Teaching kids guitar help guitar teachers

Barney

I have been teaching now for years mainly older people ...but I'm getting increasing enquiries for teaching kids .. sort of 5 upwards ... just wondering iff anybody has reccomendations of books to take them through ..to keep interested ...I don't think they would be interested in modes just yet  

Also on teaching grown ups ..how many teach to a curriculum as in RGT ECT 

DrCornelius

I used to teach young people although age wise more like between 9 and 15.  I used Garageband a lot.  I would find out what music they liked and worked with them to create an approximation of that style whilst teaching them the basics of chords , scales etc (very basic though).  It meant they could go home after a few weeks with an mp3 of music they had helped create (maybe a bass part that was looped, a couple of guitar chords and a riff) and that always seemed to enthuse them so they wanted to learn more.

Multi

I used to teach 5 to 10 year olds.  Started them with open tuning, (G) had them playing Puff the Magic Dragon in 20 minutes. First class had 5 kids in. Next week we had abut 20. Week after I had members of staff joining the group. Open tuning has much simpler chord shapes which allows them to focus on right had strumming and not having too much to think about for the left hand.

Vibetronic

I teach quite a few little ones from about 6 upwards. Tbh I've found nothing particularly good book-wise that'll keep them interested. I tend to start them on simplified versions of chords, then move onto easy songs using those followed by simple riffs. Hardest thing to do is keep their attention - found using a drum machine really helps (seeing if they can keep up! ), doing a bit of simple recording, mucking about with my guitars/effects, making different sounds etc - just have to be a bit inventive. They often don't really have an idea of what music they like at that age either, so playing them a variety of stuff, seeing what sparks their interest etc is a good one too. I've got a variety...from ones who don't practice much and are only semi-interested, through to ones who practice every day and are getting pretty good. The latter I'll probably gradually move onto the Rockschool stuff if they stay keen. Patience and giving them some leeway to muck about are probably the two most important things in my opinion 

Lestratcaster

I mostly teach adults too but have since taken on a couple of younger learners, youngest is 10. Usually I don't take on any younger as they're not big enough to hold a guitar and its normally the parent who makes the decision on what they do or listen to.

I would keep lessons 30 minutes and do single note melody stuff or 1 finger chords. Keep it engaging and fun.

TeleMaster

Teaching beginners who can barely tune their guitar without assistance in open tuning rather than standard seems completely counter intuitive to me.

DLM

Vibetronic said:

They often don't really have an idea of what music they like at that age either

That is the crux. Stuff off the TV (kid's show themes, music used in ads) can be a good starting point.

There's als0 th3 old magic, which 5till works and probably always will...

(Any other Rudy Ayoub fans here?)

So yeah, the classic beginners' riffs are so omnipresent they even work on kids: Smirk On The Wirter, Sunshine Of Yer Lurve, Day Tripper, you know the drill...

rocktron

You are probably aware of this series of books: Progressive Guitar Method for Young Beginners Books 1, 2, and 3.

Available from Amazon, and eBay:- 

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Progressive-Guitar-Method-Young-Beginners/dp/0947183221/ref=sr_1_3?crid=30B32L4ACF6WA&keywords=progressive+guitar+method+for+young+beginners+book+1&qid=1568046672&s=gateway&sprefix=progressive+beginners+guitar,aps,151&sr=8-3

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Progressive-Guitar-Method-Young-Beginners/dp/094718323X/ref=sr_1_4?crid=30B32L4ACF6WA&keywords=progressive+guitar+method+for+young+beginners+book+1&qid=1568047119&s=gateway&sprefix=progressive+beginners+guitar,aps,151&sr=8-4

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Progressive-Guitar-Young-Beginners-Book/dp/0947183248/ref=sr_1_7?crid=30B32L4ACF6WA&keywords=progressive+guitar+method+for+young+beginners+book+1&qid=1568047178&s=gateway&sprefix=progressive+beginners+guitar,aps,151&sr=8-7

simonhpieman

I used to teach a group of primary students and I've taught a few under 11s privately.

I've come to the conclusion that I don't like it very much. I also did non-musical teaching with some primary students and hate it. Their dependency, lack of question-asking... I think I just don't get on with young kids.

Teenagers can also be a little difficult but I like them to be engaged enough to ask questions and be involved.

The main issue I find with all my students, mostly teenagers at the moment, is getting them to tell me what music they would like to learn to play. It seems they just don't view music in a way that inspires them to want to learn to play it. They certainly don't come across as thinking any particular guitarists are cool or idols in their eyes.

Lestratcaster

simonhpieman said:

I used to teach a group of primary students and I've taught a few under 11s privately.

I've come to the conclusion that I don't like it very much. I also did non-musical teaching with some primary students and hate it. Their dependency, lack of question-asking... I think I just don't get on with young kids.

Teenagers can also be a little difficult but I like them to be engaged enough to ask questions and be involved.

The main issue I find with all my students, mostly teenagers at the moment, is getting them to tell me what music they would like to learn to play. It seems they just don't view music in a way that inspires them to want to learn to play it. They certainly don't come across as thinking any particular guitarists are cool or idols in their eyes.

I haven't worked in a school environment, but the kids I have taught tend to get on with it whereas adult learners are more self-conscious and critical of themselves. Maybe cos the kids are more used to a learning environment whereas adults don't study anymore? 

But yes the younger ones don't tend to know what they like and can't really name any songs/artists!

57Deluxe

I did say I wouldn't take younger than 12, but as I have needed to keep my turnover up, I have had to relent and take a further two 8 year olds on again. However, Issues are: Firstly, parents have often already got them atotally inappropriate guitar or not want to spend more than £20 for one off Amazon/charity shop and secondly, the kids themselves nearly always don't really want to learn past the idea of doing so.

So with these two obstacles the chances of progress is minimal and the amount of effort required to motivate and engage them each week grows exponentially so that they become uneconomic time-wise.

Vibetronic

DLM said:

Vibetronic said:

They often don't really have an idea of what music they like at that age either

That is the crux. Stuff off the TV (kid's show themes, music used in ads) can be a good starting point.

yep - I always ask what they like to watch when we first meet up  

57Deluxe said:

I did say I wouldn't take younger than 12, but as I have needed to keep my turnover up, I have had to relent and take a further two 8 year olds on again. However, Issues are: Firstly, parents have often already got them atotally inappropriate guitar or not want to spend more than £20 for one off Amazon/charity shop and secondly, the kids themselves nearly always don't really want to learn past the idea of doing so.

So with these two obstacles the chances of progress is minimal and the amount of effort required to motivate and engage them each week grows exponentially so that they become uneconomic time-wise.

Can sympathise with that. Kids I teach are split into two groups...the ones who actually want to learn, and the ones whose parents thought it was a good idea and would be 'fun'. Luckily two of the latter have just dropped out (and I was about to tell their parents it was a complete waste of time anyway). They were also really badly behaved, and although it could be funny sometimes, I'm glad to be shot of them. The ones who do want to learn are fantastic though and I find it really rewarding, I get the same buzz out of it as I do playing a really good gig. 

DLM

Adult learners also often forget that "you gotta know how it goes before you can play it"![1] (More commonly known as "if you can sing it, you can play it".) If a child doesn't know how any music goes before the lesson, that's gonna be a hard slog. 

[1] "Teach me some jazz, man!" "Do you listen to any jazz?" "No." "...."

Barney

Thanks for the replies everybody ...I maybe just set a minimum age 

Barney

DLM said:

Adult learners also often forget that "you gotta know how it goes before you can play it"![1] (More commonly known as "if you can sing it, you can play it".) If a child doesn't know how any music goes before the lesson, that's gonna be a hard slog. 

[1] "Teach me some jazz, man!" "Do you listen to any jazz?" "No." "...."

It would go something like this

Do you like Gullivors travels.....this is one called giant steps

AlexHunter

Best possible thing you can do before they even get into the room is send them for some laps to expend some energy and let them sit down still for more than 10 minutes.

send them for a few runs round the car park or driveway.

Lestratcaster

57Deluxe said:

I did say I wouldn't take younger than 12, but as I have needed to keep my turnover up, I have had to relent and take a further two 8 year olds on again. However, Issues are: Firstly, parents have often already got them atotally inappropriate guitar or not want to spend more than £20 for one off Amazon/charity shop and secondly, the kids themselves nearly always don't really want to learn past the idea of doing so.

So with these two obstacles the chances of progress is minimal and the amount of effort required to motivate and engage them each week grows exponentially so that they become uneconomic time-wise.

Yep. The 10 year old I recently took on had a classical nylon strung guitar (typical for young kids coming to me) and I suggested for them to get a good steel string one, sending several links to affordable (less than £200) models. But no, they ignored them all and bought a rubbish cheap one that sounds terrible. The kid deserves better than that and it will cause them issues further down the line.

DLM

An excellent violin teacher of my acquaintance reckons the secret to her success is making sure her students get good-sounding instruments. She accompanies students to luthiers' shops and advises. 

Vibetronic

Lestratcaster said:

57Deluxe said:

I did say I wouldn't take younger than 12, but as I have needed to keep my turnover up, I have had to relent and take a further two 8 year olds on again. However, Issues are: Firstly, parents have often already got them atotally inappropriate guitar or not want to spend more than £20 for one off Amazon/charity shop and secondly, the kids themselves nearly always don't really want to learn past the idea of doing so.

So with these two obstacles the chances of progress is minimal and the amount of effort required to motivate and engage them each week grows exponentially so that they become uneconomic time-wise.

Yep. The 10 year old I recently took on had a classical nylon strung guitar (typical for young kids coming to me) and I suggested for them to get a good steel string one, sending several links to affordable (less than £200) models. But no, they ignored them all and bought a rubbish cheap one that sounds terrible. The kid deserves better than that and it will cause them issues further down the line.

God I've had that so many times. One I even advised NOT to get xxx brand. So of course they actually went out and got the very brand I'd advised against. Genius.

Lestratcaster

Vibetronic said:

Lestratcaster said:

57Deluxe said:

I did say I wouldn't take younger than 12, but as I have needed to keep my turnover up, I have had to relent and take a further two 8 year olds on again. However, Issues are: Firstly, parents have often already got them atotally inappropriate guitar or not want to spend more than £20 for one off Amazon/charity shop and secondly, the kids themselves nearly always don't really want to learn past the idea of doing so.

So with these two obstacles the chances of progress is minimal and the amount of effort required to motivate and engage them each week grows exponentially so that they become uneconomic time-wise.

Yep. The 10 year old I recently took on had a classical nylon strung guitar (typical for young kids coming to me) and I suggested for them to get a good steel string one, sending several links to affordable (less than £200) models. But no, they ignored them all and bought a rubbish cheap one that sounds terrible. The kid deserves better than that and it will cause them issues further down the line.

God I've had that so many times. One I even advised NOT to get xxx brand. So of course they actually went out and got the very brand I'd advised against. Genius.

Don't get me wrong, its better than what they had before but to actually go against my recommendation to try to save money and get a cheaper crap one pisses me off. I would have thought around £180 is doable.
I always try to advise them to spend a bit more if possible though for a decent one.

Marshall

Vibetronic said:

I teach quite a few little ones from about 6 upwards. Tbh I've found nothing particularly good book-wise that'll keep them interested. I tend to start them on simplified versions of chords, then move onto easy songs using those followed by simple riffs. Hardest thing to do is keep their attention - found using a drum machine really helps (seeing if they can keep up! ), doing a bit of simple recording, mucking about with my guitars/effects, making different sounds etc - just have to be a bit inventive. They often don't really have an idea of what music they like at that age either, so playing them a variety of stuff, seeing what sparks their interest etc is a good one too. I've got a variety...from ones who don't practice much and are only semi-interested, through to ones who practice every day and are getting pretty good. The latter I'll probably gradually move onto the Rockschool stuff if they stay keen. Patience and giving them some leeway to muck about are probably the two most important things in my opinion 

What drum machine/setup are you using?