Minimum requirements for modding?

Paul7926

Yep, me again..... This is a follow on from my questions about kit builds.

Since looking at the second hand market for guitars and successfully fixing the jack socket on my Epi my mind has wandered to the possibility of modding.  Now to be clear I do not expect to increase the value and 'flip' anything for a profit.  I'm more wondering about just having some fun and learning the pitfalls of modding on something that, if it all goes horribly wrong, will not leave me heartbroken.  My concern is that the ultra cheap end of the market might simply be too cheap to really learn anything from.  I guess if all goes well I'd like the thing to end up playable.

I've assumed that all that really matters is the wood used in the construction and the basic build quality in terms of neck straightness and fret work.  Not sure if that is a correct assumption or not. 

Is there a quality bottom line that if you go below it's all pointless?
Given that the G4M kits start at £70 and they seem to be ok is it better just to grab that?
Are there particular brands/models to look out for that make a good base for modding and tinkering?  (Again I assume something known to have reasonable build quality but ultra cheap hardware)

Again to be clear, I don't expect to increase the value of the guitar and I don't expect to end up with some super high quality instrument.  I'd just like to end up with something that is playable, unique and learn some things along the way.

munckee

I bought a used squire standard for £100 to play with. You can't find an aftermarket bridge for them but i changed everything else and painted it. Finished off as a lovely guitar and I learned loads. Sold it for £200 still made a loss but was loads of fun. 

Roland

Two approaches to this. As @munckee indicates, you could buy a secondhand guitar and change components. You can do this at your leisure, one or two items at a time. Or go the whole hog, stripping and repainting.

The other approach is to buy a kit and assemble it yourself. You’ll learn more about guitar building, but it’s likely to cost you more because the kit will contain components which you don’t want.

Paul7926

Roland said:

Two approaches to this. As @munckee indicates, you could buy a secondhand guitar and change components. You can do this at your leisure, one or two items at a time. Or go the whole hog, stripping and repainting.

The other approach is to buy a kit and assemble it yourself. You’ll learn more about guitar building, but it’s likely to cost you more because the kit will contain components which you don’t want.

That's exactly my dilemma.  Can I infer that because they are actual options then neither is better enough to rule out the other?

From a pure financial standpoint I'm thinking:

Cheap kit roughly £70 (Based on G4M kits) probably not use much if any of the hardware. 
Advantage : clean base to add a personal finish.
Disadvantage : Possibly more prone to error in needing to actually build it.

Second Hand 'named' guitar roughly £80 (based on a Squire Affinity Strat locally)
Advantage : already built and working
Disadvantage : Doing a personal finish will require stripping the existing one

Second Hand 'cheap' guitar £30 (based on an old 1994 Gear 4 Music fender look alike locally)
Advantage : Cheaper than a few beers on a night out, doesn't matter if I wreck it completely.
Disadvantage : Can it be worth doing anything to something that started life so cheap?

Mind you as problems go this is pretty trivial! 

EDIT:  Just thought of another option.  Go and buy a nice new expensive guitar and then use my Epiphone SG for modding.  Yeah I'm sure that idea will go down well at home.

munckee

My view is if you are thinking of keeping it I would start with a reasonable base decent neck and proper wood. If you know for sure whatever cheap guitar you are going to get is a decent base that's okay.  The benefit of a squier is I think it will be easier to fight compatible components.

Don't know about a kit, you can certainly strip them and repaint them.

randella

Paul7926 said:

Second Hand 'cheap' guitar £30 (based on an old 1994 Gear 4 Music fender look alike locally)
Advantage : Cheaper than a few beers on a night out, doesn't matter if I wreck it completely.
Disadvantage : Can it be worth doing anything to something that started life so cheap?

At the very bottom end of the market as in your example, I reckon there's some mileage to be had.  My friend (a facemeltingly-good guitarist) took his old Les Paul copy (a Hondo or some such) and made it play superbly by dressing the frets properly and sorting the nut and bridge. I was taken aback at how good it felt - the disclaimer being that it was early Sunday morning at his flat so we didn't plug in

On the downside all you'll get at the end is a lump of plywood with a fast neck.

There's probably a sweet spot at the Squire/cheap Epi point of the price range.  I'd be tempted to try and find something that's at least made of solid wood - if you are going to be stripping and painting, or routing new cavities, it'll be nicer to work with.

Funkfingers

Paul7926 said:

Is there a quality bottom line that if you go below it's all pointless?

No. Anything on which you work on will provide a learning experience.

For example, at the dirt cheap end of the electric guitar and bass guitar market, you will learn how much hinges (excuse the pun) on decent quality steel screws. 

FriskyDingo

I purchased a g4m knoxville with Ash body and upgraded it loads. If I ever want to upgrade the wood I'll take all the hardware with it.
I'm a beginner and they're worth the money

barry2tone

Went looking since I wasn't sure what G4M was.  

Don't know if it helps, but their clearance section includes stuff down to the price of a kit.  (£87)
So you get an assembled guitar for the price.


https://www.gear4music.com/Guitar-and-Bass/Squier-By-Fender-Bullet-Stratocaster-HT-Black-B-Stock/2R5P

Paul7926

local second hand shop has an Encore for £25.  I mean I know they are made of balsa wood and the hardware is made from compressed siler foil from polo wrapppers but I'm kinda tempted as a platform to practice set ups and modding.  I mean any parts I add can be reclaimed at a later date anyway.

Sporky

I was going to say that I think the easiest place to start is with a cheap but half-decent guitar - a Squier or budget Yamaha or Cort perhaps. Then you know you're starting off with something that's either fine or can definitely be made fine.

Then it occurred to me that if you do that and stuff it up you'll know you stuffed it up, whereas if you start with a cheapo kit you go in knowing it's going to be shoddy at best.

This is probably no help, but on balance I think I favour the Squier/Yamaha/Cort approach. Relatively easy to do electrics work on, possibly a new nut, some tidying and polishing of frets, basic setup... that sort of thing.

Partly, of course, it depends on what particular aspect(s) you want to learn (first).

Paul7926

@Sporky ;  The basic idea is to have something where I can learn the basic set up and from there fret levelling and polishing.  Replacing a nut and then things like tuner changes and finally electrics.  All the things that I'll eventually want to do to more expensive guitars down the line.

I don't expect to end up with anything that is particularly good afterwards it's just a way to learn without the fear of a mistake being a disaster.

Musicwolf

Paul7926 said:

@Sporky ;  The basic idea is to have something where I can learn the basic set up and from there fret levelling and polishing.  Replacing a nut and then things like tuner changes and finally electrics.  All the things that I'll eventually want to do to more expensive guitars down the line.

I don't expect to end up with anything that is particularly good afterwards it's just a way to learn without the fear of a mistake being a disaster.

This makes far more sense.  What you are trying to do is acquire skills, if you end up with a half decent guitar at the end of it then consider that a bonus.  I suggest something with a bolt-on neck to begin with.