilitates musicians communicating with one another.
    It isn't mandatory, but when I've worked with people who are a) ignorant of music theory and b) have an attitude problem about it, then it makes the experience less fulfilling and slows down the creative process.

    I've never met any schooled musician who thinks there is only one way to play the instrument.
    The more you study the more you realise that there are a multitude of techniques and the smart players learn them patiently and methodically, incorporating new techniques into their playing until they get to be really, really good at it.

    Out of curiosity how many albums have you played on?
    How much professional work have you done as a guitarist? 

    On the 'none of them are wrong' argument.
    I'm speaking English to you.
    I don't have to- I could mash the keyboard like this:

    ihfrhwiufjkreljhioj eiowjjioeeijoeijoijo hdhdhoiehwoifewjoiefjwoiefw

    Hey, I've just invented my own unique language.
    Does it mean anything?
    Probably not.
    Will anyone want me to do it for money?
    Definitely not.

    I'm not against anyone expressing themselves however they want, but there are loads of guitarists who think because they aren't 'technical' that they have some special passport to awesomehood, and that their incredibly narrow breadth of ability somehow equals individualism.
    Schooled musicians mostly see them as lazy ignoramuses.

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  • octatonicoctatonic Frets: 33725

    Danny1969 said:
    I spose it's a pet annoyance for me when working with other muso's, because if the singer decides he can't sing Hotel California in Bm, could we lower the key ?  I think the people I'm working with should be able to instantly play it in A for example and not have to "work it out" in Am ..... it's just basic maths after all and if we've trying to recreate a horn part from a record and I want someone to double my part in thirds I think they should be able to do that pretty much instantly in tune. I've got some friends who can find the right notes if given a few seconds but they will hit a load of wrong ones before finding the right ones. 
    If playing on your own or within your own band I spose it's not a problem 
    Exactly.
    Being able to transpose music is a necessary skill.
    It isn't hard, and if you have the Nashville system down then it is pretty easy.

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  • octatonicoctatonic Frets: 33725
    dindude said:
    Forget that, the real question is how do you get an upside down question mark?
    The one I like is the interrobang:


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  • RockerRocker Frets: 4942
    impmann said:
    Hmmmm - well, I know nothing of music theory (and realistically, I don't give a flying badger's arse about it either). I taught myself to play by listening to music and playing along with it. If someone tells me the root note of the initial chord I can usually work it out from there but I have no idea or nor do I care about the theory behind it.


    I'm a bit like that too.  When I learned to play [??] there were no guitar teachers nearby, no internet, no instruction books that I could learn from.  All I and several others had  were friends who played, guys who played in pub bands and guitarists in Showbands, all these were more than willing to show me/us chords and 'how to play solos'.  We worked things out by ear and while few of the solos were 100% correct, they were close enough.  Most of my country playing involved thirds and single notes that were included in chords.  Descending bass lines always worked so I played those too.  I could sing passably, so got lots of work playing the pubs.  Depping it is called these days.  And I had several pub bands of my own.  Pay was very small - little more than covered our expenses TBH -  but we were out there playing and usually got a few pints of the black stuff for free.
    Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results. [Albert Einstein]

    Nil Satis Nisi Optimum

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  • scrumhalfscrumhalf Frets: 11262
    sıɥʇ ʇnoqɐ ʍoɥ `ʞo
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  • BucketBucket Frets: 7751
    Patterns more than I would like. I definitely think about notes a lot though, in fact I'd say some of "my" patterns come about as a result of thinking about notes. Intervals is one I struggle to grasp sometimes - not the theory behind them, just how to apply that knowledge.
    - "I'm going to write a very stiff letter. A VERY stiff letter. On cardboard."
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  • axisusaxisus Frets: 28280
    I noodle with the blues scale. That's about it. Non guitarists think I'm amazing, proper guitarists will see the facade.

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  • richardhomerrichardhomer Frets: 24793
    axisus said:
    I noodle with the blues scale. That's about it. Non guitarists think I'm amazing, proper guitarists will see the facade.

    I've been doing that for 40 years....
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  • paul_c2paul_c2 Frets: 410
    axisus said:
    I noodle with the blues scale. That's about it. Non guitarists think I'm amazing, proper guitarists will see the facade.


    I think there's a simple test which can be applied: Better than the Captain off of Anderton's Music; not as good as the Captain off of Anderton's Music. All guitarists fit into one or other category.
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  • stratman3142stratman3142 Frets: 2177
    edited August 2016
    I think in elements of all three.

    If I'm writing or trying (emphasis on trying) to read music then I think in terms of notes, but that's not very often.

    For general playing, I know where the roots notes of the scale (or chord) are located, like (sort of) imaginary dots that light up the fretboard and these serve as a reference points.

    The CAGED major chord patterns form a skeletal framework pattern for chords and, knowing where the intervals lie with respect to the root note of the chord, plus a knowledge of chord formulas, I can add to or modify the framework to create any chord. So a simple example is a minor chord which is just a modification of the major framework shape by playing a minor 3rd instead of a major 3rd. If it's a dominant 9th chord, it's just the addition of the b7 plus a 9th (i.e 2nd in the next octave) to the major framework shape.

    For scales I use the CAGED major and minor pentatonics as a skeletal framework and, knowing where the intervals lie with respect to the root note of the scale, plus a knowledge of scale formulas, I add to or modify the framework to create most scales, apart from some exceptions such as Phrygian and Spanish Gypsy scales.

    Using the major pentatonic pattern as a template: For the major (Ionian) scale I add the 4th and major 7th. For the Lydian mode I add a #4th and a major 7th. For the Mixolydian I add a 4th and b7.

    Using the minor pentatonic pattern as a template: For the Aeolian mode I add a 2nd and b6th. For the Dorian mode I add a 2nd and 6th.

    The melodic minor builds on the minor pentatonic and I think of it as the Dorian mode modified to have a major 7th. Similarly I think of the Harmonic minor as the Aeolian mode modified to have a major 7th.

    For blues/jazz I sometimes use Mixolydian/Dorian hybrid which I think of as a Dorian mode with an added major 3rd and a b5. This can also be thought of as a major pentatonic pattern overlayed on top of a minor pentatonic pattern, with an added b5.

    I think of the half-step-whole-step scale as the Mixolydian/Dorian hybrid pattern modified to have a b2 (or b9).

    ... and on, and on and on, I suppose everyone's nodded off my now

    So, for me, it's a mixture of knowing where the root notes are, knowing a few skeletal template patterns, then knowing where the intervals lie with respect to the template patterns so I can modify them to create other chords and scales. 

    Obviously it's also important to become familiar with the sounds these things create.
    It's not a competition.
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  • fretmeisterfretmeister Frets: 23919
    I just go apeshit in E minor.
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  • Intervals / scales for the most part. Whilst knowing what the notes are to facilitate conversations with bass player as to what the hell we are playing. I tend to start off with a scale appropriate for the chords/bass and then branch off into "wrong" notes for more interesting tunes. No rules if it sounds cool.

    Having said that, what @stratman3142 says about elements of all three, too. :)

    I try to invent scales but they always already have a name....
    I'm just a Maserati in a world of Kias.
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