Looking for advice about customs charges for imported guitars.

gibbo666

Dear All,

I have bought and sold a fair few guitars in the last few years, but all in the UK market.  Last month I bought a 1967 Gibson Hummingbird on Reverb from a chap in the United States.  The cost was £2,900, including well-insured shipping, which I thought was a bit of a bargain.

However, I have now received a letter saying that I am going to have to pay an extra £743 before they will deliver it to me (£95 Customs Duty, £622 Import VAT, and £25 Clearance Fee).

I had no idea the charges were going to be so onerous, and was wondering if any Fretboard members know if there's anything I can do about it.  Do the figures sound right?

Thanks in advance,

Clive.

Legionreturns

Standard import duty I'm afraid. Applies to all non EU goods. 

shugz

I was rubbish at Maths at school but you're in the 20-25% approx mark there for shipping and handling. 

I'd say (whilst I know it's a sore one), its not far off. I also buy and import (non guitar related equipment) from the US and we have to factor in similar 'extras' to what you've encountered here for the items we bring into the UK.

Cheers
Hugh

andrewaward

Yes if importing from outwith the EU factor in approx 25% of the price of the guitar plus shipping costs

prlgmnr

I just purchased a guitar from the US on Reverb and it wouldn't let me complete the purchase without ticking a little box to acknowledge that I was aware of import duty/taxes etc.

Of course in my case I'm probably going to have the joy of watching it set on fire/sawn in half before my eyes due to the presence of a rosewood neck.

bazxkr

Charges are correct. I'd pay it and get the guitar in your hands quickly before they think about whether any rosewood on it and confiscate it

StormshadowGuitars

Nothing you can about whatsoever apart from pay it, unless you're VAT registered in a music related business to claim it back.

VAT at 20% on Item Value & Shipping Cost
Possible Import Duty at around 3% of Item Value, this isn't always charged though.

Many Shipping companies such a Parcelforce will also add a 'Clearance Fee'
With a high clearance fee you can sometimes be in excess of 25% of the purchase price in duties.

gibbo666

Phew!  Thank you all for responding so quickly.  I guess I'll just have to bite the bullet and pay up.

Cheers!

Clive.

webrthomson

gibbo666 said:

Phew!  Thank you all for responding so quickly.  I guess I'll just have to bite the bullet and pay up.

Cheers!

Clive.

Actually those figure seem a little high on £2900; VAT should be 20% which would be £580 and import duty is 3% which is £87. So while they are in the right ball park I'd ask how they arrived at them. Sometime they use the insurance figure which can be more that the actual value of the item, if you can prove a lower purchase cost point they should recharge you. That is of course assuming you can stand the endless phone calls to HMRC.

Corvus

Think it goes item+duty, add post, VAT on the sum of all that so not just the guitar. Plus Royal Mail handling. Think duty is 3.5 currently, could be wrong.

I did get one where the seller had declared a higher value for insurance reasons, claiming back was not bad to do. Keep all labels & stickers, one thing was needed that I was ready to chuck.

Whitecat

Yes, VAT is also charged on the shipping fee, which is a joke but it is what it is... 

Bennyboy-UK

Yeah, I budget 25% for extra costs for stuff I buy from the US - which gives me an idea if its worth it when bargain hunting, or total costs if its something you can't find in the UK at all.

BTW i totally agree about the VAT on the shipping fees - actually the VAT generally.... but hey-ho...

gibbo666

I was just thinking ... if I had traced the guitar, but then got my friendly local music shop to buy it, they could pay the VAT and claim it back.  So, for a small commission, no doubt, I could have got it for simply the customs duty and clearance fee.  I can't see that there would be anything illegal in that - the shop is simply buying the guitar, and then selling it to me.  Any thoughts?

Whitecat

gibbo666 said:

I was just thinking ... if I had traced the guitar, but then got my friendly local music shop to buy it, they could pay the VAT and claim it back.  So, for a small commission, no doubt, I could have got it for simply the customs duty and clearance fee.  I can't see that there would be anything illegal in that - the shop is simply buying the guitar, and then selling it to me.  Any thoughts?

The shop has to charge you the VAT. Final end user is always liable for VAT. 

gibbo666

Hi, Whitecat,  I just went out for a faaaag and realized that obvious flaw, but thank you for pointing it out (and getting there before me)!

Schnozz

How does CITES work then, if you were buying from thomann or somewhere? Is that an additional cost?

Shrews

Reverb ask their sellers to the overseas market to inform their buyers of the duty and taxes  

https://reverb.com/uk/news/international-shipping-guide

It's not clear whether legally they need to do that or whether it's just a best practice thing?

One thing that does appear to be a legal thing is this:

"Instruments over $2,500 shipped anywhere except Canada require an Electronic Export Information (EEI) form".

If it's not got one then it may be that it won't be delivered anyway....or maybe a get out option for you  if you think it's now too expensive?

Shrews

I assume 'Civil' below means you could sue?

https://www.shippingsolutions.com/blog/who-is-responsible-for-filing-the-electronic-export-information-eei

Failing to file through AES when required or filing incorrect information can lead to civil and criminal penalties up to a maximum of $10,000 per violation. The Office of Export Enforcement (OEE) within the U.S. Department of Commerce and U.S. Customs and Border Protection within the Department of Homeland Security are the two agencies tasked with enforcing these rules.

Whitecat

Schnozz said:

How does CITES work then, if you were buying from thomann or somewhere? Is that an additional cost?

While we are still in an EU customs union (and possibly if we continue to be, temporarily or forever), CITES does not apply between other countries in the union. 

For the US and the rest of the world, permits are technically required on both ends and there is a fee involved. 

McSwaggerty

Whitecat said:I

Schnozz said:

How does CITES work then, if you were buying from thomann or somewhere? Is that an additional cost?

While we are still in an EU customs union (and possibly if we continue to be, temporarily or forever), CITES does not apply between other countries in the union. 

Whats gonna happen after Brexit then? 

Whitecat

McSwaggerty said:

Whitecat said:I

Schnozz said:

How does CITES work then, if you were buying from thomann or somewhere? Is that an additional cost?

While we are still in an EU customs union (and possibly if we continue to be, temporarily or forever), CITES does not apply between other countries in the union. 

Whats gonna happen after Brexit then? 

Nobody knows at the moment - hence my “possibly” remark. 

If we are not in any customs union with the EU then CITES rules will apply to anything coming or going from the UK to anywhere. So a guitar bought from Thomann would require export and import permits. 

The good news is that they are talking about relaxing the rules for musical instruments so it looks like if all goes to plan by September 2019 (or January 2020 at the latest) they should be removing the need for permits on “finished musical instruments.” But,
it’s early days on that and anything can happen...