Current state of noise gates?

WiresDreamDisasters

Are you sure you're connecting it up properly?

tekbow

WiresDreamDisasters said:

Are you sure you're connecting it up properly?

Very, the other ways didn't pass sound and I had the manuals in front of me.

I mean, they worked in the sense that they triggered when I played and they were switched on.

But they introduced a whole bunch of extra noise on top of what was there.

WiresDreamDisasters

Something definitely fishing going on here. It's not tricky to get a 4cm thing going with a capable noise gate. Maybe a valve or cable issue.

tekbow

WiresDreamDisasters said:

Something definitely fishing going on here. It's not tricky to get a 4cm thing going with a capable noise gate. Maybe a valve or cable issue.

Ah, forgot to say, I also changed appropriate tubes (the loop buffer, and the switchable gain stage tube) for multiple other low noise tested tubes, both NOS and current production.

Plus swapped the cables out for a fresh set.

Same issue.

I'm stumped.

WiresDreamDisasters

Hmmm.. That's a puzzler.

Feedback is as the name suggests - a signal being fed back into itself. Maybe double check that kind of stuff.

tekbow

I should also mention that the loops in both cases have no issues with appropriate regular FX like delays.

In fact both units, if run in line in the loop without 4CM, performed as well as you could expect a gate to perform in that position I.e. nowhere near as accurately 4CM, but no squeal either.

Both amps have line level loops but AFAIK both pedals can take line level and in any case, it shouldnt cause a squeal like this.

EDIT: With the feedback, the only place that could be happening is inside the pedals. Because that's the only place the 2 circuits come close to each other. Except with the first pedal it worked both before and after I had possession of it in a line level loop.

Pfff.. time to sleep on it.

tekbow

Ok. Slept on this. The absolute last thing I can think of is that both amps were plugged into the Torpedo Reload when this was occurring, which has a variety of ground lift switches at the back.

I've no idea why ground lifts for DI outs etc might cause this, but I've been suprised before, so I'm gona push buttons anyway.

timmypix

tekbow said:

Ok. Slept on this. The absolute last thing I can think of is that both amps were plugged into the Torpedo Reload when this was occurring, which has a variety of ground lift switches at the back.

I've no idea why ground lifts for DI outs etc might cause this, but I've been suprised before, so I'm gona push buttons anyway.

I'd be interested to see how you get on. I had a similar issue running a Boss NS-2 with my Kraken, where it was introducing some kind of feedback squeal for no apparent reason. I'd bought the pedal used, so bought a new replacement and that fixed it for the most part, althought the NS-2 couldn't respond quickly enough for fast staccato riffs at high gain. I was going to look at the TC sentry next but then left the band, so it ceased to be an issue.

tekbow

timmypix said:

tekbow said:

Ok. Slept on this. The absolute last thing I can think of is that both amps were plugged into the Torpedo Reload when this was occurring, which has a variety of ground lift switches at the back.

I've no idea why ground lifts for DI outs etc might cause this, but I've been suprised before, so I'm gona push buttons anyway.

I'd be interested to see how you get on. I had a similar issue running a Boss NS-2 with my Kraken, where it was introducing some kind of feedback squeal for no apparent reason. I'd bought the pedal used, so bought a new replacement and that fixed it for the most part, althought the NS-2 couldn't respond quickly enough for fast staccato riffs at high gain. I was going to look at the TC sentry next but then left the band, so it ceased to be an issue.

No effect sadly.

I've been informed the Zuul may actually be more effective as it not having a pass through reduces the chance of bleed.

So. Time to start saving.

PolarityMan

Are you trying to get rid of hiss in the loop? Back when I used noise gates with my JVM I used to use a more aggresive one in front of the guitar to tame squeal and then a lighter one in the loop jsut to clamp down on the hiss when I wasnt playing at all.

It was never totally satisfactory thgouh as even set quite conservatively it coudl chop off delay trails and stuff like that, in the end with the JVM I used a lower gain channel and boosted it to get my main rhythm tone and that let me ditch noise gates completely.

I would say though moving to a high gain amp that isnt as noisy was (albeit an expesnive) a revelation. 

webrthomson

Bit late to the party - but for me Zuul all the way - I had decimators and they were fine if a little tone sucking - you genuinely dont know the Zuul is there at all!

I’ve got two and I swear by them now! I use both in amp loops!

That said the new hotness is the cock blocker and the Endless blockade – I’ve not tried either – if I need another gate I’ll probably get a zuul mini!

If you have any stereo pedals you can fee the Zuul from that rather than add a dedicated splitter

tekbow

PolarityMan said:

Are you trying to get rid of hiss in the loop? Back when I used noise gates with my JVM I used to use a more aggresive one in front of the guitar to tame squeal and then a lighter one in the loop jsut to clamp down on the hiss when I wasnt playing at all.

It was never totally satisfactory thgouh as even set quite conservatively it coudl chop off delay trails and stuff like that, in the end with the JVM I used a lower gain channel and boosted it to get my main rhythm tone and that let me ditch noise gates completely.

I would say though moving to a high gain amp that isnt as noisy was (albeit an expesnive) a revelation. 

Trying to not have the general background noise when high gain mode is engaged.

To be fair, the noisier amp has ridiculous amounts of gain, so it raised the noise floor quite a bit.

But I like the idea of a gate triggered by a direct clean signal, it's more or less supposed to do the job of 2 gates as you describe them.

tekbow

webrthomson said:

Bit late to the party - but for me Zuul all the way - I had decimators and they were fine if a little tone sucking - you genuinely dont know the Zuul is there at all!

I’ve got two and I swear by them now! I use both in amp loops!

That said the new hotness is the cock blocker and the Endless blockade – I’ve not tried either – if I need another gate I’ll probably get a zuul mini!

If you have any stereo pedals you can fee the Zuul from that rather than add a dedicated splitter

That's the thing, no free stereo pedals sadly.

I've got a delay actually, but it would make it unusable as a delay.

The guy that makes the endless blockade and tannhauser gate kinda turned me off a bit. He pitched it to me on one of the facebook groups and the impression I got was somewhat "what do you mean you're not interested?".

It's not that I wasn't, it's just that small run stuff coming from the states is silly money these days.

I did figure out, however that I could run a zuul in the loop of each amp, keyed off the same direct clean using a 3 way splitter. So kinda like a G-rack stereo mod.

webrthomson

tekbow said:

The guy that makes the endless blockade and tannhauser gate kinda turned me off a bit. He pitched it to me on one of the facebook groups and the impression I got was somewhat "what do you mean you're not interested?".

It's not that I wasn't, it's just that small run stuff coming from the states is silly money these days.

Yeah his rep is he's a bit of a dick, not dealt with him personally

Agree about the silly money for small batch stuff from the states, I cant remember what I paid for the Zuuls but I do remember it was pretty eye watering once the shipping and tax was added!

tekbow

Anybody tried the Lichtlaerm key and gate?