Hotone Cyberry, Boss MS-3 ES-5

John_A

Been looking at the cybery, or similar for some basic midi control and looping a few pedals, am I being thick, or is there no way of putting pedals in the fx loop as well as in front of the amp?  Any suggestions on what would fit the bill? Really only need 4 loops and either 2 TRS jacks for amp switching or midi,

Edit - Had a bit better look and the Boss ES-5 seems to everything I want (can I have FX pre-amp and in loop?)  Any better suggestions?

english_bob

The way to use those things in 4CM is to use one of the loops on the switcher for the amp (loop send -> amp input -> FX loop send -> loop return). You can do this with any looper.

The advantage of the ES-5 (I suspect it does more complex MIDI stuff too) is that you can change the loop order, so you can swap things in and out of the effects loop.

John_A

@english_bob ; Thanks for that.  So i'd be left with 3 free loops on the cybery and on 4 on the Boss, which will also do amp switching.  Looks like the Boss is prime candidate, and other options I should consider? 

english_bob

John_A said:

@english_bob ; Thanks for that.  So i'd be left with 3 free loops on the cybery and on 4 on the Boss, which will also do amp switching.  Looks like the Boss is prime candidate, and other options I should consider? 

Assuming you do only need four loops, and you need the MIDI capabilities, I think the BOSS is going to be hard to beat for the price. 

Musicomlab make a switcher with a similar spec for about the same price...

vasselmeyer

The ES-5 doesn't have a specific FX-loop in/out; you'd have to use one of the normal loops and treat the FX loop as a pedal. However, you can move that around anywhere just like any other pedal. The other advantage of the ES-5 with it's midi controls is that you can have as many midi pedals (say a delay and a reverb) as last in the chain to your power amp and switch them on and off with midi so you can have more pedals than just the five loops.

I've got the ES-8 and quite honestly, I could get away for 95% of what I do with the ES-5.

John_A

Good point about midi pedals, think the Boss is the one for me - Cheers

John_A

Just so I've got this right - This means I cant have multiple pedals in my effects loop unless there's is a means of turning them on or off by midi?  really only have 2 pedals I'd want in the loop, but neither are midi  A HX FX is looking like a possibility, but have a Helix, and was really wanting an all analogue rig as a change.

Edit, with the HX effects in 4CM I'd only have one loop left, also looked at the Boss MS-3 but that only has one cmp control jack and I really need two TRS jacks.

I know there are solutions with all sorts of external bits and bobs, anyone got a good suggestion for:

2 loops in front of amp
2 loops in fx loop
2 TRS jacks for amp
MIDI
small form factor

english_bob

John_A said:

Just so I've got this right - This means I cant have multiple pedals in my effects loop unless there's is a means of turning them on or off by midi?  really only have 2 pedals I'd want in the loop, but neither are midi  

No, you could do this with the ES-5. Let's say you've got it set up like this:

Guitar to ES-5 input, 
Loop 1. Fuzz
Loop 2. Distortion
Loop 3. Amp (loop send -> amp input -> amp FX send-> loop return)
Loop 4. Modulation
Loop 5. Delay
ES-5 output 
MIDI controlled reverb (on/off via messages from ES-5)
Amp FX return.

With the loops in the standard order (1>2>3>4>5) you'd hear the effects in the order above- loops 4 and 5 are in the effects loop, and so are any pedals between the ES-5's output and the amp's FX return.

You could re-order them so that the modulation is before the amp (1>2>4>3>5), but you can't put the reverb anywhere else in the effects order- it'll always come last in the chain, in the effects loop.

John_A

@english_bob ; Thanks ever so much, looks like it'll do what I want without much room for expansion (and that's probably a good thing)   Cheers

english_bob

If you want at least a *bit* of room for expansion, the Musicomlab EFX-LE is about the same price as the ES-5 and has 7 loops. Beyond that I think you're looking at a big step up in cost (and size) to get very much more...

Not sure the Musicomlab switcher gives you quite as much flexibility as the BOSS, but that depends on how you plan to use it- the BOSS loopers are really customizable, although you'll need to RTFM, or join the Facebook user group.

colourofsound

I have a Musicomlab EFX LE for sale in the classifieds. Shameless plug!

http://www.thefretboard.co.uk/discussion/130005/fs-fuzzdog-trem-musicomlab-efx-le-voodoo-lab-brackets-price-drops/p1

I should add, the Musicomlab EFX LE is designed around 4CM; take a look at their website: http://www.musicomlab.com/efx-le.htm

Manual: http://www.musicomlab.com/download/EFX-LE_Manual_120E.pdf - Page 35 explains the mono 4CM abilities of the switcher.

John_A

Thanks again @english_bob ;  @colourofsound shameless plug welcome, does the Musicomlab also do amp switching, and if so how many controls?

english_bob

Just one TRS output for amp switching on the EFX-LE, so good for two functions on your amp, eg. channel and reverb.

Evo

I have a hotone cybery, seems like they're a little uncovered gem as a lot of people don't realise the spec.

It can do amp switching, midi, includes a built in buffer, and can be programmed via bluetooth on an app for your phone (INCLUDING the midi). If it has enough loops for you, then go for it! If it doesn't have enough loops then pair it up with a patch kommander or gigrig quartermaster type thing. 

Perfect for my board controlling a strymon mobius, switching channels via midi on my Mesa TC-50 and keeping on top of my tubescreamer and flashback delay. Can't complain at that price.

colourofsound

John_A said:

Thanks again @english_bob ;  @colourofsound shameless plug welcome, does the Musicomlab also do amp switching, and if so how many controls?

It does do amp switching, but I've never used it. A quick look at the manual reveals on page 33 that it can do two controls, I think.

I will say that the Musicomlab stuff is a tad more difficult to understand, not necessarily because it is more complicated than the Boss, just the way its laid out. Having had both the ES-5 and this, the ES-5 is certainly programmable on the unit itself; to do any meaningful programming on the Musicomlab you really need to use the software.

The Boss has deeper expression and MIDI features which I found fairly useless and overcomplicated when I used it.

The main reason I went to the Musicomlab switcher was for the Song/Set preset layout, and the fact that is has a global preset which activates when no other presets are on; pretty handy if you just need to get back to a base sound.

Might have just lost myself a sale there, but fairs fair!

John_A

You know what, that cybery will probably do what I want.

Amp has 2 TRS footswitches, preamp boost/channel & reverb/boost, can live without the second as Id have a reverb last in the chain.  If I get a USB/MIDI thingy for my Zoom MS-50G then I can use that as a solo boost too

drive & compressor up front, one loop for the fx loop and one for the delay.  

John_A

Thanks all - Just ordered the cybery, there was an ebay seller with one left doing them for £100.  It really is a rig to mess around with, my Helix gets all the gig time so it makes sense not to go too mad!

Just checked and the cybery also does midi over USB, so no converter required for the Zoom