The Grand National

Grunfeld

RandallFlagg said:

The OP asked for tips for the race not political rants about the ethics of horse racing.

Here's the thing:   I didn't know horse racing was cruel until someone mentioned it.
It just hadn't occurred to me.
I looked into it for myself, realised it was cruel, stopped having anything to do with it because it was no longer "fun".
So, it's worth mentioning.  Not shoving it down a throat.  Just worth mentioning.

EDIT:  Numbers.  I always think it's a good idea to have evidence.  How it speaks to you is of course precisely the point.  Acceptable harm?  Unacceptable?  Down to each of us.  It's surprisingly easy to just go, I'm having nothing to do with it again.

RandallFlagg

menamestom said:

I think they should do cow racing instead.  Nobody gives a fuck about cows.

The racing would probably go on a bit long and the jumps would be shit. 

Plus cows would probably stop to lick stuff on their way.

But could be good.

The cow hugging liberals will be jumping on this any second and shut you down @menamestom

RandallFlagg

for the record, we have a work sweepstake running and I have the following selections:

No. 4 Perfect Candidate (50/1)

No. 11 Drop Out Joe (50/1)

No. 32 Raz De Maree (25/1)

richardhomer

RandallFlagg said:

The OP asked for tips for the race not political rants about the ethics of horse racing.

Nothing political about it!

Some see it - I certainly do - as animal cruelty....

RandallFlagg

David P Muir, Equine Consultant to the RSPCA

Neither I nor the RSPCA condone or attempt to justify the death of any racehorse. The Society will always seek change where there is unacceptable risk of tragedies occurring.

However, I accept that sometimes terrible incidents take place where there is neither culpability nor carelessness by anyone involved. This applies to horse racing as it does to all walks of life.

The 10 years leading up to 2011 were the safest in modern Grand National history. But the four deaths in 2011 and 2012 and the subsequent media attention – together with the concerns raised by the RSPCA – prompted urgent action. The Society demanded comprehensive scrutiny of the race format and offered seven options for change (five of which have been realised). I am now confident that the racing industry accepts that radical change was needed to ensure the future of the race to accommodate the modern racehorse.

The new plastic core fences introduced this year are undoubtedly a major and welcome change, emulating the type of fence and resistance the horses meet elsewhere. Concerns have been raised that the altered fences may jump faster and my question in this respect is; do the horses determine the speed in a race, or is it the jockeys?

My view on Becher’s Brook has always been that the more gifted horses are able to cope with the many facets this fence offered. However, the drop, the turn, the adverse slope on landing, the solid cores, the adverse angle on the approach and the potential of bunching have, over the years created a fence where horses predictably fell with fatal consequences. Once again substantial changes have been made with the solid core replaced, the drop reduced and adverse slope on landing addressed. The fence jumped well on the first time tried in December, however, I will keep my counsel as to whether these changes are effective when the 40 horses in the Grand National race have negotiated this obstacle.

The high number of horses in the race, 40, naturally increases the likelihood of incident and offers the potential of bunching or horses and fallers getting in each others’ way with tragic consequences. Responding to the concerns of recent years I would have thought it would have been more prudent to help assure the future of this race to reduce the logistical  factor to 30.

There is one major factor that is rarely discussed and that is the jockey’s responsibility to ensure the safety and welfare of his mount. The inevitable rush to the first fence has seen many incidents where speed has increased the risk of falling. In a four-and-a-half mile race over 30 fences, surely the jockey’s thoughts should include the competent jumping of the initial fences to give his horse familiarity and confidence for the many fences to be negotiated rather than seek to dominate a leading position from the start. I have a great deal of admiration for the bravery shown by jockeys and ask that they keep within the whip restrictions as overuse of the whip aid is simply unacceptable especially in tired horses.

The stance of the RSPCA in racing is one of constructive, and where necessary critical, dialogue, and irrespective of the results of this year’s race this will continue for the benefit of the racehorse.

Fretwired

menamestom said:

I think they should do cow racing instead.  Nobody gives a fuck about cows.

The racing would probably go on a bit long and the jumps would be shit. 

Plus cows would probably stop to lick stuff on their way.

But could be good.

Cow racing has been going on for years .. bloody dangerous .. they don't stop to lick anything .. :-)







And Swiss fighting cows

Dominic

Horse racing isn't cruel and riding crops are not especially severe although hunting whips are more severe
Steeplechasing is cruel - especially the big races ie The National /Gold Cup because of both distance and the height and construction of fences such as Beecher's Brook and The Chair .
Numerous horses are destroyed  as a result.
The same goes for Puissance in Showjumping / Eventing.
I have no issue with lower hurdles or flat racing.
Flat racing is less exciting for Punters as bloodlines and form are rarely upset in the stakes whereas National Hunt is riddled with uncertainty and therefore more gambling "fun' for punters and bookmakers alike.
The reason there is more uncertainty is the deliberate height and difficult nature of the fences which are designed to level the field.
If you stood next to Beecher's you would be astonished at the height -image that looming up at a flat out and wrongfooted gallop.

guitarfishbay

Cows can jump.  Not as high as horses, but they can jump

DiscoStu

I bet on the National because it usually falls on my birthday weekend and is something I've done since childhood. The way I see it is that it will run regardless of my involvement or lack of and, well, I've made some decent birthday money over the years!

And we all need glue.

VimFuego

guitarfishbay said:

Cows can jump.  Not as high as horses, but they can jump

wrong, there are numerous reports of them jumping over the moon.

Rocker

Lay an each way bet on the horses that are ridden by the Walsh siblings, Ruby and Katie

RandallFlagg

Rocker said:

Lay an each way bet on the horses that are ridden by the Walsh siblings, Ruby and Katie

An EW lay? you don't expect either to place then? I tend to lay on the win as I've been bitten with place lays.

Rocker

The Grand National pays to fourth place. EW bets give you a chance of a return visit to the Bookie office...

blobb

Not even a proper horse race. People into horse racing don't care about it. Animals killed for the thrill of doubling your 50p stake, oh and don't forget the romance of it all. Ah yes romance, we love that don't we. Massive win day for bookies, and dog food factories. Ban it.

RandallFlagg

Rocker said:

The Grand National pays to fourth place. EW bets give you a chance of a return visit to the Bookie office...

Sorry I thought you meant a Lay bet as you did say 'lay'

I am a Lay better, very different to a regular 'back' better. 

Oh, and you should avoid regular bookies, try Betfair or Betdaq exchanges.

https://betting.betfair.com/what-is-lay-betting.html

Rocker

Our bookies pay the SP for the win part of the EW bet and ¼ the SP for a place (2, 3 or 4).

In the bookies shop, you will usually find that there are 3 windows for placing bets and 1 window for receiving your winnings!

Flink_Poyd

Never placed a bookies bet, not interested in horses running around, all you ever hear is about horses dying and it makes me think of an ex girlfriend from years ago who loved it. 
Nice day for those who enjoy it though

Nitefly

You'll all be pleased to know that Our Maud won £45 backing the winner.  My selection came second.

DesVegas

And no horses died

BigLicks67

My Grandad always said never back on a race with more than 6 horses in it, the GN is a mug's game for the benefit of the bookies.

That and it's pretty dangerous for the horses/jockeys. Stick to flat racing or the smaller steeplechase events.