Boss SD-1 out, GE-7 in

clarkefan

Well, for now anyway

I had an idea yesterday, new to me at least.  I use an SD-1 to push my DSL, the time-honoured thing, vol maxed, gain zero.

The thought occurred that actually I'm not using it as an overdrive at all, I'm using it as a boost, one with a fixed eq that cuts bass, pushes mids, knocks a little off treble.

So I thought I'd swap it out for a GE-7 for a laugh, cos theoretically it should do the same thing but with huge variety available in the eq bit.

Bloody brilliant!  Loads more boost available, plus lots of fun with all the eq options.  As much or as little bass as I want, I can trim the mids or go for that cocked wah thing a bit, I can crank the presence on the amp and knock off a bit of treble on the GE, etc

Can't seem to nail the actual effect of the SD-1 at this point, and it's noisier for now, but, fun, I wish I'd had this thought a long time ago

Sassafras

I like the GE-7 but it's noisy when all the sliders are maxed. That's why I bought an old MXR Graphic, much quieter.

DesVegas

Wisdom duly awarded.

Try this, for a subtle, slightly beefier, less muddy, brighter sound (depending on your amp)

+5, 0, -6, -4, 0, +2, 0, vol wherever

http://www.harmonycentral.com/forum/forum/guitar/acapella-29/1809951-

TTBZ

I used my Behringer eq for a boost and really liked it for the same reasons you do. Just can't get on with how bloody noisy it is when you're boosting frequencies into a dirty amp though.

bingefeller

Steve Stevens used a GE7 for a boost all the time.  It's all over early Billy Idol, Atomic Playboys, Jerusalem Slim etc.  

ICBM

clarkefan said:

I use an SD-1 to push my DSL, the time-honoured thing, vol maxed, gain zero.

I have never understood why people want to do this.

I did try it once - I can't remember with what amp... it sounded shit. Since then I've never once used one (or any overdrive pedal for that matter) as a clean boost. It's an overdrive pedal - it's designed to create overdrive. I've always found that if set right - with more dirt and a little volume boost, ie how you would set it as a dirt pedal into a clean amp - then it works well into a dirty amp too, and will still boost volume and cut through for solos because of the mid hump and tightening up the low end.

To be honest I just don't really get clean boosts at all, but if you do want one then it makes much more sense to use an EQ for exactly the reasons you said. I do actually have a GE-7... although I use it as an EQ and not a boost .

timmysoft

ICBM said:

clarkefan said:

I use an SD-1 to push my DSL, the time-honoured thing, vol maxed, gain zero.

I have never understood why people want to do this.

I did try it once - I can't remember with what amp... it sounded shit. Since then I've never once used one (or any overdrive pedal for that matter) as a clean boost. It's an overdrive pedal - it's designed to create overdrive. I've always found that if set right - with more dirt and a little volume boost, ie how you would set it as a dirt pedal into a clean amp - then it works well into a dirty amp too, and will still boost volume and cut through for solos because of the mid hump and tightening up the low end.

To be honest I just don't really get clean boosts at all, but if you do want one then it makes much more sense to use an EQ for exactly the reasons you said. I do actually have a GE-7... although I use it as an EQ and not a boost .

For high gain styles it’s great for adding saturation to the chugs and really makes the punches harmonics squeal. You might not be into that sound but for a lot of modern guitarists it’s an essential.

ICBM

Does setting the overdrive pedal to add gain and not boost level not do that? It certainly makes forced harmonics jump out.

timmysoft

ICBM said:

Does setting the overdrive pedal to add gain and not boost level not do that? It certainly makes forced harmonics jump out.

Not for tight percussive styles. You don’t want to add much more gain you just want the extra bite and more compression. I’ve used an sd-1 like this for years. 

guitarfishbay

ICBM said:

clarkefan said:

I use an SD-1 to push my DSL, the time-honoured thing, vol maxed, gain zero.

I have never understood why people want to do this.

I did try it once - I can't remember with what amp... it sounded shit. Since then I've never once used one (or any overdrive pedal for that matter) as a clean boost. It's an overdrive pedal - it's designed to create overdrive. I've always found that if set right - with more dirt and a little volume boost, ie how you would set it as a dirt pedal into a clean amp - then it works well into a dirty amp too, and will still boost volume and cut through for solos because of the mid hump and tightening up the low end.

To be honest I just don't really get clean boosts at all, but if you do want one then it makes much more sense to use an EQ for exactly the reasons you said. I do actually have a GE-7... although I use it as an EQ and not a boost .

Ok so my method is a bit different.

I don’t automatically want volume boosted, really you want to boost into what sounds good gainwise on the amp (as that changes with its gain control).

I stick the clean channel on and A/B the pedal on and off to find roughly unity gain. Then I switch the drive channel on and look for the tone shaping I want via the tone control on the pedal, and gain and tone controls on the amp. Only after I’ve had a play with the amp controls will I go back and re-tweak the pedals gain and volume. Sometimes switch the pedal on and off - with the way amps change tone at different volume settings sometimes it is better to run the amp gain a little lower and pedal volume higher. Or pedals tone control higher (to get a tighter response) which is then compensated at the amp to balance it.

Most amps don’t need extra gain from the pedal, and adding more gain could rob some clarity. The main exception I can think of is a Rectifier, because to keep that amp tight the gain has to be run a  little lower than you’d run another typical high gain amp. But even then I’d only add a tiny amount of gain from the pedal.

YMMV, when I play metal I do pick like a gorilla so generate quite a strong signal at source too which also helps in getting the tighter and crunchier sound.

ICBM

OK, well that explains it .

I still don't get it personally though... when I tried it it just sounded awful, really clangy and grating.

guitarfishbay

ICBM said:

OK, well that explains it .

I still don't get it personally though... when I tried it it just sounded awful, really clangy and grating.

That sounds about right lol.

Its specifically to get a tighter and more aggressive sound, mostly for the palm mutes, or leads.

If you aren’t playing fast heavy music then there’s no real point in trying to use the sound unless you specifically prefer it.

It is a problem solver really, trying to palm mute with songs above 180bpm+ sometimes an amp is too loose to get a tight punchy sound that cuts through an aggressive drummer mashing their cymbals etc

guitarfishbay

You might find you want to increase the bass on the amp when using a boost, since SD1/TS9s cut bass at source to keep the amp response tight. But still you might just not like the sound.

ICBM

guitarfishbay said:

Its specifically to get a tighter and more aggressive sound, mostly for the palm mutes, or leads.

If you aren’t playing fast heavy music then there’s no real point in trying to use the sound unless you specifically prefer it.

It is a problem solver really, trying to palm mute with songs above 180bpm+ sometimes an amp is too loose to get a tight punchy sound that cuts through an aggressive drummer mashing their cymbals etc

Yes, that definitely does explain it . I don't play like that at all.

I think what I don't understand more is why it's become so much the 'received wisdom' for more normal playing styles. I've always assumed it was a snobbery thing since you're then 'getting the dirt from the amp not the pedal', but I just don't find that a useful approach at all, I prefer a blend of pedal distortion and amp distortion for anything more than a moderate crunch.

guitarfishbay said:

You might find you want to increase the bass on the amp when using a boost, since SD1/TS9s cut bass at source to keep the amp response tight. But still you might just not like the sound.

Increase the bass? It's usually all the way up anyway .

Actually I suspect the opposite - I use a quite scooped sound normally (with apologies to all those who think that's wrong as well...) and pushing the amp harder rather than adding extra distortion is probably the problem.

I do very much like the sound of a *dirty* SD-1 or TS into a crunchy amp like a Mesa or a big Marshall (set the way I do) though, it's not that I don't like that tighter mid boost.

clarkefan

Thanks all for the comments and settings suggestions, lots of food for thought

@ICBM , I was a bit puzzled with some of your thoughts but I think you summarised your point when you said you prefer a mix of pedal and amp distortion for anything beyond moderate distortion.

We differ there, for whatever reason I don't like pedal distortion,  be it SD-1 overdrive or a "proper" distortion pedal.  I'm not claiming I'd spot which is which in a test but I've always preferred a pushed amp.  Pedal distortion has always felt small, or 2D or something.

So for me a clean boost (and now with eq options) is like being a kid in a sweet shop

Voxman

If you put an EQ or a clean boost pedal in front of the amp, it will act as a gain boost but you'll be OK as long asyou don't put the level/other sliders too high. If you want the EQ and/or any clean boost pedal to be pure EQ/clean boost without adding gain, you have to put these in the FX loop.  

I have a mini-pedal board just for that purpose. It mainly 'lives' in the FX loop of my 'Blue' Valvetronix but I also use it in front of my straight amps (where it adds gain) or in their FX loop (where it's clean).

http://i24.photobucket.com/albums/c33/voxman5/ADVENT-PC/Pictures/Gear/Floor pedals/Mini-pedal board for FX loop_zpsnlsbwov5.jpg