Pro set up on a budget guitar?

stephen.wood125

@Sassafras genuine LOL at that, cheers! I awarded Wiz as that's exactly what I went through, taught me to changes strings really quickly! 

Snags

Probably shouldn't say this in case I try to sell it on here in a bit but I paid £150 for a Fenix Telecaster (reduced from £289 in a clearance) about 16-18 years ago.

Since then it's had new pots (due to failure), a set of @OilCityPickups which have made it sound half-decent, and is currently being fettled by <anonymous until I pick it up> because after taking the time to adjust a few things I realised just how toss some of the fretwork was, and how much it needed a sort-out from someone a bit more clueful than myself.

Hopefully collecting it Friday evening, and will have spent more on parts and setup then it cost in the first place, but hopefully taking it from a guitar I quite like playing but had niggles with, to a guitar I can actually use in anger.

thegummy

It's always seemed to me that telling people, especially a beginner, to get a professional setup because it will magically improve the guitar is a bit of "received internet wisdom".

If the nut isn't cut properly at the factory then having that fixed will definitely improve the guitar greatly, there's no doubt about that.

But with other aspects of the setup, it's just about personal taste - if someone personally likes lower or higher action; straighter or more relived neck etc. than it comes from the factory. But with those things a beginner probably won't even know what he prefers or be unable to describe in technical terms to a repairman.

It's so easy to learn to do those parts of the setup and it means they can try out different settings for long enough to learn what they prefer.

I can't help but think that, stemming from genuinely good advice, there has sprouted the idea that a setup will magically make any guitar better than it was before hand.

Richardrichard

Whilst I think you're correct, I think it assumes that the off the shelf guitar is poorly set up, which would be fair in the majority of cases. Thus if you don't know what you're doing, having a good tech set it up to some default lowish action intonated position will be a good call.

relic245

FelineGuitars said:

If you were local to us we would give a free health check and give some solid advice and offer to tackle the things that will be best bang for the buck and give him a well playing guitar that will serve him well.

A lot of cheaper guitars REALLY improve with specialist 

If I were local to you Id be in like a shot. I'm up near Sheffield though so a bit far.

I'm planning to go to the place in Leicester that you recommended in another thread,

phil_b

PonchoGreg said:

As long as it doesn't involve a £100+ fret level it's definitely worth it. Just a new nut (or even reworking the existing one) and finding the sweet spot for relief and action will pay dividends

interesting at what point does a fret levelling become worth it. you could buy another guitar for that £100 but that wont be set up either. The thing is guitars are getting cheaper but services that require someone putting in skilled time get more expensive.

you could learn to do it yourself but then you still need to invest in the correct tools

are cheap guitars not worth working on?

Nikc

A decent setup is worth it - I did say decent

richardhomer

It might be worth using online resources to learn how to do it yourself. In my experience, ANY guitar can be improved (regardless of price) if it needs a set up. I appreciate cost is a factor in the equation - hence developing your own skills is a good way to invest your time.

relic245

richardhomer said:

It might be worth using online resources to learn how to do it yourself. In my experience, ANY guitar can be improved (regardless of price) if it needs a set up. I appreciate cost is a factor in the equation - hence developing your own skills is a good way to in

To be honest, I don't really have the time or inclination to learn how to do this and would much rather pay someone who is already good at it.

I have little enough time for playing guitar at the moment anyway and don't want to dilute it even more.

My past DIY experience would really stop me from wanting to do my own set ups on my 335 or Tele too

steveledzep

relic245 said:

richardhomer said:

It might be worth using online resources to learn how to do it yourself. In my experience, ANY guitar can be improved (regardless of price) if it needs a set up. I appreciate cost is a factor in the equation - hence developing your own skills is a good way to in

To be honest, I don't really have the time or inclination to learn how to do this and would much rather pay someone who is already good at it.

I have little enough time for playing guitar at the moment anyway and don't want to dilute it even more.

My past DIY experience would really stop me from wanting to do my own set ups on my 335 or Tele too

You don't sound very interested.  Why are you even here ?

thegummy

relic245 said:

richardhomer said:

It might be worth using online resources to learn how to do it yourself. In my experience, ANY guitar can be improved (regardless of price) if it needs a set up. I appreciate cost is a factor in the equation - hence developing your own skills is a good way to in

To be honest, I don't really have the time or inclination to learn how to do this and would much rather pay someone who is already good at it.

I have little enough time for playing guitar at the moment anyway and don't want to dilute it even more.

My past DIY experience would really stop me from wanting to do my own set ups on my 335 or Tele too

Word of warning, you might find someone with a faster turn around, but when I've put guitars in it's been a week or more before I get it back so you might actually be away from the guitar for longer doing it that way.

relic245

steveledzep said:

You don't sound very interested.  Why are you even here ?

You're right @steveledzep I don't have a whole lot of interest in learning to set up guitars. 

I do have a lot of interest in playing guitars which is why I've been doing it for around 45 years now and still gigging occasionally. 

I'm here because I enjoy reading about gear and hearing other people's opinions (mostly.) I read a lot of posts and occasionally comment when I think I have something to say that may either add value or that other people may find interesting.  I learn a lot from reading. For example, I have learned a lot about how to get the most from my HX FX just by reading about how others use theirs. 

I'm here also because on the few occasions that I ask questions, there are many people here who know more than I do. I particularly value that on the whole, people are friendly and welcoming and often very willing to share their knowledge with me. 

relic245

thegummy said:

relic245 said:

richardhomer said:

It might be worth using online resources to learn how to do it yourself. In my experience, ANY guitar can be improved (regardless of price) if it needs a set up. I appreciate cost is a factor in the equation - hence developing your own skills is a good way to in

To be honest, I don't really have the time or inclination to learn how to do this and would much rather pay someone who is already good at it.

I have little enough time for playing guitar at the moment anyway and don't want to dilute it even more.

My past DIY experience would really stop me from wanting to do my own set ups on my 335 or Tele too

Word of warning, you might find someone with a faster turn around, but when I've put guitars in it's been a week or more before I get it back so you might actually be away from the guitar for longer doing it that way.

That's ok - we have other guitars and if it's a week I'd be very happy with that. A well-known guitar tech once took 2 months to set up a guitar for me which I was told was not unusual for him and that I only got it done that fast because I kept harassing him

Rocker

It is not a requirement to learn how to setup a guitar to get enjoyment from playing it.  A pro can adjust the nut and the action to make the guitar, even a cheap one, play better.  A beginner needs this kind of help.  And not everyone has unlimited time available to play guitar.  A well setup guitar will make limited playing time all the more enjoyable.  That has to be a good thing.

hollywoodrox

Definitely . The js11 seems amazing value for money  a pro setup makes a world of difference on any guitar . The js11 has a decent spec and should get a lot of mileage once set up properly 

sweepy

Two months for a setup ! I fret if I can't turn it round within a week 

relic245

sweepy said:

Two months for a setup ! I fret if I can't turn it round within a week 

To be fair to the guy he was upfront about how long things took him.  He always had at least 30 guitars in his workshop each time that I went. 

I think he also had a lot of professionals as clients and when they brought stuff in they got priority. I guess effectively the rest of us kept getting bumped to the back of the queue. 

You could argue about that as a customer service model but it was his way of doing business and seemed to work for him.

roberty

OilCityPickups said:

thegummy said:

roberty said:

£50 seems a bit steep for basic setup?  Nut, neck relief, action, intonation. Probably the nut that's messing your tuning up

It's actually a lot lower than I've seen it for. Usually I see it costing more like £80.

I was going to say that ... beat me to it.

I've never paid anywhere near £80 for a basic set up. Guess it depends where you go and what the overheads are

Snags

Revisiting this, having picked up two "is it worth it?" guitars I left with @gary_mac for some attention to say yes, yes it is. We had a realistic chat about what needed doing to both (old battle-scarred Takamine EG332C and a Fenix Tele copy), and what made economic sense,  and Gary's done a great job at turning two instruments that were essentially unusable into decent functional tools again. And for not very much money at all,  in the overall scheme of things. Highly recommended.

jasperthecat

If the guitar doesn't hold it's tune then the first thing I'd do is look at the nut to see if any of the strings are being nipped.
You can usually hear it during fine tuning the string... it often 'pings' as it breaks free of being nipped. If the cause of going out of tune is due to being nipped by the nut then often a simple remedy is to gently scrape the tip of the lead of a pencil with a sharp knife with the scrapings falling into the offending nut slot which will usually lubricate the slot enough to stop the string being trapped and suddenly releasing which makes the guitar go out of tune.

Nut files are obviously the best way of opening up a slot if it's too tight for the string but they're very expensive. If you're extremely careful you can get away with taking a thou or two off the walls of the slot with some extremely fine wet and dry paper but take care not to over-deepen the slot.

Of course it could be that the tuners are the cause of the tuning problem but to be honest I've never had a guitar which wouldn't stay in tune solely due to tuners. Often going out of tune is due to incorrect winding on of the string onto the tuner post. If too much of the string is wound onto the post then the string will override other laps of the string which often results in the string slipping off the layer below and making the guitar out of tune. 

Most guitars, even expensive ones often need setting up so it's not just cheaper guitars which have problems and a good set up is often required to get the most from any instrument.
Most cheap guitars these days are quite reasonable value for money but shortcuts have to be made to keep prices down, particularly in labour saving, hence many cheap guitars need a certain amount of 'finishing' to get the most from them.
 
Only three days ago I bought a Squier Strat SE for the princely sum of £10.00. I don't think it had hardly ever been played and was relegated to being stored in a loft. Originally I'm told it would have been sold with an amp etc as a starter kit so it wouldn't have been terribly expensive to start with.
It had half of the strings missing and clearly had never had a set up and must have sounded dreadful when new as the intonation had never been adjusted nor had the string or pups heights.
However all it took was to clean the neck, check it and set the neck straight via truss rod adjustment, then find and level any errant high frets of which there was only two which stood out as problems, then give the frets a polish and restring it, set up the neck relief and action height and adjust the intonation and it now plays as good as any of my other 9 guitars that I own.

Of the other 9 guitars I own, they've all needed setting up including 3 having/needing full fret dressing/leveling which I carried out myself.  It's maybe a bit of work but the results are worth it. 
I have one guitar which happens to be a Squier Custom Telecaster fitted with P90s which I bought for £120.00 and I can say that is the finest guitar I've ever owned when it comes to action and payability and I own genuine Fender Telecasters and Gretsch Electromatics right now so I don't own just cheap guitars.
My Squier Custom Tele is without doubt my goto guitar and I've got it set up absolutely perfect for me. I spent a good bit of time doing it properly but it's been well worth it and it's one guitar I will never part with.

A well set up guitar is worth far more to the owner in playability than owning a not so well set up expensive guitar.