You can now 'sponsor' the Andertons Youtube channel...apparently. EDIT - Now retracted for Patreon..

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  • digitalscreamdigitalscream Frets: 26451
    Jack_ said:

    That doesn't stop people questioning whether it's the right thing to do, just because it's profitable.
    Just to address this point, because I missed it - almost everyone on here declared that the video in which Lee railed against the bullying culture prevalent online was a huge mistake, he didn't know what he was doing and it would only result in reduced viewing figures etc. They were proven 100% wrong on that score, similar to the way all the declarations in this thread about what the channel costs are, how much it costs to get famous guests on there etc etc have been proven wrong through the use of actual facts.

    It's fine to question decisions, sure, but that has to be done in the context of the fact that the person who's actually doing it - and has proven to be more successful at that than most in the industry (and all of the people in this thread) - probably has a much better idea of what works and what doesn't.

    Ask yourself this: if you were running a bricks-and-mortar music shop struggling to engage customers in the modern age...would you put a thread up on this forum asking what to do, or would you ask Lee Anderton for advice? I know which way I'd go.
    <space for hire>
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  • Adam_MDAdam_MD Frets: 3420
    Jack_ said:

    That doesn't stop people questioning whether it's the right thing to do, just because it's profitable.
    Just to address this point, because I missed it - almost everyone on here declared that the video in which Lee railed against the bullying culture prevalent online was a huge mistake, he didn't know what he was doing and it would only result in reduced viewing figures etc. They were proven 100% wrong on that score, similar to the way all the declarations in this thread about what the channel costs are, how much it costs to get famous guests on there etc etc have been proven wrong through the use of actual facts.

    It's fine to question decisions, sure, but that has to be done in the context of the fact that the person who's actually doing it - and has proven to be more successful at that than most in the industry (and all of the people in this thread) - probably has a much better idea of what works and what doesn't.

    Ask yourself this: if you were running a bricks-and-mortar music shop struggling to engage customers in the modern age...would you put a thread up on this forum asking what to do, or would you ask Lee Anderton for advice? I know which way I'd go.
    @Digitalscream I completely agree with everything you’ve said in this thread.  
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  • Musicman20Musicman20 Frets: 2296
    Jack_ said:

    That doesn't stop people questioning whether it's the right thing to do, just because it's profitable.

    Ask yourself this: if you were running a bricks-and-mortar music shop struggling to engage customers in the modern age...would you put a thread up on this forum asking what to do, or would you ask Lee Anderton for advice? I know which way I'd go.
    Personally, I would never get involved in running a music store. I’ve been close friends and a customer of specialty music stores and it’s not for me.

    If I WAS in that scenario, I’d realise the market was cornered by Andertons, GAK etc and consider career options.
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  • Musicman20Musicman20 Frets: 2296
    I think it’s only fair that we all allow opinions (as long as they aren’t offensive) about this topic without coming across as a little aggressive. Some people are clearly a bit ‘miffed’ about the concept of paying one YouTube channel, whoever it may be. That’s fine. 
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  • FreebirdFreebird Frets: 5821
    edited June 2018
    I thought we were discussing the merits of YouTube channels charging money to view their content? I'm just trying to assertain what it is that Andertons are trying to do.

    The existing video content for sale model that I know is the one used by Lick Library, Justin Guitar, Ask Video, Lynda.com, etc., which are separate entities supported by their own website infrastructure.
    If we are not ashamed to think it, we should not be ashamed to say it.
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  • FreebirdFreebird Frets: 5821
    edited June 2018
    So, when he uses the existing - and well-established - opportunity to monetise some of that 85%, you carp and criticise and imply that this is all for his ego. Got it.
    Not at all, it's just that I've never come across a YouTube channel asking for money before, and using that as their business plan. Like I said above, all the people I have seen doing paid content run it from their own unique website with some kind of subscription model.
    If we are not ashamed to think it, we should not be ashamed to say it.
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  • soma1975soma1975 Frets: 6627
    edited June 2018
    Youtube pretty much only works because it is 'free to air'. I believe people have a concern about this being the thin end of the wedge and if there is tiered youtube service for those with money and those without then that raises some issues.

    I agree with the poster who said Andertons would be far better off scaling back instead of trying to saturate and corner the market and ask for sponsorship, but that's just my opinion. 

    My Trade Feedback Thread is here

    Been uploading old tracks I recorded ages ago and hopefully some new noodles here.
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  • guitars4youguitars4you Frets: 14030
    tFB Trader
    Jason said:
    On the Steve Vai 'promotion' front - I recall the last big Guitar Show at Olympia, around 10 years ago, when Steve Vai was booked to make an appearance and run a master class - can't recall how much the masterclass was, but limited to say a 100 paying customers - Approx 60/90 mins lecture and around £100  (or more) for you to pay -  @Jason might recall the actual cost of this, but Steve Vai charged the show organisers around 20K - Apart from him playing an Ibanez JEM at the masterclass, there was no tie in whatsoever with Ibanez on this as a co-sponsor 
    Steve Vai was around £20K appearance fee, but its more than that, usually its flights, 5 star hotel, limo etc, Nile Rogers was £25K + etc, I'm told Nita Strauss is £10K + etc.

    One thing you have to bear in mind is that, whilst Steve Vai maybe an Ibanez endorsee, Ibanez is distributed in the UK by Headstock Distribution, therefore they don't have any real deal with him, Ibanez Japan may send him over to do something, but unless it comes from HQ its a deal between Steve Vai and whoever wants his time.

    You find some golden ones out there that don't charge, but they are few and far between. Have you ever looked at how much first class flights are from Los Angeles (that is pretty much where they all live) and London?

    Its about £6K, no cheapo hotels (approx £400 a night, plus food) and a driver

    Hope that helps
    thanks Jason - I thought it was around 20K at the time - Thought you have some info/memory on this
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  • HaychHaych Frets: 5594
     They had an advert on the back cover of Guitarist boasting about 100,000,000 YouTube views. This is what your channel subscription will pay for.

    The gear they play is used for shop demo anyway, so all they are out is cost of the camera sound gear and the wages of those involved (which probably comes from advertising budget) 
    Probably a good thing that you're not their accountant, because you forgot a few little things. Off the top of my head...

    - the cost of the premises (they bought a house for it to keep it away from the noise of the warehouse and the shop)
    - the additional business rates
    - soundproofing and acoustic treatment
    - paying the guys (I believe Rob, Bea and Pete are all freelance)
    - editing
    - promotion for the channel itself
    - paying guests (might come as a shock to know that Steve Vai, John Petrucci et al don't do this sort of thing for free)...etc etc.


    Wait, what?! Back up there just a little bit! They bought a house to keep away from the noise of the warehouse and the shop? 

    Ok I can fully understand the need for a quiet environment but, they bought a house?????

    So if I have this right, and I accept I might be waaaaaaaaay off whack here but, if I chose to pay to subscribe to see the extra bits I’m essentially propping up Lee Anderton’s property portfolio?

    Oh I’m sure it’ll be nicely wrapped up in legalities and “belong” to the business, of course (eye roll).

    No wonder it’s costing them a fortune to keep the channel going!

    There is no 'H' in Aych, you know that don't you? ~ Wife

    Turns out there is an H in Haych! ~ Sporky

    Bit of trading feedback here.

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  • darthed1981darthed1981 Frets: 11670
    Freebird said:
    So, when he uses the existing - and well-established - opportunity to monetise some of that 85%, you carp and criticise and imply that this is all for his ego. Got it.
    Not at all, it's just that I've never come across a YouTube channel asking for money before, and using that as their business plan. Like I said above, all the people I have seen doing paid content run it from their own unique website with some kind of subscription model.
    It is pretty common these days, most of the Youtubers I follow have a Patreon site, like that blues singer girl who posts videos on a Tuesday, forget her name :expressionless: The youtube subscription thing is pretty new but a logical extension of the same thing.
    We have to be so very careful, what we believe in...
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  • darthed1981darthed1981 Frets: 11670
    Haych said:
    Wait, what?! Back up there just a little bit! They bought a house to keep away from the noise of the warehouse and the shop? 

    Ok I can fully understand the need for a quiet environment but, they bought a house?????

    So if I have this right, and I accept I might be waaaaaaaaay off whack here but, if I chose to pay to subscribe to see the extra bits I’m essentially propping up Lee Anderton’s property portfolio?

    Oh I’m sure it’ll be nicely wrapped up in legalities and “belong” to the business, of course (eye roll).

    No wonder it’s costing them a fortune to keep the channel going!
    Lee Anderton would, if the business were to "give" him the house as part of a dividend, have to pay a huge amount of tax on it.

    Ultimately, businesses do pay very high benefits to their owners, but ermm, why not?  Lee has built Andertons up from a small local guitar shop into a massive online brand, does he have no right to a financial return from that personally?
    We have to be so very careful, what we believe in...
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  • GassageGassage Frets: 30826
    I'm hearing Rob Chapman may have done a term sponsorship deal with Advanced Hair Studios.

    *An Official Foo-Approved guitarist since Sept 2023.

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  • valevale Frets: 1052
    edited June 2018
    soma1975 said:
    Youtube pretty much only works because it is 'free to air'. I believe people have a concern about this being the thin end of the wedge and if there is tiered youtube service for those with money and those without then that raises some issues.

    I agree with the poster who said Andertons would be far better off scaling back instead of trying to saturate and corner the market and ask for sponsorship, but that's just my opinion. 

    i think the problem is that they are in a nowhere land of trying to define (on the hoof) who they are & what they are trying to do, and to & for whom, and all the while they are flailing around the clock is ticking & the costs are piling up (a microcosm for this whole country atm, but another thread...).

    they used to be a demo channel for a shop. then they tried to be a comedy skit channel (top gear with guitars), now there's a forum & merch.

    my fav youtube channels are either the 'one person in a bedroom talking to camera' kind. they are really the heart & soul & core of what i think makes that medium great. so don't need acces to big resources.
    & then there's educational stuff to do with my science & space interests (conferences & explainers of theories & discoveries). either institutions publishing material or free access tv companies (PBS etc) with little youtube spin offs. so already have acces to big resources.

    the idea of a 'kind of but not' tv company run by 'kind of but not' employees tacked onto a big shop that 'kind of is & yet isn't' benefitting from the whole venture... sounds 'kind of' half-baked.
    hofner hussie & hayman harpie. what she said...
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  • HaychHaych Frets: 5594
    Haych said:
    Wait, what?! Back up there just a little bit! They bought a house to keep away from the noise of the warehouse and the shop? 

    Ok I can fully understand the need for a quiet environment but, they bought a house?????

    So if I have this right, and I accept I might be waaaaaaaaay off whack here but, if I chose to pay to subscribe to see the extra bits I’m essentially propping up Lee Anderton’s property portfolio?

    Oh I’m sure it’ll be nicely wrapped up in legalities and “belong” to the business, of course (eye roll).

    No wonder it’s costing them a fortune to keep the channel going!
    Lee Anderton would, if the business were to "give" him the house as part of a dividend, have to pay a huge amount of tax on it.

    Ultimately, businesses do pay very high benefits to their owners, but ermm, why not?  Lee has built Andertons up from a small local guitar shop into a massive online brand, does he have no right to a financial return from that personally?
    He has every right to do as he pleases, but setting yourself up with unnecessarily high overheads and then asking for sponsors because it’s costing a fortune to run doesn’t sit right, sorry. That’s my own personal opinion, I accept others may not agree with me. 

    There is no 'H' in Aych, you know that don't you? ~ Wife

    Turns out there is an H in Haych! ~ Sporky

    Bit of trading feedback here.

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  • digitalscreamdigitalscream Frets: 26451
    Haych said:

    So if I have this right, and I accept I might be waaaaaaaaay off whack here but, if I chose to pay to subscribe to see the extra bits I’m essentially propping up Lee Anderton’s property portfolio?

    Oh I’m sure it’ll be nicely wrapped up in legalities and “belong” to the business, of course (eye roll).

    No wonder it’s costing them a fortune to keep the channel going!
    ZOMG! A business buying assets by expecting customers to pay for its services! That's it, I'm boycotting every business out there. How dare they? :D

    soma1975 said:
    Youtube pretty much only works because it is 'free to air'. I believe people have a concern about this being the thin end of the wedge and if there is tiered youtube service for those with money and those without then that raises some issues.

    I agree with the poster who said Andertons would be far better off scaling back instead of trying to saturate and corner the market and ask for sponsorship, but that's just my opinion. 

    Have you been living in a cave for the last five or six years? Patreon, Twitch, YouTube etc have been doing this for years. It's very common, and lots of people are making very good money from it because people are willing to give small amounts of money to support the channels they like in return for extra benefits.
    <space for hire>
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  • toescantalktoescantalk Frets: 142
    Sounds like the demos will be free, but you can pay for more banter and "humour". So no one loses, except people with a bad sense of humour and bank balance.
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  • Musicman20Musicman20 Frets: 2296

    In other similar news, I saw a social media post that Chapman Guitars have increased their prices to make sure that everyone who manufacturers them gets paid properly. Another interesting topic....

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  • Jack_Jack_ Frets: 3175
    edited June 2018
    soma1975 said:
    Youtube pretty much only works because it is 'free to air'. I believe people have a concern about this being the thin end of the wedge and if there is tiered youtube service for those with money and those without then that raises some issues.

    I agree with the poster who said Andertons would be far better off scaling back instead of trying to saturate and corner the market and ask for sponsorship, but that's just my opinion. 

    Have you been living in a cave for the last five or six years? Patreon, Twitch, YouTube etc have been doing this for years. It's very common, and lots of people are making very good money from it because people are willing to give small amounts of money to support the channels they like in return for extra benefits.
    Aye, but this is one of the first instances I can think of where a fairly big existing entity has decided to change to this funding source.

    Traditionally patreonage has supported singular or small staff entities with a core/sole purpose. This is one of the first times I've come across a successful business trying to fund another part of their business this way.

    Could it not set a precedent? Doesn't small personal banking make little to no money for banks? So could the banks come out and say, for the service of providing you all with free cash withdrawals we'd like you to donate to us?

    Or a bar/restaurant like Weatherspoons saying that the bar part of the business is a loss-leader, so would you please become a patreon of our bar?
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  • HaychHaych Frets: 5594
    Haych said:

    So if I have this right, and I accept I might be waaaaaaaaay off whack here but, if I chose to pay to subscribe to see the extra bits I’m essentially propping up Lee Anderton’s property portfolio?

    Oh I’m sure it’ll be nicely wrapped up in legalities and “belong” to the business, of course (eye roll).

    No wonder it’s costing them a fortune to keep the channel going!
    ZOMG! A business buying assets by expecting customers to pay for its services! That's it, I'm boycotting every business out there. How dare they? :D
    Like I’ve said before, nobody is obliged to agree with my POV. 

    However, that said, regarding the whole house thing, my personal thought process would have gone something like this:

    So I’m gonna buy a house to do the whole YouTube thing. So overheads are going to be massive. Is it affordable? Can I prove a business case for it? Does it work on a business plan?

    If any of the answers to those questions are no, then you need to ask yourself the validity of going ahead with it. 

    Aha! I hear you say, but what if the business plan included said subscription/sponsor service via YouTube?

    Then its a risky business plan as how can you forecast what your subscription uptake will be, and the fact that you’ve factored your subscribers into your business plan paying for the effing house is a bit of a wtf from my perspective. 

    Still, for all my waffle the guy has much more business acumen than me so my opinion is worth zip. But while other businesses are looking to cut costs and reduce overheads, from my point of view, Anderton’s seem to have a nonchalant attitude if the purchase of a house is necessary to churn out a few YouTube vids. 

    Maybe there’s some good tax breaks to be had, I don’t know?

    Again, just my own view, nobody is obliged to agree. 

    There is no 'H' in Aych, you know that don't you? ~ Wife

    Turns out there is an H in Haych! ~ Sporky

    Bit of trading feedback here.

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  • Musicman20Musicman20 Frets: 2296
    edited June 2018

    I'm not a 'blues' player as such, but one of the guys I like, who genuinely seems to be very knowledgable, is 'intheblues'.

    He has built a fanbase, and I've never donated money, but it seems more like this is his career along with his band, and he never seems to go on about money...and just comes across very genuine.


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