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  • crunchmancrunchman Frets: 11411
    Bit worrying that Root is saying that the pitch was sub-standard and that there wasn't a balance between bat and ball.

    From what I can see, it was the batting that was sub-standard.  The number of loose shots from the England batsmen, including Root himself, was far too high.
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  • RandallFlaggRandallFlagg Frets: 13929
    crunchman said:
    Bit worrying that Root is saying that the pitch was sub-standard and that there wasn't a balance between bat and ball.

    From what I can see, it was the batting that was sub-standard.  The number of loose shots from the England batsmen, including Root himself, was far too high.
    Root said the same after the CWC final, he said the pitch was "horrible". His charging down the pitch was horrible! Perhaps he just doesn't like batting at Lords.


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  • crunchmancrunchman Frets: 11411
    Pitches like this make the game far more interesting than the flat ones that they score 600 on.
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  • RandallFlaggRandallFlagg Frets: 13929
    I agree, Ian Ward has suggested The Ashes is going to battle of the bowlers.


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  • sixstringsuppliessixstringsupplies Frets: 429
    tFB Trader
    The Aussie batting lineup is just as prone/naive as the England batting.
    The team that bats the best will win the Ashes, because both sets of bowlers are superb. I think it will be similar to the India series last summer, sessions swinging either way, but a closer overall scoreline. 3-2 England.  Can't see there being any draws!

    Delighted we won the WC but now I hope the ECB will put the same effort/resources into rebuilding the test team as they did with the OD team. I was dead proud of the England test team from 2010 to 2015. Hard to blame Bayliss as he was bought in to develop the OD team but the test team has been poor for 4 years now. 
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  • guitars4youguitars4you Frets: 14026
    edited July 2019 tFB Trader
    So what is our Ashes team likely to be for the 1st Test  - I said likely not should be

    Roy
    Burns
    Denly
    Root
    Stoke
    Bairstow
    Curran
    Woakes
    Broad
    Archer
    Leach

    I assume Anderson still not fit - If he is I can see them leaving out Curran - Personally I'd leave out Woakes - maybe tough on him after the WC and yesterday's 6 for 17

    Don't think any of us are convinced by Burns + Denly

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  • HeartfeltdawnHeartfeltdawn Frets: 22096
    crunchman said:
    Bit worrying that Root is saying that the pitch was sub-standard and that there wasn't a balance between bat and ball.

    From what I can see, it was the batting that was sub-standard.  The number of loose shots from the England batsmen, including Root himself, was far too high.
    The pitch was not-sub standard. London has had some utterly mental climatic conditions over the last few days and cricket has suffered accordingly. The hottest July day on record came with some humidity that hung around. Root might want to observe that England scored 300 during the best day for batting and that Glamorgan down the road to the Oval in the evening, when the humidity crept up and the ball did all sorts, got rolled for 44 in the T20. 

    Coming out and saying he has no doubts about the batting and blaming it all on the pitch is fucking laughable when your number 11 has nearly cracked a ton.  







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  • earwighoneyearwighoney Frets: 3487
    Coming out and saying he has no doubts about the batting and blaming it all on the pitch is fucking laughable when your number 11 has nearly cracked a ton.  
    Got to feel sorry for Jack Leach, bats the best out of any of the English batsmen and is rewarded for his great performance by being dropped for the Ashes. 
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  • sixstringsuppliessixstringsupplies Frets: 429
    tFB Trader
    Yes feel bad for Leach being dropped from the squad.

    To be fair I'd hate to be an England selector this week. Too many options for the bowling, not enough for the batting making it very difficult to pick an 11.

    1) Roy
    2) 
    3) 
    4) Root
    5) 
    6) 
    7) 
    8) Curran/Ali
    9) Woakes/Archer
    10) Broad
    11) Anderson

    Fill in the gaps! I don't think Archer will play first test, we'll see. 
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  • shrinkwrapshrinkwrap Frets: 512
    Still think Roy is too gung ho as an opener but they all are.
    We've seen Stokes play slow and sensible but yeah maybe not his temperament to be 2 or 3.
    Wonky pitches might come in handy if Smith gets set.
    Really looking forward to it.
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  • scrumhalfscrumhalf Frets: 11262
    Roy - yes, he's rarely found where there are low scoring rates but given our tendency to pass 100 with at least four wickets down maybe there's something to be said for trying to hit one of the Aussie bowlers of his stride. Plus, of course, until he's played a few tests you can't really judge him.

    Archer - if he wasn't fit enough for a run-out against Ireland then I don't think he's fit enough for a huge game like the first Ashes test of the summer. We might have Anderson who might break down again, Archer who might break down, and Broad who may have one of his NOT-getting-five-wickets-in-a-spell days. Too much of a risk.

    They have to stick with Denly, especially after Root ran him out. Plus, he's willing to play at 3.

    Baristow's batting has been poor, and I can't see him playing all five tests unless he bucks his ideas up. We have Buttler, Foakes and maybe Billings in the queue behind him.
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  • RandallFlaggRandallFlagg Frets: 13929
    Confirmed squad for first test:

    England squad for first Ashes Test: Joe Root (capt), Moeen Ali, James Anderson, Jofra Archer, Jonny Bairstow (wk), Stuart Broad, Rory Burns, Jos Buttler (wk), Sam Curran, Joe Denly, Jason Roy, Ben Stokes, Olly Stone, Chris Woakes.


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  • crunchmancrunchman Frets: 11411
    Why on earth is Moeen in ahead of Leach?  Leach is a far better bowler, and on recent evidence he might well be a better batsman as well.  Moeen is a walking wicket.
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  • StuckfastStuckfast Frets: 2393
    Did you actually see Leach bowl against Ireland? He sent down three overs of assorted pies and got smacked for 26.
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  • crunchmancrunchman Frets: 11411
    Stuckfast said:
    Did you actually see Leach bowl against Ireland? He sent down three overs of assorted pies and got smacked for 26.
    He's a better bowler than Moeen.  HIs track record in the county game over the last few years shows that.

    The series in Sri Lanka also shows that.  Leach was very much treated as the number 1 spinner.  He bowled more overs than Ali in 5 of the 6 innings.

    Leach also has the capability of bowling dry, and keeping an end tight while the quicks rotate.  Ali isn't that kind of bowler.

    One bad spell doesn't suddenly make him a bad bowler.
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  • StuckfastStuckfast Frets: 2393
    Well I like Leach, don't get me wrong, but (a) Mo has barely played any county cricket over the last few years as he's been centrally contracted, and (b) Leach plays at Taunton where the pitches have been doctored to suit him and Bess.

    It's a shame that Mo has been in poor form recently but I think fundamentally he's a really good bowler and certainly one who turns it more than any other English finger spinner I can think of since Graeme Swann. He has produced match-winning spells in English conditions against world-class batting line-ups.

    Really I think it comes down to the question of whether we want to pick a left-armer who will be more effective against the right handers, or a right-armer who will pose more problems for the left-handers.

    Also, while it's true that one bad spell doesn't make Leach a bad bowler, he came on exactly when England desperately needed someone to 'bowl dry' and get some control back and he completely failed to do so, while Ali bowled quite well at the other end.


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  • guitars4youguitars4you Frets: 14026
    tFB Trader
    Reports indicating Root to bat at 3 

    Therefore how will this pan out ?
    Roy to open with Denly or Burns
    Root at 3
    4/5/6 - I assume Stokes, Bairstow and probably Buttler - Bairstow to get the gloves
    7 - Curran
    8 - Ali
    9/10/11 - Broad, Anderson, Archer - If Anderson not fit then Woakes

    Certainly not convinced with Ali in the side, but as the only spinner in the squad then pretty certain he plays

    Assume both Bairstow and Butler in the squad as both will bat - probably Bairstow with the gloves

    Not convinced it is a well balanced side and the batting line up will get pundits talking before a ball is bowled
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  • crunchmancrunchman Frets: 11411
    If Root does bat 3, I think it's likely that Denly will move up to open and Roy will bat at 4.

    It's not a well balanced side.

    The criminal thing is that Foakes isn't in the side - especially when Bairstow has only been averaging 24 in test cricket since Jan 2018.
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  • RandallFlaggRandallFlagg Frets: 13929
    I'm not convinced on Butler as just batsman, he had a poor World Cup.


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  • crunchmancrunchman Frets: 11411
    I'm not convinced on Butler as just batsman, he had a poor World Cup.


    I'm not convinced either, but he's not quite played badly enough to get dropped yet.

    The frustrating thing with both him and Bairstow is that they have the talent, but don't have the technique and/or temperament for test cricket.

    Given the lack of other batting options, I can see why the selectors persist with them, but our batting looks far too dependent on Root and Stokes.

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