Finding new musicians

RedRabbit

This thread called also be called "What's wrong with people on JoinMyBand"!

Over the past few weeks I've had ads up on JoinMyBand looking for various musicians to start up a new band with me and a bass player I know.  The number of responses hasn't been great but there have been a few and initially discussion seems to go well quite often getting to the point of trying to organise a time and place to meet up for a bit of a jam and chat.  Without fail, every single one of them vanishes at this point.  

I get that people change their minds or have other/better opportunities come up but I just find frustrating and frankly rude that people seem to find it okay to act like this.

Maybe I'm missing something or maybe JoinMyBand is just full of trolls who enjoy stringing people along but it's getting to the point where I can't be bothered to put in the effort needed to form a new band.

Unfortunately, all the decent musicians we know in the area are in fairly established bands and aren't looking for extra work.  We've tried Gumtree & Facebook with similar results albeit the number of replies were low single digits for both.

Next ploy is to attend and perform at some local open mic nights but we are very aware that while we might find a singer but you don't tend to see many drummers/keyboard player etc at these things.

I refuse to believe there aren't some people around here who want to join a band but how do I go about finding them?

vasselmeyer

The problem is that guitarists are ten a penny, and bassists almost as numerous. Finding a decent drummer, keyboard player or vocalist is hard. The decent ones are almost all  in at least one band. I've had some luck in the past with drum teachers who tend to know  current or past pupils. In terms of vocalists, often getting another guitarist who can sing might be the best bet.

RedRabbit

vasselmeyer said:

The problem is that guitarists are ten a penny, and bassists almost as numerous. Finding a decent drummer, keyboard player or vocalist is hard. The decent ones are almost all  in at least one band. I've had some luck in the past with drum teachers who tend to know  current or past pupils. In terms of vocalists, often getting another guitarist who can sing might be the best bet.

Totally appreciate that.  I think only one or two from the responses have been guitarists though.  The rest have mainly been singers and few drummers.  Even if they are in high demand and find something "better" I still find it irksome when they just vanish without even a "thanks, but no thanks" message.  I know they don't owe me a response but I would think it common courtesy to let people know what's going on especially when you get to the point of trying to organise a meet up.

I've tried approaching local teachers before (in fact I think you may have pointed me in the direction of a couple).  I usually either get ignored (fair enough - it's completely unsolicited) or the students aren't interested.

ESBlonde

I think you've summarised the problems well, like any job interview there are far more applicants than there are suitable candidates. Even then the suitable candidates will have thier own agendas. Also as you point out the good/reliable players often seem to be in a working band already. This is why networking and not pissing people off is a good long term stratagy for musicians.
Keep at the join my band thing, there is no queue of ready made musicians waiting for you to form thier favourite band and it takes time. You have to kiss a lot of frogs! Sometimes having 3/4 of your band ready and carrying a passenger until the right dude becomes available (a nightmare keeping the other players on board) but a good fit will be more tempted to join a gigging or almost gig ready band rather than a start up project. Running a band is a real thankless tast and require some skill, I've done it for decades but now avaoid it like the plague.

guitarfishbay

I've been through this multiple times.

If you're trying to attract someone quality to join you, the short answer is you have to aim to have the best possible advert on JMB you can do.

There are good musicians using the site and in my experience the good musicians pick and choose, generally don't have their own adverts, and will contact you if they like your ad.  This way they don't have to screen the loads of people who will contact them with unsuitable offers.

We've done several rounds of recruiting people, starting with adverts with just rehearsal demos, to better recorded tracks, to mixed and mastered tracks with accompanying YouTube videos.  Genuinely every time we've put out better quality music/visual on our adverts we've got better responses from stronger and more experienced musicians each time.  We've also done the open mic thing - it can be hit and miss depending on the genre you're wanting to play.

If you're looking for a drummer or singer you've go to accept that they're in the position of choice.  There are loads of guitarists, and by extension any guitarist could theoretically play bass if they wanted.  So you've got to look at what you're offering them.  

Realistically a lot of start up bands never go anywhere, especially if they spend long periods with incomplete lineups.  For example you'll find good drummer/keyboard etc types won't commit to joining a new band that doesn't already have a singer in place that impresses them to the point they want to join.  There's no guarantee you'll be able to secure a good singer, and realistically in most styles the singer is the most important member in the band.

Any good and established musician probably already has their own list of contacts and opportunities.  So really, you're trying to convince them that they should join your band which might go nowhere over exploring other more proven avenues.

Stick at it, but look at what you're offering critically and see if you can take any steps to make your offer look more appealing to better musicians.  You've not said if you're doing covers or originals, or what your goals are, so it's hard to be any more specific than this

RedRabbit

@guitarfishbay - Thanks that's all really helpful stuff.

It's a covers band we are looking to start - classic rock and pop but trying to do something different to the pub rock standards (our current band does that and we are both getting bored with it).  Other than wanting to do something more interesting the current band is on its arse after the drummer quit to form an originals band with some old school mates.  We have tried just to recruit a new drummer to this band (already gigging and had a number of enquiries after our last gig which we couldn't follow up on due to lack of drummer) but have had no luck there.

The point on recorded tracks is a good one.  I kept pushing for the old band to commit some time and money into some decent recordings but they just wouldn't go for it so all I've got are a handful of tunes done on one of those handheld recorders.  They're fine for us to listen back to but they hardly scream quality.  The fact that our old/current singer wasn't that great (he's not following to the new project) probably wouldn't help much either.

I guess it's just a case of keeping plugging away.

guitarfishbay

Yeah just stick with it.  By nature the less standard you want to make it the smaller the pool of potential people you can recruit from.  To give an idea - we probably auditioned 20+ singers and 10 or so bassists, before we found the right people for our project to get it moving.  However even that is no guarantee it'll work out long term, unless it's a primary or significant income people tend to be less committed which is just how it is, priorities change and you can easily end up back a few steps at any time.

For covers the band needs to be tight but most people booking will be booking based on the singer(s).  If you just want to do pubs you don't have to have someone incredible but if you were planning on aiming more for function/wedding type work you can't have someone who doesn't cut it.  So to an extent I probably would put my efforts towards finding a good singer first if you can, and try and get some recordings up of say some acoustic guitar plus singer if that's possible to attract your other musicians.

RedRabbit

guitarfishbay said:

Yeah just stick with it.  By nature the less standard you want to make it the smaller the pool of potential people you can recruit from.  To give an idea - we probably auditioned 20+ singers and 10 or so bassists, before we found the right people for our project to get it moving.  However even that is no guarantee it'll work out long term, unless it's a primary or significant income people tend to be less committed which is just how it is, priorities change and you can easily end up back a few steps at any time.

For covers the band needs to be tight but most people booking will be booking based on the singer(s).  If you just want to do pubs you don't have to have someone incredible but if you were planning on aiming more for function/wedding type work you can't have someone who doesn't cut it.  So to an extent I probably would put my efforts towards finding a good singer first if you can, and try and get some recordings up of say some acoustic guitar plus singer if that's possible to attract your other musicians.

The bass player can sing reasonably well but isn't interested in being the front man.  I'll suggest to him that we do a few acoustic recordings to try and get the ball rolling.

Lestratcaster

Been through this many times as well when forming my last 4-5 previous bands. I've never been in a position where I happen to know musicians from school so had to form from scratch. I did get bands up and running and we did do gigs, record and such so it wasn't all to no avail.

I've been on JMB and many of the people on there seem to be young teenagers wanting to start their own band. Also alot of don't have anything to show in the form of demos, recordings, music videos etc etc. My last band had all the instruments bar a vocalist and I must have been contacted by about 22 different ones for the role. None of them got the role as half I didn't even meet. The actual vocalist we got eventually was off Gumtree.

Now Gumtree can be hit n miss, its full of weirdos but I have found musicians on there funnily enough. Just make sure you have some media to link as it'll give a better idea of what you're after. Gigs are still a good way to meet other musicians, we are overswamped with guitarists these days, good bassists and singers are hard to find.

RedRabbit

I've tried Gumtree in the past and it is indeed full of weirdos.  Interestingly I've just had a reply to a month old Gumtree ad for a drummer for the old band so I'll follow that up and see where it goes.

Sounds like decent demos are key though - bassist has agree to do some acoustic recordings and I might see if we can persuade our old drummer to do us a favour and record a few tracks with the full band.

horse

I think plenty of people will be put off by the idea that you've only got bass and guitar in place. Maybe be a bit sneaky and advertise for a drummer as if you've got a full line-up, and use a separate account to advertise for a vocalist - at this stage you're just wanting to find good people so that when you've potentially got a viable line up you can go back to them and see if they're still interested. Most good players and singers won't be interested in hanging around on the offchance you find the other required people for covers.

hotpickups

It's tricky admittedly and very frustrating as all you want to do is play great music. I've been there so many times over the past 14 years running bands etc and it really is a thankless task. 

As for finding musicians I have gone down the gumtree route, joinmyband with a moderate success. Certainly kissed a few frogs (and toads). Ads in music shops are good too. Then there's word of mouth. There's no easy route I'm afraid and it's a lottery who your going to pick up. As for vocalists my experience are the less ego and easier to communicate to has always been woman. Maybe it's their mothering instincts or I'm just being stereo typical or plain sexist But nevertheless don't rule anyone out even if they seem a terrible proposition. It'll soon be very apparent if they are and you say your goodbyes.

Gigs will be an attraction of particular interest to musicians too. How about lining a gig up and advertise that in your ads etc. Always good to have something to work to and to focus on. Nothing worse than perpetually rehearsing a set list, paying for rehearsal space and nothing to potentially to show for it. I joined a band a couple of years ago who was just like that. The band leader made it quite apparent after a few rehearsals that he's not that bothered about gigs and was just doing it to get out of the house. Funny thing was he brought his wife to every rehearsal who sat and watched/listened. So he left the house but also brought it with him in a sense LOL. 

Anyway I'm side tracking but an example all the same of how strange musicians can be and that was a pleasant one. I won't bore you with the arsehole ones I've had the KOT of working with, 


Really hope it works out for you as nothing is as rewarding as getting like minded musicians together making great music together. It will happen but you've just got to plod on with it. KBO as Winston Churchill once said

viz

I wonder if there are any drummer or bassist fora where they arrange forum jams local to you, but suffer the quandry of "but can anyone play guitar for the day?" Maybe they don't have a BigJon or an Octa. You could treat it as a recruitment day. 

hotpickups

viz said:

I wonder if there are any drummer or bassist fora where they arrange forum jams local to you, but suffer the quandry of "but can anyone play guitar for the day?" Maybe they don't have a BigJon or an Octa. You could treat it as a recruitment day. 

I was just thinking the same too as another recruitment suggestion  

RedRabbit

viz said:

I wonder if there are any drummer or bassist fora where they arrange forum jams local to you, but suffer the quandry of "but can anyone play guitar for the day?" Maybe they don't have a BigJon or an Octa. You could treat it as a recruitment day. 

It's an idea I've had before but joining a forum and coming forward as a guitarist who doesn't play drums had pretty much the entire membership rounding on me and telling me that I wasn't welcome.  I didn't hang around long enough to find out about forum jams etc.