Is Grammar & Punctuation now a thing of the past?

Brize

Gassage said:

As I have mentioned before, possibly the most annoying piece of linguistic abuse currently in vogue is referring to people with the reflexive pronoun...

"If you'd like to return the documents to 'myself' or...'We'll be looking for the best deal for yourself...."

FFS, what is wrong with the elegant simplicity of 'me, I and you'......

It is enough for me to terminate phone calls.

Yep, this grates on me like nothing else. I'd rather listen to fingernails down a blackboard.

Sporky

It's also worth remembering that much of English formal grammar is deliberately complex and inconsistent so that the sneering classes can think themselves better than the productive classes.

In linguistic terms it's quite often the case that people with poor formal grammar actually have much better natural grammar, in that they apply simpler rules more consistently, making interpretation easier and less ambiguous.

DLM

https://www.theguardian.com/books/2017/mar/16/oxford-comma-helps-drivers-win-dispute-about-overtime-pay?CMP=Share_AndroidApp_Gmail

Sporky

I was only recently introduced to Oxford commas, but I am quite fond of them.

scrumhalf

This is an Oxford

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/59/Morris_Oxford_Series_V_front.jpg/280px-Morris_Oxford_Series_V_front.jpg

And this is a Commer

http://www.aronline.co.uk/blogs/wp-content/uploads/2012/09/commer-space-launch-e1347961602283.jpg

Rocker

No problem @Dave_Vader, good of you to clarify things..

RocknRollDave

We were recently asked to help my daughter fill in a sheet she had brought home from school.
The first part, which was already completed, was about what she had been up to at school, with the idea being that we would fill in the rest - i.e. the parts about activities at home.

In the "At School" section, I had to correct the sentence "I have wrote about the Billy Goats Gruff" to say ' "I wrote" or "I have written" '.

Point being? It wasn't my daughter who had written the sentence! It was either the teacher or a teaching assistant!

Nitefly

I hate airline-stewardess-speak, in which they put unnecessary emphasis on every bloody verb:

"We DO ask you to watch the safety video".

We DO hope you have a pleasant flight".

Rocker

Weather forecasters too @Nitefly ;

Iamnobody

hywelg said:

Language is important, blah blah blah

If, however, you would prefer for people (whomsoever they might be) to understand exactly what you mean then you have to understand and apply rules of grammar and punctuation.

I find two commas separating three words to be excessive and stops the flow of my reading. It may be grammatically correct but ease of reading wins the day for me.

Bridgehouse

Iamnobody said:

hywelg said:

Language is important, blah blah blah

If, however, you would prefer for people (whomsoever they might be) to understand exactly what you mean then you have to understand and apply rules of grammar and punctuation.

I find two commas separating three words to be excessive and stops the flow of my reading. It may be grammatically correct but ease of reading wins the day for me.

What, a, load - of: rubbish.

hywelg

Iamnobody said:

hywelg said:

Language is important, blah blah blah

If, however, you would prefer for people (whomsoever they might be) to understand exactly what you mean then you have to understand and apply rules of grammar and punctuation.

I find two commas separating three words to be excessive and stops the flow of my reading. It may be grammatically correct but ease of reading wins the day for me.

I don't care how difficult you find it, they are there for a reason, as are the parentheses.

And please do not, in quoting me, imply that I used the words "blah blah blah". I did not, and would never do.  Crass.

stickyfiddle

Iamnobody said:

hywelg said:

Language is important, blah blah blah

If, however, you would prefer for people (whomsoever they might be) to understand exactly what you mean then you have to understand and apply rules of grammar and punctuation.

I find two commas separating three words to be excessive and stops the flow of my reading. It may be grammatically correct but ease of reading wins the day for me.

This is a fairly bizarre stance. Surely when seeing a comma you don't stop and actively think "pause", you just keep reading, right? So how is a sentence being written properly in any way worse than it not being written correctly simply because you don't like the look of two commas?

Cacofonix

If human interaction is regulated by agreement, and proof of agreement is necessary, which is often the case, grammar is extremely important.  Important enough that people will spend hundreds of thousands of pounds in legal fees on points of grammar and interpretation.

i once had a job where a misplaced comma completely changed (at least on paper) what had been agreed. Luckily it was before the deal had completed, so was resolvable.

on the other hand, who minds if the local pub is advertising "Saturday morning disco's"?

BigMonka

stickyfiddle said:

Iamnobody said:

hywelg said:

Language is important, blah blah blah

If, however, you would prefer for people (whomsoever they might be) to understand exactly what you mean then you have to understand and apply rules of grammar and punctuation.

I find two commas separating three words to be excessive and stops the flow of my reading. It may be grammatically correct but ease of reading wins the day for me.

This is a fairly bizarre stance. Surely when seeing a comma you don't stop and actively think "pause", you just keep reading, right? So how is a sentence being written properly in any way worse than it not being written correctly simply because you don't like the look of two commas?

Agreed.
Sorry it took me over an hour to respond, it's just that when I got to each comma I had a sip of coffee, and with each full stop I stopped and had a quick walk round the block before continuing to read ;-)

Jalapeno

BigMonka said:

I don't really remember learning much grammar in English lessons at school, we certainly learnt more about grammatical construction in French lessons than we did in English.

Absolutely !

Learnt a bit about verbs/adverbs and sentence construction, but the conjugation & tenses etc were all new when I started French - they all made sense of course once you knew what was what, but I felt cheated !

VimFuego

Jalapeno said:

BigMonka said:

I don't really remember learning much grammar in English lessons at school, we certainly learnt more about grammatical construction in French lessons than we did in English.

Absolutely !

Learnt a bit about verbs/adverbs and sentence construction, but the conjugation & tenses etc were all new when I started French - they all made sense of course once you knew what was what, but I felt cheated !

same. I would say any knowledge of grammar etc. comes from reading, certainly not anything that was formerly taught. I have no idea what things like past participles or whatever are, though I probably use them all the time.

DLM

VimFuego said:

I would say any knowledge of grammar etc. comes from reading, certainly not anything that was formerly taught.

Yeah, formerly they used to teach all sorts of crap, like that the earth is flat and the centre of the universe....

Rocker

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-39459831 

snakemanStoo

snakemanStoo said:

Is this chap one of you lot?

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-39459831

Beat you to it Rocker.