Thinking of changing my LP's wiring to 50's spec.

zepp76

As title really, I'm considering changing my Les Paul's wiring to 50's spec and upgrading the pots. I currently have OX4 low wind  PAF's installed so would like to compliment them some how. Can any of you fine people recommend a pre-wired harness please? I would ideally like a fully wired harness including 500k pots and switchcraft toggle switch and jack socket. Any ideas/advice you can give is much appreciated, thank you.

kossofffan

Have a look at Six String Supplies !

Jack_

@Alegree @TheGuitarWeasel

ftumch

I got mine from @shugz on here, dint think hes about anymore?

Collings

Why buy a pre-wired harness when to swap it over to 50s spec is just moving two wires, one on each volume pot?

Why not try that first.

Danielsguitars

yeah just move the cap from pickup to switch connector on volume pot 

p90fool

Collings said:

Why buy a pre-wired harness when to swap it over to 50s spec is just moving two wires, one on each volume pot?

Why not try that first.

Exactly, you can find out whether you like it or not for free, in about three minutes. 

Collings

p90fool said:

Collings said:

Why buy a pre-wired harness when to swap it over to 50s spec is just moving two wires, one on each volume pot?

Why not try that first.

Exactly, you can find out whether you like it or not for free, in about three minutes. 

It is worth trying out first as it does make the volume a tone controls more interactive which some don't like.

Gagaryn

Second trying it first. I did and didn't like it. Modern all the way for me.

soma1975

Just had it done along with an install of Ox4 low wind pafs in my les paul. Difference is night and day. Love the interactivity of the controls and every LP tone  I know is now accessible. 

Moltisanti

i've upgraded electronics with Mojo harnesses in an SG and a Tele and the difference is significant, I would say it's well worth the money and super easy to do if you can solder.

Collings

I never see the point in paying the very high prices I see some of the upgrade wiring harnesses being sold for. I can understand replacing cheap pots and switches but I don't believe fancy expensive caps and cloth covered wire make any difference to tone at all.

stickyfiddle

Collings said:

I never see the point in paying the very high prices I see some of the upgrade wiring harnesses being sold for. I can understand replacing cheap pots and switches but I don't believe fancy expensive caps and cloth covered wire make any difference to tone at all.

You're right. 

Good pots can help greatly, but that's more about physical feel (ie loose or tight) and pot taper, than anything else. Good wiring can help reliability, but posh caps do nothing except make your guitar look pretty on the internet. 

I actually quite enjoy doing my own wiring, but I can understand why some people don't want to.

Brize

zepp76 said:

I currently have OX4 low wind  PAF's installed so would like to compliment them some how.

May I suggest, 'What a beautiful mid-range you have, my dears, and a splendid growl to boot'?

springhead

There's a LOL right there!

Moltisanti

stickyfiddle said:

Collings said:

I never see the point in paying the very high prices I see some of the upgrade wiring harnesses being sold for. I can understand replacing cheap pots and switches but I don't believe fancy expensive caps and cloth covered wire make any difference to tone at all.

You're right. 

Good pots can help greatly, but that's more about physical feel (ie loose or tight) and pot taper, than anything else. Good wiring can help reliability, but posh caps do nothing except make your guitar look pretty on the internet. 

I actually quite enjoy doing my own wiring, but I can understand why some people don't want to.

i've read that before, but i've tried it more than once and i can hear the difference, and i'm not Eric Johnson

ICBM

Moltisanti said:

i've read that before, but i've tried it more than once and i can hear the difference, and i'm not Eric Johnson

Pots do, caps don't. You can easily prove this conclusively for yourself, if you have a small switch and the two types of caps.

No matter who is listening...

Collings

Am i right in assuming you would only notice a change in tone if you swap out the pots if the actual value changed significantly. Example a 500k pot which actually measures 470k vs a 500k pot which actually measures 530k.

Obvously taper and general build quality may differ also.

ICBM

Collings said:

Am i right in assuming you would only notice a change in tone if you swap out the pots if the actual value changed significantly. Example a 500k pot which actually measures 470k vs a 500k pot which actually measures 530k.

Obvously taper and general build quality may differ also.

I think there may be a difference in the internal 'self' capacitance of different qualities of pots which could affect the tone, but it would need careful testing to prove.

Surprisingly the resistance value is *not* that critical, despite premium pots being available with either tighter tolerances or higher overall resistance - you can test this fairly easily too, with a switch to add resistors to simulate higher or lower pot values. The lowest change which is reliably audible is about 25%.

sixstringsupplies

^ as above - do the mod yourself to try it out first before spending £50+ on a new harness.

also, if you do decide to go for a re-wire do
it yourself and use orange drop caps. It’s an easy circuit to wire. 

Collings said:

I never see the point in paying the very high prices I see some of the upgrade wiring harnesses being sold for. I can understand replacing cheap pots and switches but I don't believe fancy expensive caps and cloth covered wire make any difference to tone at all.

There is a lot of snake oil around caps - just use an orange drop you won’t pay more than £3.00

I’ve not come across any snake oil related to cloth wire - it’s just easy to use and there’s no danger of melting the plastic coating into the stranded core. It’s cheap too. 

I actually quite enjoy doing my own wiring, but I can understand why some people don't want to.

i find soldering very therapeutic! Recently acquired an extractor fan to remove the fumes - I solder every single day and naturally worry about health and what I’m breathing.

ICBM said:

Collings said:

Am i right in assuming you would only notice a change in tone if you swap out the pots if the actual value changed significantly. Example a 500k pot which actually measures 470k vs a 500k pot which actually measures 530k.

Obvously taper and general build quality may differ also.

I think there may be a difference in the internal 'self' capacitance of different qualities of pots which could affect the tone, but it would need careful testing to prove.

Surprisingly the resistance value is *not* that critical, despite premium pots being available with either tighter tolerances or higher overall resistance - you can test this fairly easily too, with a switch to add resistors to simulate higher or lower pot values. The lowest change which is reliably audible is about 25%.

The resistance is not relevant unless there is a MAJOR  difference. ) ie. 250k or 500k - It makes me laugh when stockists claim their pots are made to a tolerance of 6% - it’s not true - CTS don’t manufacture to such tight tolerances.

standard CTS would be 20% - with good reason,
as there is no audible difference between a 250k pot and a 300k pot. The human ear cant detect the difference.

”higher end” CTS pots are to a tolerance of 10%

ICBM

sixstringsupplies said:

The resistance is not relevant unless there is a MAJOR  difference. ) ie. 250k or 500k - It makes me laugh when stockists claim their pots are made to a tolerance of 6% - it’s not true - CTS don’t manufacture to such tight tolerances.

That's true, although there's nothing to stop you selecting them manually for tighter tolerance after manufacture, with a simple multimeter.

sixstringsupplies said:

standard CTS would be 20% - with good reason,

as there is no audible difference between a 250k pot and a 300k pot. The human ear cant detect the difference.

Yes, exactly - it's within the range where there is no audible difference.

If you use a small switch to add an extra resistor in series with the ground end of the pot you can simulate higher values, and if you add a resistor in parallel with the whole pot you can simulate lower values. You need the switch so you can engage or disengage the resistor on the fly while listening closely to the sound from the amp.

Doing this, I was able to consistently hear a difference at about 25% below, and 33% above, the pot value. By that I mean that you can *just* hear a shift if you switch it on the fly with a note or chord sustaining. If you listened to the two different sounds in isolation I doubt you would be able to call it.

I find direct real-time A/B switching the best method of determining whether these things matter or not. Often, you will find that something you 'think' makes a noticeable difference when you compare separately in isolation, doesn't actually make any difference at all... and sometimes, it does show that a very small difference is detectable even when you think it 'shouldn't' be.