To sell or to scrap

Lestratcaster

impmann said:

Lestratcaster said:

Who said there was a second hand gear box in the car?

As I mentioned before, what's the next thing that will go?

If you buy a secondhand car then obviously the gearbox is secondhand... thats my point.

Next thing to go wrong - well, VWs of this period suffer from electronic gremlins (wiring looms in the doors mainly) but the engine is bulletproof. Its a derivation of the engine that we had in our Golf Estate and that trouped on to 230k. The only reason we sold it was because the body was knackered and the guy who's bought it is now restoring that so no doubt that will go up.

If I was putting a gearbox in it, I'd put a clutch in it at the same time - approx cost around £85-100 for the part. The labour will be minutes as the gearbox has had to come out anyway.

With that done, you have a car that potentially has another 100K in it at least - what are you going to be able to buy for the same investment if you buy a replacement car?

Seriously... your garage is overcharging you.

I had a 94 Fiesta that that lasted 6 years on the gearbox that was in there.

The engine is very good I won't deny that but its the other niggly shit that I can't be dealing with. Almost everything's been replaced on the car.

impmann

You can't compare a cacky Ford to a VW... :-) Dreadful things... ;-)

What other "niggly shit" is wrong with it? Everything else has been replaced, as you say, so what else is wrong with it? Keep up the servicing, it'll go on for years...

Lestratcaster

It was cheap and reliable though!
Rear back tyre has a slow puncture.
I think there's also a problem with the suspension and the handbrake. Excessive creaking sound when I put it on.

ICBM

Lestratcaster said:

On my way to a gig last night in Brighton my gearbox went in my VW Polo 2000. I'm amazed how I made it from Junction 11 on the M25 all the way to near Brighton Pier!! The whining noise started back at junction 11 and I struggled to get over 60 mph without it over revving. I just about got by on 50mph to play the show. But it got really hard to change gears at one point the gear stick came off!! Shifting into 1st/2nd or any gear almost never happened and obvs if you're in gear you can't shift.

Are you absolutely sure it's not the clutch? A gearbox can't slip like that as far as I know - if the engine is over-revving but the car isn't going fast then the clutch is slipping. A gearbox either works, or the teeth strip - or it jumps out of gear - and you go nowhere. A faulty clutch also makes it hard to change gear.

Feel free to correct me if this is no longer the case...

ronnyb

The problem with difficult to engage gears sounds like it could be the pedal box. That is the metal cage which the clutch pedal is attached to the car body. The spot welds which attach the cage to the body are weak and become detached causing the pedal not to depress the clutch enough. It was a common problem with Polos from that era in fact I think there may have even been a recall for it.

strtdv

Scrap.

In full working order it's worth about £600-700, so with a new gearbox that's £300-400 loss.

For scrap you'll probably get £25

Octafish

ICBM said:

Are you absolutely sure it's not the clutch? A gearbox can't slip like that as far as I know - if the engine is over-revving but the car isn't going fast then the clutch is slipping. A gearbox either works, or the teeth strip - or it jumps out of gear - and you go nowhere. A faulty clutch also makes it hard to change gear.

Feel free to correct me if this is no longer the case...

Yes that's what I think also, sounds exactly like a slipping/faulty clutch. Also possbly an issue with the clucth cable or hydraulics, depending on what it has.

Just for the record, the common issue with failing VW gearboxes involved the diff pin in 020 boxes failing and the gearbox destroying itself internally. This also often broke the gearbox housing emptying oil and gearbox bits onto the road, not something you'd not be able to do 50mph with. Obviously, it's possible for there to be a different types of failures.

I'd look into a 2nd hand gearbox, as someone has linked, VW Stevens have them for £100+. I've bought some bits from them before and they seemed pretty reasonable. Be wary of 'recon' boxes, they are often just scrapyard ones that have been checked over for any faults, cleaned, painted and filled with new oil, then sold on as a recon.

Octafish

*Accidental double post*

impmann

ICBM said:

Lestratcaster said:

On my way to a gig last night in Brighton my gearbox went in my VW Polo 2000. I'm amazed how I made it from Junction 11 on the M25 all the way to near Brighton Pier!! The whining noise started back at junction 11 and I struggled to get over 60 mph without it over revving. I just about got by on 50mph to play the show. But it got really hard to change gears at one point the gear stick came off!! Shifting into 1st/2nd or any gear almost never happened and obvs if you're in gear you can't shift.

Are you absolutely sure it's not the clutch? A gearbox can't slip like that as far as I know - if the engine is over-revving but the car isn't going fast then the clutch is slipping. A gearbox either works, or the teeth strip - or it jumps out of gear - and you go nowhere. A faulty clutch also makes it hard to change gear.

Feel free to correct me if this is no longer the case...

Good call fella. I assumed the garage had tested for that.

Fretwired

It all depends on how much cash you have to spend on a replacement car. My sister-in-law had a nice top of the range Saab from 1999 that had done about 90,000 miles when it developed a fault. It was going to cost about £900 to fix. She scrapped it and bought a 2005 Passat for about 2K and its already cost her £300 for a clutch and an exhaust.

mike_l

Back when I worked at VW, Polo clutch release bearings were notorious for failing.......

Lestratcaster

ICBM said:

Lestratcaster said:

On my way to a gig last night in Brighton my gearbox went in my VW Polo 2000. I'm amazed how I made it from Junction 11 on the M25 all the way to near Brighton Pier!! The whining noise started back at junction 11 and I struggled to get over 60 mph without it over revving. I just about got by on 50mph to play the show. But it got really hard to change gears at one point the gear stick came off!! Shifting into 1st/2nd or any gear almost never happened and obvs if you're in gear you can't shift.

Are you absolutely sure it's not the clutch? A gearbox can't slip like that as far as I know - if the engine is over-revving but the car isn't going fast then the clutch is slipping. A gearbox either works, or the teeth strip - or it jumps out of gear - and you go nowhere. A faulty clutch also makes it hard to change gear.

Feel free to correct me if this is no longer the case...

The clutch was changed in 2015 (same year I bought the car) and its a hydraulic cable. The gear stick even came off when I tried to change, really hard to shift it. When the RAC were called out the bloke said that the oil that came from the gear box had leaked out underneath. Maybe the two are linked so I would have needed to replace both.

Lestratcaster

Fretwired said:

It all depends on how much cash you have to spend on a replacement car. My sister-in-law had a nice top of the range Saab from 1999 that had done about 90,000 miles when it developed a fault. It was going to cost about £900 to fix. She scrapped it and bought a 2005 Passat for about 2K and its already cost her £300 for a clutch and an exhaust.

Its the chance I take with a new motor

ICBM

I would spend more than a car is technically worth, within reason, to repair it - if it's a car I've had for a long time and know it's unlikely there's any more serious hidden fault. In fact I have done, several times. The problem with buying another car is that you don't know that, and it's often the reason they're being sold...

Lestratcaster

A fucked gear box is linked with the clutch anyway isn't it? The car is probably worth a few hundred less than when I bought it though I have replaced a lot of things. The clutch was done by Halfords Autocentre (stupid I know) and they didn't do a very good job, so it could be stemmed from that.

ICBM

Lestratcaster said:

A fucked gear box is linked with the clutch anyway isn't it?

They are two separate mechanical parts and they will fail in different ways, although the power from the engine to the wheels passes through both. What you've described sounds like clutch failure not gearbox failure, to me.

Lestratcaster said:

The clutch was done by Halfords Autocentre (stupid I know) and they didn't do a very good job, so it could be stemmed from that.

I think that's highly likely.

You need to find a good, independent mechanic or a small garage who won't rip you off. I know, rocking-horse droppings seem to be more common...

Lestratcaster

Why did the gear stick come off straight then and there was oil leaking out from under the car? The gearbox has lubricant doesn't it?

I do use a good mechanic who doesn't rip me off but as he uses his own parts with a 4 year warranty he won't fit a 2nd hand part.

boogieman

Unless the clutch has failed catastrophically and taken the gearbox oil seal out then it sounds mightily like a gearbox failure to me. That oil must have come from the engine or the gearbox. (Easy enough to check, just look at the engine dipstick level. If it's not dropped it must be gearbox oil).  The gear lever coming off definitely wouldn't be caused by a dodgy clutch: overall I'd assume you'll need a new gearbox. It's good practice to replace the clutch at the same time, you've already got everything removed so it's just a case of putting new clutch parts in when you rebuild the rest of the drivetrain. The existing clutch plate is probably contaminated with oil now anyway. 

I'm still not convinced it's worth the expense of replacing the gearbox though, unless you can do the job yourself and save the labour costs or you're hugely attached to the car. 

ICBM

Lestratcaster said:

Why did the gear stick come off straight then and there was oil leaking out from under the car? The gearbox has lubricant doesn't it?

I do use a good mechanic who doesn't rip me off but as he uses his own parts with a 4 year warranty he won't fit a 2nd hand part.

The engine over-revving without making the car go much faster is a clutch problem not a gearbox problem - gears don't slip like that. Being hard or impossible to change gear can also be a clutch problem, and trying to force it might make the lever come off.

But if the gearbox seal has failed and leaked oil onto the clutch, it could certainly be both, yes.

Lestratcaster

ICBM said:

Lestratcaster said:

Why did the gear stick come off straight then and there was oil leaking out from under the car? The gearbox has lubricant doesn't it?

I do use a good mechanic who doesn't rip me off but as he uses his own parts with a 4 year warranty he won't fit a 2nd hand part.

The engine over-revving without making the car go much faster is a clutch problem not a gearbox problem - gears don't slip like that. Being hard or impossible to change gear can also be a clutch problem, and trying to force it might make the lever come off.

But if the gearbox seal has failed and leaked oil onto the clutch, it could certainly be both, yes.

If it's near impossible to put it into first when the engine is off as well I think that's both?