Used diesel car values down 6%

ThePrettyDamned

crunchman said:

ThePrettyDamned said:

The other solution is mass investment in public transport and aiming to cut car ownership full stop. 

In cities, the better approach would be to get people on their bikes.

I found a Sustrans link that says 66% of journeys are less than 5 miles.  Of those, 56% were by car, with 33% walking, and only 2% by bike.  That's the problem.  Getting people on their bikes would get the NHS bill down as well.

Agreed, absolutely. 

crunchman

Wolfetone said:

MORE ABOUT CELLA

Why isn't this powering our cars?

No infrastructure for delivering it.  You can't go into a filling station and fill up with these (or hydrogen in a gaseous form either).  Presumably you would need a way of getting rid of the old exhausted pellets as well.

Also, no cars currently on the market that can run on it.

Whether in this form, or gaseous form, the government needs to be putting money into building hydrogen infrastructure.  Hydrogen fuel cell cars will shortly be available, but there is nowhere to fill them up.  Market forces will mean that without the cars, no-one will build the filling stations, and without the filling stations no-one will buy the cars.  This is a situation where government subsidy and support will make a huge difference.

strtdv

I drive a euro 6 diesel, but the majority of my traveling is done by bicycle, I live just over 5 miles away from work and it's considerably quicker to cycle than to drive.

The car is mostly for making the 100 mile journey to my parents etc.

We're going to be changing my wife's car shortly but not sure whether we'll go petrol or diesel yet. It'll be a Golf GTD or GTI but the GTD is about £3k cheaper for an equivalent spec car and is £200 a year cheaper to tax, so although we don't use it nearly enough to justify a diesel, it still makes economic sense

crunchman

strtdv said:

I drive a euro 6 diesel, but the majority of my traveling is done by bicycle, I live just over 5 miles away from work and it's considerably quicker to cycle than to drive.

The car is mostly for making the 100 mile journey to my parents etc.

We're going to be changing my wife's car shortly but not sure whether we'll go petrol or diesel yet. It'll be a Golf GTD or GTI but the GTD is about £3k cheaper for an equivalent spec car and is £200 a year cheaper to tax, so although we don't use it nearly enough to justify a diesel, it still makes economic sense

You do need to think about resale - which is what started this thread.

At the moment the government is dragging its heels about doing anything real about diesels, but they are proposing to let local authorities put in clean air zones like Sadiq Khan is imposing in London.

Also, we have a minority government.  There is always the risk of another election in the near future.  It's quite possible that Corbyn could be PM within months.  If Labour get in, I'm sure they will take a stronger stance than the Tories - especially as they have a lot more voters who live in cities and less in rural areas.

If clean air zones, or a Labour government happen, it could massively effect the resale value of a diesel.  It might well also have a significant impact on the running costs while you own it.  They could easily decide to put up diesel duty, or you might need to drive into clean air zones.

ESBlonde

strtdv said:

We're going to be changing my wife's car shortly but not sure whether we'll go petrol or diesel yet. It'll be a Golf GTD or GTI but the GTD is about £3k cheaper for an equivalent spec car and is £200 a year cheaper to tax, so although we don't use it nearly enough to justify a diesel, it still makes economic sense

Provided the used Diesel prices don't tank before you trade it in!

Danny1969

Personally I wouldn't buy a diesel, often the fuel saving is wiped out by higher servicing cost, higher maintenance cost and higher purchase price cause by the complexity of getting a modern diesel through the emission limit.

I'm all for bikes, I go everywhere on mine but it's not a suitable for of transport for carrying anything more than a rucksack. One of the biggest problems we have is there's millions of people getting into diesel cars everyday to drive into a city and stare at the same Windows screen they could have been sat in front of at home. About a third of your average office worker journeys are completely unnecessary.  


  

Evilmags

ThorpyFX said:

Evilmags said:

Looked at in those terms petrol is intrinsically superior as a fuel to diesel. It is less dirty. It's that simple. 

its not, there are other issues to add into the mix.... such as heavy metal particulates, benzene, volatility (ability to evaporate) etc 

But you always get a better explosion at lower compression and compression is the cause of the nitrogen particulates that cause cancer. For the same reason it would be cleaner using gas rather than petrol. 

crunchman

Danny1969 said:

Personally I wouldn't buy a diesel, often the fuel saving is wiped out by higher servicing cost, higher maintenance cost and higher purchase price cause by the complexity of getting a modern diesel through the emission limit.

I'm all for bikes, I go everywhere on mine but it's not a suitable for of transport for carrying anything more than a rucksack. One of the biggest problems we have is there's millions of people getting into diesel cars everyday to drive into a city and stare at the same Windows screen they could have been sat in front of at home. About a third of your average office worker journeys are completely unnecessary.  


  

All true.

I've only used the car twice this week.  Once for carrying guitars and amps etc. and once to give my mother-in-law a lift.  All my other journeys have been by bike.

My wife uses it a lot more, but she works 5 or 6 miles away with a hill in the way, and no good public transport.  She's a teacher so she often has to carry books or resources.  In an ideal world she'd use something electric for that, but we do make some longer journeys, and don't want to run two cars.

impmann

Danny1969 said:

 One of the biggest problems we have is there's millions of people getting into diesel cars everyday to drive into a city and stare at the same Windows screen they could have been sat in front of at home. About a third of your average office worker journeys are completely unnecessary.  


  

THIS.

However, so many old school companies can't understand this concept. They seem to equate being 'productive' by having a bum on a chair so that the employee is "visible".

99% of my job could be done from anywhere in the world - the interaction with my fellow office workers is minimal and not needed. However, I'm not *allowed* to home work even though I want to... its stupid.

strtdv

crunchman said:

strtdv said:

I drive a euro 6 diesel, but the majority of my traveling is done by bicycle, I live just over 5 miles away from work and it's considerably quicker to cycle than to drive.

The car is mostly for making the 100 mile journey to my parents etc.

We're going to be changing my wife's car shortly but not sure whether we'll go petrol or diesel yet. It'll be a Golf GTD or GTI but the GTD is about £3k cheaper for an equivalent spec car and is £200 a year cheaper to tax, so although we don't use it nearly enough to justify a diesel, it still makes economic sense

You do need to think about resale - which is what started this thread.

At the moment the government is dragging its heels about doing anything real about diesels, but they are proposing to let local authorities put in clean air zones like Sadiq Khan is imposing in London.

Also, we have a minority government.  There is always the risk of another election in the near future.  It's quite possible that Corbyn could be PM within months.  If Labour get in, I'm sure they will take a stronger stance than the Tories - especially as they have a lot more voters who live in cities and less in rural areas.

If clean air zones, or a Labour government happen, it could massively effect the resale value of a diesel.  It might well also have a significant impact on the running costs while you own it.  They could easily decide to put up diesel duty, or you might need to drive into clean air zones.

Resale isn't an issue.
We buy used and keep the car for long enough that it isn't an issue. My wife has had her current car for 7 years, and we'll be keeping her next one for at least 5 or 6.
On an 8 year old car even 20% difference in resale is only £1000-1500.


Actually, getting it on PCP isn't an issue either, as you have a guaranteed minimum value on return of the vehicle.


I live in Northern Ireland too, so I can't see any clean zones having a significant effect on me.
Diesel duty could go up, but on a car that does 7000 miles a year won't make much difference.

Still reckon I'm better off getting saving the £3-4k by getting the GTD over the GTI

Wolfetone

crunchman said:

Wolfetone said:

MORE ABOUT CELLA

Why isn't this powering our cars?

No infrastructure for delivering it.  You can't go into a filling station and fill up with these (or hydrogen in a gaseous form either).  Presumably you would need a way of getting rid of the old exhausted pellets as well.

Also, no cars currently on the market that can run on it.

Whether in this form, or gaseous form, the government needs to be putting money into building hydrogen infrastructure.  Hydrogen fuel cell cars will shortly be available, but there is nowhere to fill them up.  Market forces will mean that without the cars, no-one will build the filling stations, and without the filling stations no-one will buy the cars.  This is a situation where government subsidy and support will make a huge difference.

You're probably right about the back end infrastructure inasmuch that we need the means of generating the hydrogen but as far as the forecourt infrastructure is concerned, this stuff behaves like a liquid and can be pumped like conventional fuels. 

holnrew

When I lived in Gateshead I used a car club, it was pretty affordable. The public transport was really good too, buses every ten minutes from my nearest stop, metro to the airport and the coast. Wasn't much need to own a car.

People need to get over their attachment to driving when there are other options available. I understand it outside big towns and cities, where I am now it sucks not having a car, but electric vehicles could work better with more room for charging points.

I don't think it's fair though to penalise people for using fossil fuels until there's a real renewable alternative and shared driverless cars are viable

holnrew

The only trouble is I can see is monopolisation of it and being charged through the nose for long journeys

Nitefly

Fair point about ownership, @holnrew - I'm beginning to wonder about it myself.  

My car sits on the drive most days.  I use it for a 90-mile round trip to visit my mother once a week, and we use it for the weekly shopping trip (see mention above about out-of-town shopping at supermarkets!).  Beyond that, we sometimes pick up my 7-year-old grandson from school.

Very occasionally, we'll go for a long trip somewhere, but we can usually get to most places we want to go by public transport.

I just discussed this with SWMBO, and she agrees but says she'd hate to be without one altogether...