Mac question...

PC_Dave

I’m toying with the idea of getting a Mac or MacBook in order to do some recording with some friends. I’ve been trying to use Cakewalk on my PC we are using BandLab as a collaboration platform, however they all use logic, and it can be a right pain at times with exporting and importing of stems, including weird time shifts etc. 

My friend suggested a MacBook and logic, however I’m a PC guy through and through and wouldn’t know where to start - would have to be second hand, so what should I be looking for, and how much would I expect to be paying out?

Thanks in advance 

crunchman

I bought a MacBook Pro based on similar reasoning.  Hated it.

I'm now using Reaper on Windows.

JohnS37

IMac with a SSD is best bet, running Logic with the RAM maxed out.  Doesn’t need to be the latest, anything after 2011 will do it.

guitarmangler

Do you know anyone in higher education/teacher etc? If it’s a new Mac get it from http://www.theedustore.co.uk/ who offer big discounts on computers. Cheapest bang for buck would be get one of the new M1 macs, the mini in particular if you’ve got a monitor etc. Mac mini is under £600.
You’ll need to budget for logic as well. 

Danny1969

About £400 will get you a good 13" Retina, like an A1502.
I would avoid any early Touchbar models ... basically anything after about 2016. There are issues with screens, keyboards, USB MUX chips and they generally go wrong very easily. 
Logic Pro is about £200 now I think

iMacs are great but the slimmer models are a pain to fix if the hardrive has any issues as the whole LCD has to be debonded from the frame to get to it. 

You could just get an old iMac for £150 ish and a £30 Mbox and you would have a Protools LE system for less than £200. That's all I use. 

Danny1969

Or run Reaper on an older iMac

PC_Dave

Great information, thank you gents

Brio

Mac Mini for the win.

TeleMaster

Macs are awesome for recording. Logic is excellent. 

grungebob

Do you need logic though, GarageBand works well enough. 

hassleham

I run a 2012 macbook pro with upgraded SSD and maxed out RAM (16GB). It's getting a bit senile now with the odd issue here and there but it's had a pretty tough life since I got it in 2013! Generally it runs well and still handles big recording sessions and Final Cut Pro edits.

You can pick 2012 models up for around £300-400 nowadays and the upgrades would cost you around £200 in parts if you did them yourself (easy to follow guides online). You might even find one that's already upgraded for a good price.


Logic is fantastic and a massive step up from Garageband IMO.

goldtop

If it was feasible to share GB projects over iCloud, with multiple users syncing tracks, it'd be a phenomenal lockdown collaboration tool.

As to the OP's question: I never had a PC that was fast enough and with Win-drivers reliable enough to get very far with problem-free recording. (Others manage perfectly fine, so YMMV). In contrast, recording on Mac (2008 model even!) has been glitch-free.

If you are anywhere near Cambridge and want to try a 2012 i7 iMac (which I'll be wiping in order to sell), let me know.

I'm just moving everything over to a new M1 Macbook Air + external monitor.

PC_Dave

What are we thinking in terms of RAMalama ding dong? My PC has 64Gb Ram with an overclocked i7 9700k, so there isn't much it can't do (apart from run Logic)

Are the newer MacBooks and Mac Mini's needed so much Ram?

goldtop

Blimey! You rendering 8K files in Blender?

Danny1969

hassleham said:

I run a 2012 macbook pro with upgraded SSD and maxed out RAM (16GB). It's getting a bit senile now with the odd issue here and there but it's had a pretty tough life since I got it in 2013! Generally it runs well and still handles big recording sessions and Final Cut Pro edits.

You can pick 2012 models up for around £300-400 nowadays and the upgrades would cost you around £200 in parts if you did them yourself (easy to follow guides online). You might even find one that's already upgraded for a good price.


Logic is fantastic and a massive step up from Garageband IMO.

Good advice in general. 
2012 was the point the MB Pro evolved into the retina redesign, so some 2012 models are the older unibody type with 2 ram slots and take a standard 2.5" SATA drive (some have a retina LCD but still a Unibody model)  but some 2012 models will be the full on newer Retina design with soldered on non upgradable 8 or 16Gb ram and what looks like a PCIE hardrive but it's actually a proprietary Apple design, the slot config is different so can only be swapped to either a special aftermarket type or another larger 512 nicked out another MB pro. 
From 2012 to 2016 ish the 15 " A1398 or the 13" A1502 are the best machines Apple made and I still prefer using the A1398 to any other laptop ...  and working repairs for a shop means I have used just about every laptop. I have 5 Macbook Pro's from the original 2006 to the 2017 Touchbar 

Any machine, Windows or Mac once setup right is fine for audio but in general OSX handles midi devices and core audio in a seamless manner that's easy to get on with. 

I think for the last 12 months working on projects remotely has been the only way forward but I just use We transfer. I basically make a session, record my parts, send it to the keys player and he records his part and send me the stems via Wetransfer then it goes to a session drummer who does the same. Then vocals are added in a remote booth so I can produce them and then the whole session is cleaned up and goes to a professional mix engineer via Wetransfer. Our whole album was done like this and there wasn't any problems despite 3 of us working on Protools and 3 of us working in logic. 

24 bit Audio is audio once the sample rate is agreed on , if you consolidate the tracks so they start at the beginning of the session even if there's no audio on them till later then they can be imported into any DAW ...it really isn't an issue. 

andy_k

Danny1969 said:

hassleham said:

I run a 2012 macbook pro with upgraded SSD and maxed out RAM (16GB). It's getting a bit senile now with the odd issue here and there but it's had a pretty tough life since I got it in 2013! Generally it runs well and still handles big recording sessions and Final Cut Pro edits.

You can pick 2012 models up for around £300-400 nowadays and the upgrades would cost you around £200 in parts if you did them yourself (easy to follow guides online). You might even find one that's already upgraded for a good price.


Logic is fantastic and a massive step up from Garageband IMO.

Good advice in general. 
2012 was the point the MB Pro evolved into the retina redesign, so some 2012 models are the older unibody type with 2 ram slots and take a standard 2.5" SATA drive (some have a retina LCD but still a Unibody model)  but some 2012 models will be the full on newer Retina design with soldered on non upgradable 8 or 16Gb ram and what looks like a PCIE hardrive but it's actually a proprietary Apple design, the slot config is different so can only be swapped to either a special aftermarket type or another larger 512 nicked out another MB pro. 
From 2012 to 2016 ish the 15 " A1398 or the 13" A1502 are the best machines Apple made and I still prefer using the A1398 to any other laptop ...  and working repairs for a shop means I have used just about every laptop. I have 5 Macbook Pro's from the original 2006 to the 2017 Touchbar 

Any machine, Windows or Mac once setup right is fine for audio but in general OSX handles midi devices and core audio in a seamless manner that's easy to get on with. 

I think for the last 12 months working on projects remotely has been the only way forward but I just use We transfer. I basically make a session, record my parts, send it to the keys player and he records his part and send me the stems via Wetransfer then it goes to a session drummer who does the same. Then vocals are added in a remote booth so I can produce them and then the whole session is cleaned up and goes to a professional mix engineer via Wetransfer. Our whole album was done like this and there wasn't any problems despite 3 of us working on Protools and 3 of us working in logic. 

24 bit Audio is audio once the sample rate is agreed on , if you consolidate the tracks so they start at the beginning of the session even if there's no audio on them till later then they can be imported into any DAW ...it really isn't an issue. 

saved for when my maxed out pre-retina 13 inch 2012 craps out, which may be soon.
More research needed, Win is a nightmare. (IMO)
thanks.

PC_Dave

goldtop said:

Blimey! You rendering 8K files in Blender?

No, run a few virtual labs

stickyfiddle

Wis for Danny on the 13" A1502. I'm praying the next MBP refresh is what the rumours say as it sounds like a proper successor for that machine. I have an early 2014 one that's starting to get a little creaky...

PC_Dave

stickyfiddle said:

Wis for Danny on the 13" A1502. I'm praying the next MBP refresh is what the rumours say as it sounds like a proper successor for that machine. I have an early 2014 one that's starting to get a little creaky...

That’s why I’m reticent to buy a used machine that’s 6/8 years old.... “starting to get a little creaky...”

 Maybe I’ll wait until the next refresh and give Reaper a try in the meantime.

stickyfiddle

PC_Dave said:

stickyfiddle said:

Wis for Danny on the 13" A1502. I'm praying the next MBP refresh is what the rumours say as it sounds like a proper successor for that machine. I have an early 2014 one that's starting to get a little creaky...

That’s why I’m reticent to buy a used machine that’s 6/8 years old.... “starting to get a little creaky...”

 Maybe I’ll wait until the next refresh and give Reaper a try in the meantime.

I'd say it depends on the spec as well. Mine was mid-tier with 8GB RAM. If you get one that was maxed out at the time and has a fresh install of MacOS it'll most likely be fine for a long time.

I'm sure the new ones will be fantastic if the rumours hold true, but they're likely 6+ months away and will cost a lot more!

Danny1969

I think the new Macbook Pro's will have a new screen tech and i think the Magsafe connector will be back. The machine will still have USB C / TB but the I think the charging will Magsafe again. USB C is just a nightmare on laptops ... the complexity of the pin out means off board PCB's with a ribbon cable are difficult to do properly and having the connector directly on the board means if you trip over your charger the most likely outcome is a broken motherboard. It's a dangerous tech as well with all kinds of cables being sold that aren't capable of handling 60 + Watts of charging power despite having a fake chip in the cable telling the charger and laptop it can. 
As I think nearly all of them will have the M chip I don't think we will see them until all the Intel ones have been sold.