Tone "in-mix" vs. isolated

robinbowes

I've always loved Guthrie Govan's solo in Steven Wilson's Regret #9, but what's interesting here is hearing the isolated guitar sound vs. how it sits in the mix.

First, the solo with the rest of the band:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IaH2C2Qe97Y

Now, the same thing with isolated guitar:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BL4OCue18jY

The isolated sound seems a lot harsher and edgy than it does in the mix.

Also, it's interesting to note at 0:40 that the video track has vibrato but the video does not show Guthrie playing vibrato, ie. he's "miming" for the video

Great musicians, great track, and great solo.

R.

Teyeplayer

It’s the sound in a mix that we so often forget as guitarists because we are so focused on getting ‘that’ or ‘my’ sound. I’m a big fan of the current Gibson firebird pickups for example -not because they sound great, particularly when isolated, but man do they work well in a mix.

I guess it reflects how we spend our time playing: live, recording or at home at bedroom levels. There is no right or wrong guitar-amp sound or one situation being better than the other imo, just different sounds suiting different settings and jobs.

Cirrus

You just don't need big low end when there's bass, drums etc filling that space, and in a mix prominent highs can quite often just = articulation and character.

It's quite interesting, if you actually want a tone to be bright and jangly or deliberately harsh/ cutting in the context of a mix, just how strident it can sound out of context.

Wonky

Great solo both times, but actually better in the mix for me. I'm a big Mr Wilson fan.
I personally wasn't surprised by how it sounded isolated.  Might be experience, or just used to hearing guitar on it own.  Also probably a factor that musicians listen to music in a different way to the average listener.  We tend to pick stuff out as opposed to just listening as a whole, as much a failure as it is a plus.
Steven Wilson has had some awesome guitarist with him and he's no slouch himself, but my personal favourite guitarist has to be Niko Tsonev.  I always feel that he's the one that reaches me most personally and also the easiest to identify without seeing or knowing who he is.  Guthrie can be a bit of a chameleon.  Niko is a really nice guy but most of all I can't seem to replicate his sound/feel even if I play the exact same notes.  The hallmark of a really strong player having such an identifiable style.

thegummy

I remember the first time I heard an electric guitar in solo I was so surprised because the sound I expected was what is actually the sound of the guitar, bass and drums mixed.

The solo vs. Mixed thing is an even bigger thing for bass - a soloed bass guitar sounds nothing like it does in the mix, everything from the low mids up is masked by other instruments.

In solo, I'd think most people would think a jazz with round strings sounds much better than a precision with flats. But in the mix both sound great.

ESBlonde

Can't listen in t'office, but I would expect the guitar to be rough, so that the edges give the nuance of harmonic lust that just makes the sound sparkle. All these polished sounds through computers that are pre fashioned seem to lack that to my ear. I know plenty will disagree.

Jota

I remember the first time I noticed a guitar line in some track where all the other instruments just stop and thinking "why do they always get the guitar sounding bad in this kind of breaks" until I noticed the sound was the same as in the rest of the song!